Beak issue

[taxidermynerd]

I was going to tag you on a new thread. Newcomer posted she noticed a bump on her budgies beak last week and then .... well, if you would please go look at this thread. She doesn't know if an injury happened but the beak is in pretty bad shape right now. I'm wondering if this could be some sort of cancer that started on the beak and progressed quickly. I can't remember if Chirp had a growth/bump on his beak ( not cere) before all this started.

Urgent - Bleeding Beak

Hi, hopefully someone here can help a little. I have a parakeet that has this ball-like thing on her beak. I noticed it a few days ago but couldn’t do too much at the time. Now a couple days have passed and it has started to bleed excessively. I have another parakeet in the same cage and was...

forums.avianavenue.com

With Chirp it started as beak bruising stemming from liver problems, then the mass inside his beak appeared.

 

[Monica]

My, that is quite the big ol' yawn! 'Bout how I'm feeling at the moment! (tired after work and running pup)

Keeping you two in my thoughts!

 

[Clueless]

Today we saw the vet.

Unfortunately, she says it is behaving much like a tumor. If it were bacterial or fungal, the medication would have done something, or we would have seen some sort of change. As she was checking his beak, a little bit of the mass came off, so she had to pack some of the yunnan baiyao on there. It's just so fragile since he finished the last round of clavamox.

So we're putting him on Clavamox for life, at this point. His mass in his beak seems to be much better on it vs off of it. We also had the quality of life talk- We agree that he still has a great quality of life. He's still happy, comfortable, and pain-free as far as I can tell. And we will support him as long as that quality is there.

She sent me home with 2 bottles of Clavamox. One already mixed, and after 2 weeks I will mix the 2nd one. She will see us back in 4 weeks, she is hopeful that we can back off on the frequency of the appointments.

I'm trying to stay optimistic. Just because it's probably a tumor, it doesn't necessarily mean it's cancer, right?

Chirp says thank you for all the kind thoughts.

He's a cage flower! Looks like he really enjoyed modeling for the camera. Bea, someone on AA works for a vets office & owns an Ekkie. I believe... the answer to the question is yes, it can go either way regarding cancer. I believe @Clueless would remember the person's id. I known Mary & Sarah know them, I just cannot remember who it is...

Don't let this become consuming & maybe someone here will know that person's id.

I wonder if you're thinking of @Milo

@taxidermynerd I've tagged her. Maybe she can give you some information.

 

[Mockinbirdiva]

Wishing Chirp all the best. He's my absolute favorite in color with budgies. You've earned a Hero badge for your dedication in caring for him!

 

[Milo]

Yeah that's me....

I skimmed the posts... If a biopsy hasn't been sent in for histopath that's the best next step to specifically identify what's going on with the beak. A culture would also be a good idea to see what might be growing in there, the histopath can tell you if there are any sort of fungal elements going on. Unfortunately the only beak things I've seen get this ugly in budgies have been cancer There are radiation options available for beak neoplasia if that's a route you're considering. Given the circumstances I think if your vet is uncertain then talking with a specialist would be a next step to talk about a referral for diagnostics (if your vet isn't comfortable getting the biopsy) +/- treatment

It's a tough situation for sure but you do have options if answers would help you

 

[taxidermynerd]

Yeah that's me....

I skimmed the posts... If a biopsy hasn't been sent in for histopath that's the best next step to specifically identify what's going on with the beak. A culture would also be a good idea to see what might be growing in there, the histopath can tell you if there are any sort of fungal elements going on. Unfortunately the only beak things I've seen get this ugly in budgies have been cancer There are radiation options available for beak neoplasia if that's a route you're considering. Given the circumstances I think if your vet is uncertain then talking with a specialist would be a next step to talk about a referral for diagnostics (if your vet isn't comfortable getting the biopsy) +/- treatment

It's a tough situation for sure but you do have options if answers would help you

Unfortunately Chirp is too small and weak for anesthesia or surgery. The mass sometimes bleeds just from touching it.

My vet and I have discussed it at length and we both think that Chirp would likely not survive going under and having surgery. And if he were to survive a surgery, his quality of life would likely be greatly diminished (recovery time would be very rough on him). She's talked with several colleagues (some at University of Illinois Chicago, some out in California) and they've all come to the same consensus.

I'm sorry if I seem like I'm being a bit short with everyone. I'm just handling a lot emotionally right now. This is extremely upsetting and difficult to talk about. It's heartbreaking.

 

[Monica]

Bee, you have been nothing short of amazing! Please don't forget that! It's perfectly fine to break down if you need to and just let out all the steam, worry and guilt, but in the end, we all still have your back! And Chirp's, too!


I'm still struggling with Beau, one of the foster tiels.... He needs bloodwork, but vet says he's too weak to get bloodwork... and I can't get him stronger... we've tried meds, we've tried supplements and he just more or less remains the same... whether he's sick or not, he's the same. If you were to look at him, he'd appear healthy! But then you watch and see that he stumbles while walking, he often prefers to sit on the cage floor (but he's not sitting down there like he's sick...), he's more lethargic than usual (aka sleeps more....) but he remains bright eyed, active (when he's active) and somewhat vocal... not usually singing but he does chirp.

It doesn't help that the latest vet I've been taking him to is out of state 2 hours away and they want to do more testing on him (and Bibi) but it requires dropping them off in the middle of the week.... and then picking them back up over the weekend. I need to give them another call as they were supposed to call me back and I haven't heard anything...

It's painful as *THIS* is a SECOND opinion for Beau... and Bibi! Actually, they've now seen 3 different vets at 2 different practices...

 

[taxidermynerd]

I just spent a solid 10 minutes weeping over Chirp's cage while he stared at me in confusion ("what are you doing, lady? I wanna go back to bed!").

Love your birds for me, guys. Give them scritches and tell them they're from me.

 

[CeciliaZ]

I am so sorry you are going through this...you have done so much for Chirp.

 

[Clueless]

I just spent a solid 10 minutes weeping over Chirp's cage while he stared at me in confusion ("what are you doing, lady? I wanna go back to bed!").

Love your birds for me, guys. Give them scritches and tell them they're from me.

I get it. I totally understand what those going through. I was there with MC. I think it's worse when you SEE the "thing" that they live with.

Maybe I'm wrong but MC seemed to absorb my emotions. After you gave me the advice to get out and away..... it helped me to breathe. I think it helped him. I know it's so hard to do this walk but they KNOW that we care.

 

[taxidermynerd]

I get it. I totally understand what those going through. I was there with MC. I think it's worse when you SEE the "thing" that they live with.

Maybe I'm wrong but MC seemed to absorb my emotions. After you gave me the advice to get out and away..... it helped me to breathe. I think it helped him. I know it's so hard to do this walk but they KNOW that we care.

It's to the point where I don't even remember what a normal Budgie beak looks like. I just know that Chirp's beak is how it is, and we will both adapt to help him out. If I think too much about it (like the word cancer) I lose hope and I break. The word "tumor" feels like it leaves room for hope. The word "cancer" feels like it saps all the air from my lungs and replaces it with water.

I'm trying to remember... The vet said "tumor". She hasn't said "cancer"... yet.

 

[Clueless]

There are MANY types of cancer though. Fast, slow, and TREATABLE types (radiation, etc.) so try not to get hung up on that word.

Find a positive song or thought and when the bad thoughts come in, replace them immediately with the good thought. That's vital.

I read a thread that @Lady Jane posted about a wild bird her daughter saw that was blind. They carry on in the wild despite their health, all alone. Chirp has a wonderful asset on his side....you.

 

[enigma731]

It's to the point where I don't even remember what a normal Budgie beak looks like. I just know that Chirp's beak is how it is, and we will both adapt to help him out. If I think too much about it (like the word cancer) I lose hope and I break. The word "tumor" feels like it leaves room for hope. The word "cancer" feels like it saps all the air from my lungs and replaces it with water.

I'm trying to remember... The vet said "tumor". She hasn't said "cancer"... yet.

Regardless of what any source might say is likely, you don't know it's cancer without a biopsy. So I'd just stick to what you do know if you can: So far he's doing well with whatever it is, and you are doing all you can to help that continue.

 

[Milo]

Unfortunately Chirp is too small and weak for anesthesia or surgery. The mass sometimes bleeds just from touching it.

My vet and I have discussed it at length and we both think that Chirp would likely not survive going under and having surgery. And if he were to survive a surgery, his quality of life would likely be greatly diminished (recovery time would be very rough on him). She's talked with several colleagues (some at University of Illinois Chicago, some out in California) and they've all come to the same consensus.

I'm sorry if I seem like I'm being a bit short with everyone. I'm just handling a lot emotionally right now. This is extremely upsetting and difficult to talk about. It's heartbreaking.

That's totally fair and only an assessment that you can make. What you're going through sucks, a lot. But what you can focus on is making Chirp comfortable and giving him the best with the time that you have. It's great that he doesn't seem to be in pain and can get food down, as difficult as it is, try to focus on that.

If you're able to, I would also recommend seeing a counselor. Not that anything you're experiencing is abnormal... I firmly believe that everyone should talk to someone, and grief is a particularly tricky a-hole to deal with and having an objective party there to help guide you through it can be beneficial.

 

[Clueless]

What you're going through sucks, a lot.

If you're able to, I would also recommend seeing a counselor. Not that anything you're experiencing is abnormal... I firmly believe that everyone should talk to someone, and grief is a particularly tricky a-hole to deal with and having an objective party there to help guide you through it can be beneficial.

I should have said that.

I'm in the search now for a counselor. Sometimes it takes a few appointments to get someone you "click" with.

 

[Rain Bow]

@Milo

That's it! Thanks Miss. Laurie!!!!!

& @Clueless

 

[taxidermynerd]

Chirp sustained an ouchie to his head. At first, I thought it was from him rubbing his head on a perch particularly rough (he's going through a bad molt right now). But if you look at the area where the top part of his nares should be, it looks like a very similar texture to the mass inside his beak... I can't bring myself to type what I'm thinking.

We're calling the vet tomorrow. I'm so scared. I hope my initial thought was right (just an ouchie) vs what it could be...

 

[taxidermynerd]

I've just noticed that his tail seems to be bobbing a bit and he has been sneezing more recently... Oh god...

 

[Peachfaced]

Goodness, Bee. Big hugs to you (and gentle hugs) for Chirp.

 

[Shezbug]

I am sorry that you both are going through this awful health issue Bee, my thoughts are with you both.