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Eclectus only please- Diet study :)

mythic55

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@Monaco

That is exactly right. I was measuring the composition of some of their favorites in the wild per season, and near to it would be a boiled butternut squash (gently steamed till tender). I also discovered a natural H1/mast cell stabilizer which can be used in conjunction with a very specific diet (far different than what many recomend). It could save lives in my opinion. Just need more data to back it up-

Females are much more high maintenance- left to defend the nest, so they are high tempered and hormonal. They rest in a cave, with nearly no sunlight, etc. Their life expectancy is quite different from the males. That is why their biological makeup is also quite different than other parrots- they process everything differently- they have different requirements, all because of unique adaptation.

Ill be wiriting all this, scientific mumbo jumbo- but also in lamens terms. People should know. I remember when people used to feed lorikeets seeds! Or cats vegetarian diets! lol. But going against the grain is not an easy task. If I can simplify it down to a basic regime that is easier to follow, it could improve the lives of many.
 

Monaco

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@Monaco

That is exactly right. I was measuring the composition of some of their favorites in the wild per season, and near to it would be a boiled butternut squash (gently steamed till tender). I also discovered a natural H1/mast cell stabilizer which can be used in conjunction with a very specific diet (far different than what many recomend). It could save lives in my opinion. Just need more data to back it up-

Females are much more high maintenance- left to defend the nest, so they are high tempered and hormonal. They rest in a cave, with nearly no sunlight, etc. Their life expectancy is quite different from the males. That is why their biological makeup is also quite different than other parrots- they process everything differently- they have different requirements, all because of unique adaptation.

Ill be wiriting all this, scientific mumbo jumbo- but also in lamens terms. People should know. I remember when people used to feed lorikeets seeds! Or cats vegetarian diets! lol. But going against the grain is not an easy task. If I can simplify it down to a basic regime that is easier to follow, it could improve the lives of many.
Wait, what!? Where have you found this cache of information? I must get my hands on it!
 

Miss Annamarie

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Yeah, people see bird of a certain size, and it goes into the "parrot" category.... Even vets.... Even avian certified vets. No one in the waiting area could even identify her.... Not the clients, the staff.
We have one in town just like that.. So glad we have an AMAZING one only an hour away, he's wonderful, so lucky...
 

mythic55

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Wait, what!? Where have you found this cache of information? I must get my hands on it!
A few years of dedicated study, finally got the publishing figured out. Where prior research fell short in my opinion is information was provided by ornithologists or aviculturists alone. But if you can apply internal data from groundbreaking human studies with a better biological study of Eclectus- that is the key. The fields of study never overlapped before, it requires a different viewpoint- not backed by big business. I started connecting the dots, saw patterns, so I made it my full time goal.

'80%' is exactly why I did this.
Its preposterous.
 

mythic55

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What I also noted was if they DO recognize it is an Eclectus- they assume the sub species (if its big its a red sided, if its small it is a solomon).
Today, especially in united states eclectus are often 'Cross-bred'. It could be important to determine the crossbreed and there have been some sub-species unique health concerns.

Fun fact: The Sydney zoo in the 1950's mixed up two subspecies.... New Guinea and Solomon. Then of course young were distributed and cross bred with many of the other 9 subspecies. And then of course there was the massive pet trade in the 80's. 'Some' Breeders have attempted to ensure they have a pure bloodline by looking at the eye rings and tail feathers, it can be difficult if not done by the trained eye.

This is fun- I can just blurt out eclectus info all day! haha
 
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Miss Annamarie

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What I also noted was if they DO recognize it is an Eclectus- they assume the sub species (if its big its a red sided, if its small it is a solomon).
Today, especially in united states eclectus are often 'Cross-bred'. It could be important to determine the crossbreed and there have been some sub-species unique health concerns.

Fun fact: The Sydney zoo in the 1950's mixed up two subspecies.... New Guinea and Solomon. Then of course young were distributed and cross bred with many of the other 9 subspecies. And then of course there was the massive pet trade in the 80's. 'Some' Breeders have attempted to ensure they have a pure bloodline by looking at the eye rings and tail feathers, it can be difficult if not done by the trained eye.

This is fun- I can just blurt out eclectus info all day! haha
Literally loving this so much
 

Les charlson

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Averaged out over a day.
Seed mix quantity 1/4 cup
Brand of seed mix - Personal mix of large parrot with safflower.
Fresh grass seed heads, seasonal. (I live on a farm)

Fresh food quantity
Fruit - 1 cup. - Passionfruit, apple peach, strawberry banana, Grapes, blueberries, cherries, pomegranates.
Vegetables- 1/2 cup. Cucumbers, Bok Choy, Brussel sprouts, Choy Sum, Pumpkin, Sweet potato. Parsley, mango.

Foot food - Corn cob, Green bean Peas in pods. Chillies, Flowers, Capsicum hearts.

Sprouted items.
type - + Mixed. Also microgreens
Quantity - 1 dessert spoon

Nuts
Type - Almonds, pine nuts, cashews, Bunya pine nuts, walnuts, peanuts, Macadamia.
Quantity - 1 or 2 a day.

Grains
Type Oats/trail/granola mix. (Plain popcorn= 2 pieces).
Quantity - Desert spoon.

Other - Egg , meat. Peanut butter toast. Lorikeet wet mix.

Current Health or behavioral concerns: Normal stats. (3/4 of year mating behaviour same as in the bush)

Notes- Gum tree flowers, Bottlebrush, sunflower heads etc are seasonal.
I divide fresh food to three times a day due to the heat here at the moment. Also I have monitored what she eats over time. The seeds are not as popular as the fresh food however it depends on the week or time of year.

Of interest - I once found her eating a mouse she had caught in her outside aviary. She was really enjoying it.

Pellets quantity - One teaspoon. (Usually not touched)
Brand of pellets Tops cold pressed.
This morning breakfast. The sunflower is for footfood/play.
FOOD187114528_2772349572859956_8590017098321756160_n.jpg
A random lunch from a few weeks ago. Taken as I was minding an Alexandrine and the owner wanted to see what he was eating. Everyone gets the same food.
food282457568_535128237094150_5871543919417753600_n.jpg
 

Les charlson

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Oh, even though Eclectus are arboreal mine will come to the ground to pick up whatever food they dropped, that they prefer. Can't show a pic of mine eating that mouse on the ground as I was too disgusted to think of taking a pic. You will have to take my word for it. :) Chickens do the same thing though.
 

Rain Bow

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Man the females really are high maintenance! I didn't realize till I read the 2nd high maintenance post from your knowledge base @mythic55 . Would location be of any benefit to you in this scenario? I realize that being indoor's our fids are not going thru as many of the hormonal situations as the would or wouldn't if directly in nature. But I love nature even small stupid spiders which I strongly dislike... A few weeks ago I noticed that the Bulbs were coming up, then groundhog day came & no surprise to me "Spring" is predicted early this year... Then I noticed 3 spiders in my basement in 1 day. Buddy has been hormonally off all winter w/ our unseasonably warm weather in NY. I think when the windows finally open he'll be extra bad this spring. Ok so my long winded example's to get to my point. Wouldn't data like location & season (for that location) possibly help for your grant? I know it's based strictly on dietary based on what I read thusfar but... Don't birds consume differently based on whether or not they are mating (like most genus & species) on our planet.
 

Les charlson

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To the quotes below. I am not an expert. Many years ago I noticed that my birds appeared to waste/not consume some food. I was worried initially. I played with the amounts, went on boards, panicked, etc. Eventually I researched Eclectus and learned the boys feed them a few times a day. The girls are wired to be alone, up to 9 months a year so keeping 2 together is not normal. The food we offer isn't normal either. I also realised they get the majority of their fluids from the boys. In captivity its not the same.

Food for thought-
When my guys regurgitate, even if they have eaten recently, it is a pale sweet, pasty mix and their feathers smell similar. Nothing like the food they ate. The girls get mush when fed by their various partners. They don't get dry pellets, their food is partially processed by the boys and its only some months they have to feed themselves. Fruit, nuts, flowers/nectar,bugs and baby leaf tips etc are part of their diet for a reason. Easy on the digestion.

2] If I gave my girl a piece of meat she will eat some of it and mash some of it depending on how how much she likes it. The part she drops looks like its dehydrated and has hardly eaten any of it. She is basically sucking the fluid out of it from what I see. Same with some other foods like fresh corn or nuts. They mangle bits of veg and drop the rest but if you look closely, they have taken what they needed. They also throw out their less favs. Pizza verses broccoli for kids.
I realised she is taking what she needs and discarding the fibrous parts because thats how their systems are geared when in their nests and being fed.

Thats why I offer Lorikeet mix, flowers and veg mash on occasion, along with fresh fruit and nuts. Mine will eat when they are hungry, not when we think they are hungry. I have trained them to expect me though. In the wild they may get the same food for weeks at a time due to the seasons. Some days nothing or little.
Since our bushfires, parrots of all sorts are coming in begging for the leftovers but only twice a day.
In captivity they get what we think they need or sometimes are offered only seed and apples so the birds don't recognise any other foods when rehomed. I just learned what they prefer to eat and provide that. I also give foot play food to get them used to new things.

Birds don't have 24 hour access to food in the wild. They work for it. Anyway these days I don't worry so much or weigh them every day.
Just my observations and every bird lover has their own views. :)

I'm very interested and curious about this as well. I have questions. Mostly one. I don't know how much of anything she actually eats. I can count nuts, but I don't know how much of her dry foods actually get consumed (or how much to offer, for that matter) or how to effectively figure it out based on what I find on the floor. Same issue if I put anything cut up in her bowl. I know she picks things out, but based on soupy leftovers or color chunks there's no accuracy about what she actually consumed. The aftermath is occasionally alarming, and I can only guess at what happens if I'm out of the room. There's also the issue of juicing. Most fruits are juiced, leaving skins and pulp.
I'm frequently concerned about quantity. So, offering a "whole" serving of every food option is the only way to deal with a picky eating day. I've actually tried separating the pellet types to figure out what she's eaten.... It's still inconclusive most days!

Anyway, I would really like to participate, but I need help to get accurate responses to you.

Are the other responses subjective, or do you have some terminology rules to follow?
@Monoco

You have brought up what has been one of the more difficult pieces to report- since there are many variables and consumption patterns are increasingly varied. So this portion is simple supporting data in an effort to obtain more quantitative information, it is very flexible as if it is too rigorous people lose interest- interestingly enough, patterns emerge. Other portions are more scientific, so this is worded loosely and based purely on 'what is provided' and loose estimates are acceptable in the case of chopped mixes or juices. If you like, you could modify for one week summary- I can have a few others do similarly and use it as an extension.

This is a fraction of the empirical data that will be collected as my hypothosis needs laboratory support (which requires a much larger grant as im technically retired, and other humans involved). The end result may mean more than a guideline, after years of study I believe I have found a link and stumbled upon a solution- long story short. I want whats best for Eclectus as they are increasing in popularity- they need more study and if there is a prevention/relief then less could end up the way they often do.
 

Monaco

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@Les charlson that describes the aftermath here too, and she tends to go in cycles for a couple of weeks at a time as far as preference goes, even though she did not have the same opportunities in her first home.

@Rain Bow I suspect that information will be helpful, especially over a wide range of birds and locations (to me, anyway!) just to note differences and similarities along various latitudes.

@mythic55 , would it be too messy to add information to the data you want in this thread?
 

mythic55

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Its too much for this.
I have answers to your questions, but I cant respond until the rest of the data comes through as is. I cant afford skewing.
The website is being built as we speak, all phases are complete but the companion bird data :)
 

Monaco

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I'm working on the typing these up, so I think I'll leave it in a.doc to save my sanity. There are distinct disadvantages to using the phone on the forum!
 

Les charlson

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Definitely still relevant. Thank you to those who have participated thus far!

Just a snapshot. It would be nearly impossible to record doen what was actually consumed, so it is what is offered daily (appropximate values). Behavior is closely connected to diet, and diet is really a determinant of behaviour.

In eclectus digestion is a key function that has previously been put under the category ‘long digestive tract’. When really statements like these have lead to further issues with eclectus diets, in turn causing health issues; low weight, feather discoloration, allergies, over supplementation and poor nutrition which leads to behavioral ; screaming, biting, wing flipping, feather plucking, and ‘freeze’ factors.

Biological review has shown that alternately it is actually:
Regulated crop emptying times
A wide thoratic esophagus
Elastic proventriculus
And rapid movement through the gizzard and small intestine

I have found significant links from the biological standpoint, and that has lead to some hypothesis regarding solutions. I have qualitative data, but need quantitative (as subjective as it may be).

Important: don’t feel as though you need to copy other people, don’t feel as if you need to make it look ‘grander’ than you actually feed. Honesty in this study has become difficult, but it is imperative. I have actually directly caught people fibbing.
In a nutshell:

Don’t write what you think you should, write what you actually do. There are no 'wrong' answers.
Thank you. I have already posted my daily food amounts . Just wanted to add that my guys won't eat out of season food so menu varies depending on what is around.
I have added pics for convenience and credibility. The fresh food bowls are medium size. The ones for seed etc are large.. The bowl below in the foreground is what I give them daily. The other is 24 hours old to show my point that they don't eat a lot of seed mix.
View attachment 328611
Also to show good faith I am including a pic of Ruby taken today. Note her light eye ring and purple feathers. She is quite large. She is disabled due to negligence and cannot be be operated on due to tendon shrinkage and human induced trauma. Her beak is a bit odd still but has improved over time. I get the vet to trim her nails and keep an eye on her. She is not in any pain these days and is bonded to me and friends with my Alexandrine. She is wet as its raining and just finishing a moult. I put her out to play/bath on her rain perch in the aviary.

ruby1 043.jpg
View attachment 328605 seed86695665_477444126267724_8984221716578304000_n.jpg
 

mythic55

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@Les charlson

She is beautiful! Obviously well taken care of as any sort of disability can cause serious behavioral issues
(like feather plucking) and her plumage looks very nice! She has the perfect 'im content' fluff going on :)
 
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