Black Cockatoo @ The Local Pet Store

[LaSelva]

In my original post yes, I used the term "imprison." I don't know if anyone should find that term offensive because parrots are considered captive wildlife. And...

cap·tiv·i·ty
kapˈtivədē/
noun

1. the condition of being imprisoned or confined.
   "he was released after 865 days in captivity"

 

[jmfleish]

In my original post yes, I used the term "imprison." I don't know if anyone should find that term offensive because parrots are considered captive wildlife. And...

cap·tiv·i·ty
kapˈtivədē/
noun

1. the condition of being imprisoned or confined.
   "he was released after 865 days in captivity"

Most of us have domestically bred parrots and importation of wild parrots into the US has been illegal since 1992. I know that this does not make parrots "domestic", but it certainly does render them insufficient for life in the wild. Some species actually are now considered domestic such as the budgie and Cockatiel. I think every single one of us thinks daily about how our birds feel. How could we not? Right now, I have two mated RB2s chewing up the wood work in my bird room because I'm too worried to chase them into their cage after my D2 let them out. They are quite content to sit on the top of their house and have a conversation with me but not go back in. I could force them in but I don't want to lose what little trust I have with them.

 

[LaSelva]

"As for questioning if I ever care about how the bird feels? Another low blow. "

I never did this.

There's a line in one of my posts that I think you may have misconstrued. The one where I'm agreeing with Tyrion that, regardless of terminology, what's most important is the underlying feelings a person has towards the animal. But that terminology does although paint a picture (to those listening, such as newbies) that can set the stage for how that animal will be perceived. It's possible that in a very indirect way you took this to be about yourself. It was simply to illustrate the impression that proper terminology can leave on someone and that it may not be accurately representative of how the animal sees the situation. In other words, engendering misunderstanding that is, by definition, detrimental to the birds welfare.

 

[jmfleish]

"As for questioning if I ever care about how the bird feels? Another low blow. "

I never did this.

There's a line in one of my posts that I think you may have misconstrued. The one where I'm agreeing with Tyrion that, regardless of terminology, what's most important is the underlying feelings a person has towards the animal. But that terminology does although paint a picture (to those listening, such as newbies) that can set the stage for how that animal will be perceived. It's possible that in a very indirect way you took this to be about yourself. It was simply to illustrate the impression that proper terminology can leave on someone and that it may not be accurately representative of how the animal sees the situation. In other words, engendering misunderstanding that is, by definition, detrimental to the birds welfare.

WHAT?!?!?!??!? That's complete and total mumble jumble to me! I might be on too many pain pills right now but what you just typed makes no sense at all! Who cares what we call them? Pets, companions, best friends....blah, blah, blah, blah, blah....how does that change how we care for them? And once again, why do you never share anything positive about how you care for your birds or stories about your life with your birds? It's always negative stuff about keeping birds in general. That's really not why we are here.

 

[alshgs]

He is beautiful!

 

[Tyrion]

WHAT?!?!?!??!? That's complete and total mumble jumble to me! I might be on too many pain pills right now but what you just typed makes no sense at all! Who cares what we call them? Pets, companions, best friends....blah, blah, blah, blah, blah....how does that change how we care for them? And once again, why do you never share anything positive about how you care for your birds or stories about your life with your birds? It's always negative stuff about keeping birds in general. That's really not why we are here.

I think though I may be wrong again ...how we see them does change how we care for them ..some people see their birds as property and care for them as such vs someone who sees their birds as companions and care for them as such ..the person who may seem them as property may not care for them with the thought that they have feelings and thoughts where the person who sees them as companions will ...but the bird on the other hand still has yet a different prospective on the whole situation ..like I said above ...having a companion wolfdog is different then having a pet wolfdog I expect less from the pet wolfdog then the companion ..even though I dont love them any less ...I dont know I may have missed the point

 

[jmfleish]

I think though I may be wrong again ...how we see them does change how we care for them ..some people see their birds as property and care for them as such vs someone who sees their birds as companions and care for them as such ..the person who may seem them as property may not care for them with the thought that they have feelings and thoughts where the person who sees them as companions will ...but the bird on the other hand still has yet a different prospective on the whole situation ..like I said above ...having a companion wolfdog is different then having a pet wolfdog I expect less from the pet wolfdog then the companion ..even though I dont love them any less ...I dont know I may have missed the point

No, I think you are on the right track and to a certain extent, the way you word things does matter. I think we are all here for the betterment of our birds though, no matter what we call them. I think I'm too drugged up to have this conversation!

 

[aooratrix]

So it's never about how the bird might feel?

Sure you did. This implies that I don't care about how my birds might feel; it was your response to one of my replies. I don't need another copy/paste , especially a definition. But thanks! You can't argue using the pejorative connotation of one word and then say it doesn't matter for another. Imp is on definitely suggests that I'm incarcerating my birds, as are we all. My birds are all domestic. They have no experience with life in the wild. They are, as are all COMPANION animals, adapting to lives with people.

Let's not argue semantics and subtexts. I'm honestly asking you to share any tips you have on enriching the lives of our parrots. How are your cages or enclosures set up? What do you do for foraging? How do you deal with your BTM's mechanical proclivity? What do feed? I'm willing to learn from anybody. Add to this community in a manner that we bird owners can apprehend. Looking forward to your tips.

 

[aooratrix]

I think though I may be wrong again ...how we see them does change how we care for them ..some people see their birds as property and care for them as such vs someone who sees their birds as companions and care for them as such ..the person who may seem them as property may not care for them with the thought that they have feelings and thoughts where the person who sees them as companions will ...but the bird on the other hand still has yet a different prospective on the whole situation ..like I said above ...having a companion wolfdog is different then having a pet wolfdog I expect less from the pet wolfdog then the companion ..even though I dont love them any less ...I dont know I may have missed the point

I agree that terms/words matter and that the language we use informs our mindset and our interactions. But I don't think that calling my bird a companion is an attempt on my part, or anyone's, to dismiss my birds' feelings or roles in my life. Good thoughts!

 

[LaSelva]

So it's never about how the bird might feel?

This was a rhetorical question, a response to a post in which you are telling me how you feel and asking me how I feel but leaving leaving out the birds perspective.

 

[LaSelva]

Therefore the implication that you don't care how your bird feels was yours not mine.

 

[LaSelva]

But you are angry because I used the word "imprison" and I've already proven that it is not an offensive word to use as it defines a captive animal - like it or not. Parrots live with humans because they were captured and in the eyes of the law they are commodities.

 

[jmfleish]

But you are angry because I used the word "imprison" and I've already proven that it is not an offensive word to use as it defines a captive animal - like it or not. Parrots live with humans because they were captured and in the eyes of the law they are commodities.

Technically, most of the parrots we live with today were not captured...they were bred in captivity. Just sayin'....

 

[LaSelva]

And, technically, I didn't say that the ones in our homes we're captured from the wild (although as you know they are still genetically wild). Parrots as a group share their lives with humans because they were captured....fact.

 

[LaSelva]

... and they are bred and sold and traded as the human sees fit.

 

[❤ Rosette ❤]

Sorry to butt in, I don't want any trouble, however...
Words can have the same meaning and negative/positive connotations, so they are used separately for different effects.

Let's take the words slender and bony. Their meanings are, essentially the same. But saying: "She's quite a slender young woman," is far more of a compliment than saying "She's quite a bony young woman." They both mean skinny, but the feelings associated with the different words have an immense effect on the sentence. The latter is more of an insult than anything.

Which is why the word "captive" might be taken in a way that you did not intend for it to be.​

 

[jmfleish]

And, technically, I didn't say that the ones in our homes we're captured from the wild (although as you know they are still genetically wild). Parrots as a group share their lives with humans because they were captured....fact.

As are all animals...should we not use animals in our lives in any capacity?

 

[LaSelva]

Sorry to butt in, I don't want any trouble, however...
Words can have the same meaning and negative/positive connotations, so they are used separately for different effects.

Let's take the words slender and bony. Their meanings are, essentially the same. But saying: "She's quite a slender young woman," is far more of a compliment than saying "She's quite a bony young woman." They both mean skinny, but the feelings associated with the different words have an immense effect on the sentence. The latter is more of an insult than anything.

Which is why the word "captive" might be taken in a way that you did not intend for it to be.​

It seems to me that to some people on this forum it's okay to have parrots in captivity but if you say that parrots are "captive" they get offended.

 

[jmfleish]

It seems to me that to some people on this forum it's okay to have parrots in captivity but if you say that parrots are "captive" they get offended.

Nah, I just have a problem with jailed! My Amazon, Amarillo got out a couple of summers ago...she was out for 24 hours. Scared the crap out of me and her. She found her own way home because she heard the other birds making their daily noises through the windows and came back to our backyard all on her own. Her biggest problem was she couldn't fly down...she kept going higher and higher. My significant other, who isn't all that involved with the birds, had to climb 40 feet up into a tree to get her. She came right up to him, stepped up onto his hand, got off, then got back on and then he put her in a pillow case so he could get her down safely. When we finally got her back inside she seemed pretty darn happy to be home.

She will be 17 years old this October and has been with me since August of 2011. For most of that time, I've never even caged her and she has free reign of the house. About two years ago, we brought home a Blue Fronted Amazon that she has now bonded with and they both hang out together every day and chew the heck out of the cardboard boxes we give them and do as they please. I cook for them and clean up after them and give them attention when they ask for it, although the BFA, Iris, prefers my s/o. That, to me, sounds like a pretty good life for a captive. I try to do the same for all my birds. I like to see them at least pair up with one other bird so they have a buddy. Most of them do have to stay in a cage or they will ruin our house or get into something they shouldn't be in. I'm hoping to have a bird room for them where we can leave more of them free to roam in the future. Most of my birds are rehomes, although I have a few who were bought directly from a breeder. I'm sorry if I don't agree with you and don't consider them captives. Call them what you will, I call them a part of my family and I'm grateful to have them.

 

[aooratrix]

This was a rhetorical question, a response to a post in which you are telling me how you feel and asking me how I feel but leaving leaving out the birds perspective.

I must've missed the rhetorical emoji