• Welcome to Avian Avenue! To view our forum with less advertisments please register with us.
    Memberships are free and it will just take a moment. Click here
  • This forum is for advice about initial treatment given to your injured/sick bird until a qualified avian veterinarian is available.
    THIS IS NOT MEANT TO REPLACE VET CARE

Urgent Concerned about my baby red front macaw

Amanda6

Walking the driveway
Joined
10/16/16
Messages
204
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Real Name
Amanda
Hello, I know everyone is going to say to take her to the vet and I plan to tomorrow, but for now I just wanted to post what is going on and see if I can get any ideas as to what is wrong. I received a 5 1/2 month old red fronted macaw a few days ago. She is still being hand fed, the previous owners said that she was taking 4 feedings a day. So far for us we have had trouble getting her to eat, she will take very small amounts of formula only once or twice a day and by small I mean 0-15 cc's. She was on formula and a seed/nut diet at her previous home. I have started giving her pellets and my dry mix in addition to her seed as well as chop and a grain bake. She only seems to be eating sunflower seeds out of her bowl and that's pretty much it. She is a bit interested in the chop but won't eat any of it. So today we tried and gave her formula, she took around 20cc's tonight and then 5 or so minutes later regurgitated or threw it up. We then tried to hand feed her the chop and pretend to eat it too and then even tried organic baby food but she still won't eat it. She is still active and likes coming out of her cage and being handled. She does make baby macaw noises the entire time she is out and does do a fair amount of head bobbing and wing flicking. I'm not so sure that the previous owners really knew what they were doing. Her wings are clipped very short and badly. She is a little clumsy and doesn't perch the best yet. Does anyone have any ideas as to what is going on with her?
 

rocky'smom

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
4/14/14
Messages
16,481
Location
minnesota
Real Name
laurie
@Amanda6
I am calling for the proper people @Hankmacaw @Macawnutz @Joey wade
I am also going ask some questions
What is her weight?
What are you using to feed her with?
Is that equipment being properly sanitized?
Have you hand feed baby birds before?
What the formula that you are using?
Are you getting formula to proper temperature ?
When she threw up was it side slinging or up and down head bobbing?

I know a lot of questions but the people I called for help will be asking them also.
JMHO make sure the vet checked AGY and does complete blood work/ gram stain/ fecal culture
 

MiniMacaw

Rollerblading along the road
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
6/29/16
Messages
1,964
Real Name
Lisa
I wish I had better advice but definitely get her to a vet first thing tomorrow. When I got my blue and gold scarlet hybrid baby he wasn't eating like I thought he should and he threw up once. Three hours later he was at the vet. His blood work showed a massive infection in his blood that I saw no other signs of than lack of interest in his food and the one time he vomited a tiny bit. It had his liver and kidney values messed up and his white blood cells sky high. He needed two antibiotics, a high calorie hand feeding supplement and high quality formula for months before he was better. It was amazing how well he did once the infection was under control. Daily weighing is super important too. It showed me when Bowser lost some weight and he needed more hand feedings even tho technically he was of an age to be weaned. I got a food scale from my local grocery store and it works great. Plus if you teach them young that it's not scary it's much easier to get their weights routinely.
I hope the best for your baby and hopefully some Mac experts can help you more than I can. Please keep us posted.
 

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,230
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
First, you have to get to the vet. Babies commonly have bacterial or fungal infections because of improperly cleaned feeding utensils and inconsistent formula temperatures.

Once you have the all clear from the vet then you can look at other things. The first thing that strikes me is 5.5 months and four feedings? I'm not sure about red front weaning times but it sounds like a lot of feeding times. I would think 2-3 at that age if not less. How many cc's per feeding?

Technique is often a issue. I would call the breeder and ask them to show you how to feed. Feed the same formula, same consistency and often a drop in a few degrees can have them quit eating. Make sure it is 105 degrees. Higher and you could burn the crop, lower and you can cause infection. What is her weight?
 

Hankmacaw

Cruising the avenue
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avenue Concierge
Joined
10/18/09
Messages
14,254
Location
Arizona
Real Name
Mary Lynn Skinner
@Macawnutz Has pretty much covered it. Babies are so prone to gettin infections and you sure don't want to let it get away from you.

@MiniMacaw rescued a young B&G and went through heck getting him straightened out from severe neglect.

Is you r vet an avian vet
 

aooratrix

Macawaholic
Super Moderator
Avenue Veteran
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
4/6/13
Messages
5,631
Real Name
Matthew
Unfortunately, she sounds sick to me. Too many feedings per day at that age for a red front. She might've been sick for a while, which kept her needing those hand feedings. And then stress made it flare up.

Are you seeing Mohan or Ogilsbie? Good luck and keep us posted. Do you know where they got the bird? I know of one breeder in Ohio, and they raise nice birds, so I'd be surprised if it came from them.
 

Amanda6

Walking the driveway
Joined
10/16/16
Messages
204
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Real Name
Amanda
@Amanda6
I am calling for the proper people @Hankmacaw @Macawnutz @Joey wade
I am also going ask some questions
What is her weight?
What are you using to feed her with?
Is that equipment being properly sanitized?
Have you hand feed baby birds before?
What the formula that you are using?
Are you getting formula to proper temperature ?
When she threw up was it side slinging or up and down head bobbing?

I know a lot of questions but the people I called for help will be asking them also.
JMHO make sure the vet checked AGY and does complete blood work/ gram stain/ fecal culture
I am using a hand feeding syringe. The syringe they gave me was disingrating so I threw out and used a better one that I had. We clean the equipment right after use and leave it out to dry. I have handfed a young macaw a couple of months back before. They were using pretty bird hand feeding formula and gave me a bag, so that is what I've been using. Have been heating formula to around 105, but she eats it so slow that it starts to cool while feeding. It was a couple of up and down head bobs and all of the formula just came pouring out.
 

rocky'smom

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
4/14/14
Messages
16,481
Location
minnesota
Real Name
laurie
ok thank you for the answers. I know you said you were going to the vet please ask if they can get you F-10 for sanitizing equipment. it's much safer then just allowing it to dry. putting your filled syringes into a cup of water at the same temp as formula will help keep it hot enough to feed. is her crop emptying by the time of the next feeding ?
 

Amanda6

Walking the driveway
Joined
10/16/16
Messages
204
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Real Name
Amanda
First, you have to get to the vet. Babies commonly have bacterial or fungal infections because of improperly cleaned feeding utensils and inconsistent formula temperatures.

Once you have the all clear from the vet then you can look at other things. The first thing that strikes me is 5.5 months and four feedings? I'm not sure about red front weaning times but it sounds like a lot of feeding times. I would think 2-3 at that age if not less. How many cc's per feeding?

Technique is often a issue. I would call the breeder and ask them to show you how to feed. Feed the same formula, same consistency and often a drop in a few degrees can have them quit eating. Make sure it is 105 degrees. Higher and you could burn the crop, lower and you can cause infection. What is her weight?
She has an appointment with Dr. Dahlhausen in Milford, OH @ 2pm today. That's exactly what I was shocked about, 4 hand feedings a day for a mac at that age?! Crazy! Previous owner says 60cc's each feeding, which is insane! The previous owners go her unweaned from someone but don't know the person's name. I don't think they had any business having her. At least with me I'm getting her to the vet and trying my best to do all I can to help her. She won't stay on the scale long enough, but was ranging around 400 grams.
 

Amanda6

Walking the driveway
Joined
10/16/16
Messages
204
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Real Name
Amanda
@Macawnutz Has pretty much covered it. Babies are so prone to gettin infections and you sure don't want to let it get away from you.

@MiniMacaw rescued a young B&G and went through heck getting him straightened out from severe neglect.

Is you r vet an avian vet
Yes, the vet I am going to is an avian veterinarian. It will be our first time seeing this Dr. though. I've heard only great things about him though.
 

Amanda6

Walking the driveway
Joined
10/16/16
Messages
204
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Real Name
Amanda
ok thank you for the answers. I know you said you were going to the vet please ask if they can get you F-10 for sanitizing equipment. it's much safer then just allowing it to dry. putting your filled syringes into a cup of water at the same temp as formula will help keep it hot enough to feed. is her crop emptying by the time of the next feeding ?
I usually use apple cider vinegar to wash everything, is that not good enough? I never though of that! I will have to try putting the syringe in warm water. She really is hardly even eating enough to notice much of a difference in her crop.
 

Hankmacaw

Cruising the avenue
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avenue Concierge
Joined
10/18/09
Messages
14,254
Location
Arizona
Real Name
Mary Lynn Skinner
Apple cider vinegar is not adequate for sanitation. There are many ACV believers on this and other forums, but it just doesn't do the job.

"Jan. 24, 2000 (Atlanta) -- For people seeking the best protection against disease-causing organisms in home kitchens and bathrooms, commercial disinfectants do a better job at eliminating them than do natural, environmentally friendly products. According to research in the North Carolina Statewide Program for Infection Control and Epidemiology (NC-SPICE), the commercial disinfectants tested killed 99.9% of bugs, including Salmonella, Escherichia coli(E. coli), and vancomycin-resistant Enterococci (VRE). The natural products eliminated only 90% of the bugs.

"We found the natural products were far less effective than commercial household disinfectants," lead researcher William A. Rutala, MD, tells WebMD. "To our knowledge, the activity of commercial household disinfectants against antibiotic-resistant microbes has not been reported previously." Rutala is a professor of medicine in the University of North Carolina (UNC) School of Medicine in Chapel Hill, director of NC-SPICE, and director of Hospital Epidemiology, Occupational Health and Safety Program at UNC Hospitals." Commercial Disinfectants Protect Best Against Disease

For disinfection for birds, reptiles and small mammals F10 is by far the best disinfectant and the least caustic of any disinfectant on the market.
 

aooratrix

Macawaholic
Super Moderator
Avenue Veteran
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
4/6/13
Messages
5,631
Real Name
Matthew
Dalhousen is the vet for Sugarcreek, where I got Annie. I've only heard good things about him. How do you NOT KNOW where you got a family member??? They probably didn't want to say. I hope they can set this baby on the mend quickly!
 

Laurie

The Best Bird Toys
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/15/13
Messages
4,061
Location
USA
Real Name
Laurie
It looks like most of it has been covered. You do need to disinfect with something when feeding babies. There are several things that will work. I have never used F10. You can use bleach, I am not sure the concentration.

I used to use stabilized chlorine dioxide but I now use boiling water.

You have to disinfect all of it. The mixing dish, the syringe, spoon and all, anything that touches the food. You do it at the end of a feeding but it should be kept in a clean covered container. Better yet do it just before the feeding.

Things that I have used that have worked are keeping the feeding utensils in the disinfectant solution and removing and rinsing right before feeding. Or as I do now. I douse all of it in boiling water right before I use it for feeding.

I hope the vet appointment goes well :)
 

iamwhoiam

Ripping up the road
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
4/16/12
Messages
27,864
Location
the zoo
Sorry that your macaw is having issues. Good that you are taking him to the vet and hope that all will be well.
 

Tiel Feathers

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
9/15/14
Messages
19,874
Location
Quincy,CA
Real Name
Deanna
I hope your Macaw will be okay and that the vet visit goes well!
 

aooratrix

Macawaholic
Super Moderator
Avenue Veteran
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
4/6/13
Messages
5,631
Real Name
Matthew
I think bleach is 1:10. I'd go with F10, though. Not caustic. Any updates on the visit with Dr. Dalhausen???
 

Amanda6

Walking the driveway
Joined
10/16/16
Messages
204
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Real Name
Amanda
Apple cider vinegar is not adequate for sanitation. There are many ACV believers on this and other forums, but it just doesn't do the job.

"Jan. 24, 2000 (Atlanta) -- For people seeking the best protection against disease-causing organisms in home kitchens and bathrooms, commercial disinfectants do a better job at eliminating them than do natural, environmentally friendly products. According to research in the North Carolina Statewide Program for Infection Control and Epidemiology (NC-SPICE), the commercial disinfectants tested killed 99.9% of bugs, including Salmonella, Escherichia coli(E. coli), and vancomycin-resistant Enterococci (VRE). The natural products eliminated only 90% of the bugs.

"We found the natural products were far less effective than commercial household disinfectants," lead researcher William A. Rutala, MD, tells WebMD. "To our knowledge, the activity of commercial household disinfectants against antibiotic-resistant microbes has not been reported previously." Rutala is a professor of medicine in the University of North Carolina (UNC) School of Medicine in Chapel Hill, director of NC-SPICE, and director of Hospital Epidemiology, Occupational Health and Safety Program at UNC Hospitals." Commercial Disinfectants Protect Best Against Disease

For disinfection for birds, reptiles and small mammals F10 is by far the best disinfectant and the least caustic of any disinfectant on the market.
Are there any suitable disinfectants that are bird safe? Any with very little to no chemicals?
 

Amanda6

Walking the driveway
Joined
10/16/16
Messages
204
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Real Name
Amanda
Dalhousen is the vet for Sugarcreek, where I got Annie. I've only heard good things about him. How do you NOT KNOW where you got a family member??? They probably didn't want to say. I hope they can set this baby on the mend quickly!
Yes, we saw Dr. Dahlhausen. Love him! And I love Sugarcreek! We go often. We knew we were buying from people who didn't know what they were really doing and they had no name or anything to give me for the person they got her from. We knew we were taking a chance. Dr. Dahlhausen said she looks good and is healthy minus the fact that she should already be weaned (which I figured that much) and she does have a minor staph infection in her mouth and crop which we are medicating.
 
Top