Stupid.

[Emmilyy]

You know whats STUPID. My cousin has been looking for a bird for a long time. He finally decided on a Grey. Lots of research being done, his baby is being hand fed now. Ready to come home around the end of august/beginning of september.

He emailed today (after prompting from me) asking them to please not clip his baby as he wants it to remain fully flighted. He put in he'd probably clip her after when she gets home (because he knows the breeder is pro-clip not because he's actually going to) and she told him she refuses to sell babies fully flighted.

I am like WHAT!? don't say 'he shouldn't get it then" he's already put a deposite down and he wants *this* bird he's been waiting so long he's even made the drive to visit her. I'm just mad is all.

 

[Saemma]

I understand how you feel.

 

[Tielygirl]

thats really stupid. I would be mad as well.
I hope they can work something out? Maybe she's just saying that because she's already clipped him? (given he's old enough to be clipped??) Why dont they try to reach a middle ground? tell her to do a short show clip instead maybe? like only the first 2 primaries?

 

[Emmilyy]

No, she hasn't been clipped yet I know that for sure. She is still all pins. My cousin is mad because he wants her to stay flighted and knows it could mess her up and be awhile to fly again. I told him to try and compromise. Maybe a light LIGHT clip the day he picks her up, so he can watch.

 

[Birdasaurus]

That stinks, but I would think that it's his bird and he has the right to request that. Then again I don't know what else to do if she refuses besides either live with it or ask for the deposit back.

It's definitely a warning to make sure these questions are asked before making a deposit.

 

[atvchick95]

that is messed up and I am for clipping BUT I don't refuse to sell them fully clipped

usually I don't clip unless the buyer wants them clipped

But If I've had them for a while (like a sibling pair of love birds who will be 1 in November) I've clipped them because they kept getting up in areas there was no way a human could get their body into a position to get them (even with a net) with out Some one getting severely hurt in the process!

but even my for sale birds get clipped in the same manner as my own, They can still fly, just can't get there lil' butts into places no one can them out of

but if asked before any are clipped, Then I don't clip,. actually we normally ask in the last conversation before they come to pick the bird(s) up if they want them clipped or not. Or if we forget we ask them before putting them in the carrier/box for them to take them home

but by the time mine go to their new homes they've been flying around the room(s) like little mad men/women and they know what they're doing (if they didn't they wouldn't get themselves in the predicaments they do I swear some of them do it so they can sit there and laugh at us while we're trying to figure out how to get them down from there w/out any one getting hurt LOL)and it would be either me or my b/f getting hurt

 

[Quiverful]

Maybe if he threatens to walk away from the sale and demand his deposit back, she will change her mind.

 

[Gen120]

I am sorry!

 

[expressmailtome]

That is too bad. I hope that they can work things out.

Matt

 

[Emmilyy]

She emailed back. Saying she never has and never will sell a flighted bird. She says its not worth the risk. That some people are against cutting them, but some people are against cutting hair too and that doesnt make it right (Wtf does that mean??) she said she certainly hoped he'll keep her clipped for the rest of her life and not take the risk of letting her fly away. (CLIPPED BIRDS CAN STILL GET AWAY!) she says the babies will be allowed to fledge and fly for about a week (enough time!?!) and then she will begin clipping slowly. Two one day, Two the next day, and three the last day. Seven flights cut. Isn't that too much for a Grey?? They seem like heavy birds - she'll drop! With my little guys - Higgins got five off at the pet shop and he just plummets!

 

[Deejo]

She emailed back. Saying she never has and never will sell a flighted bird. She says its not worth the risk. That some people are against cutting them, but some people are against cutting hair too and that doesnt make it right (Wtf does that mean??) she said she certainly hoped he'll keep her clipped for the rest of her life and not take the risk of letting her fly away. (CLIPPED BIRDS CAN STILL GET AWAY!) she says the babies will be allowed to fledge and fly for about a week (enough time!?!) and then she will begin clipping slowly. Two one day, Two the next day, and three the last day. Seven flights cut. Isn't that too much for a Grey?? They seem like heavy birds - she'll drop! With my little guys - Higgins got five off at the pet shop and he just plummets!

That's really too bad. However, that is the attitude of many breeders. A week of flight, then the traditional chop job It makes things easier for the handfeeder or breeder.

It also gives the breeder peace of mind knowing the baby is not going to be able to fly into things at a strange new environment.

Our birds are flighted....knowing and understanding the risks...being responsible for a flighted parrot is the 'buyers' decision, not the breeder. (at least in my opinion)
We all know that clipped birds compensate and can often fly very well.

There are great photos (somewhere on line) that show the proper clip for a grey. Sorry, can't recall the web site.

 

[Cory]

Let them fly for ONE WEEK before clipping them? THAT is NOT letting parrots fully fledge. A medium to large parrot needs A LOT more time than that to develop proper flight skills and fly confidently.

This person is doing a major disservice to these African Greys. This decision can potentially affect the rest of these birds' lives. I have several birds that were not allowed to fully fledge as babies and I have seen first hand what it does to them.


Second of all, clipping a parrot does not ensure that it won't escape outside. Parrots with clipped wings SHOULD be able to glide comfortably to the floor. With some wind outside, they would be able to get enough life to fly away outdoors. If the are clipped more than this to the point where they wouldn't be able to fly outdoors because they drop like a rocky then the clip is WAY too severe and the bird can get SEVERELY injured from it!


This is something that really upsets me.

 

[Emmilyy]

I know that it is the way most breeders do things, but i can't beleive that she won't give him the choice... I mean, she's still all pins and he *requested* to keep her flighted.. Ugh.

 

[Emmilyy]

Let them fly for ONE WEEK before clipping them? THAT is NOT letting parrots fully fledge. A medium to large parrot needs A LOT more time than that to develop proper flight skills and fly confidently.

This person is doing a major disservice to these African Greys. This decision can potentially affect the rest of these birds' lives. I have several birds that were not allowed to fully fledge as babies and I have seen first hand what it does to them.


Second of all, clipping a parrot does not ensure that it won't escape outside. Parrots with clipped wings SHOULD be able to glide comfortably to the floor. With some wind outside, they would be able to get enough life to fly away outdoors. If the are clipped more than this to the point where they wouldn't be able to fly outdoors because they drop like a rocky then the clip is WAY too severe and the bird can get SEVERELY injured from it!


This is something that really upsets me.

THANK YOU! THESE ARE MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY!
First of all, my cousin wants his bird to stay flighted FOREVER, not be clipped. And she's ruining that for him. When i heard seven flights i immediately thought of Toc. Before he came here his previous owner took it upon herself to cut his first seven feathers. He DROPPED everytime he tried to fly and i was so scared every time i thought he was going to seriously injure himself.

I am so mad about this, and it is not even my bird. It doesn't look like there is anything we can do, though, unless he backs out of getting her and that is not going to happen. I am so sad for her. I'm going to visit her next sunday .

 

[PerfectlyParrot]

Is there anyone else that he knows who can finish hand feeding the bird and get it from the breeder early before she has a chance to clip its wings?

 

[Cory]

That's really too bad. However, that is the attitude of many breeders. A week of flight, then the traditional chop job It makes things easier for the handfeeder or breeder.

It also gives the breeder peace of mind knowing the baby is not going to be able to fly into things at a strange new environment.

Our birds are flighted....knowing and understanding the risks...being responsible for a flighted parrot is the 'buyers' decision, not the breeder. (at least in my opinion)
We all know that clipped birds compensate and can often fly very well.

There are great photos (somewhere on line) that show the proper clip for a grey. Sorry, can't recall the web site.

Clipping a bird early to make things easier for the handfeeder is very wrong in my opinion. When decisions are made for the convenience of the people rather than the welfare of the birds they are bad breeders in my opinion. It just shows that most breeders care more about the ease of their jobs and making profit than the actual welfare of the birds. I am not saying that ALL bird breeders are bad, but in my opinion the majority are.

I understand the fact that a breeder wouldn't want the bay crashing into things in a new environment, but it certainly doesn't mean they should clip them early. An alternative could be to let the birds FULLY fledge and gain confidence and flight skills and THEN clip them. That way they could have the piece of mind to begin with and then once the flight feathers grow in the birds would be skilled enough at flying to not crash into things.

From my own experience here, birds that have been clipped to early and / or for very long periods of time have poorer flight skills and therefore the risk of having crash landing and injuries are higher. The other issue is that many birds don't have the proper muscles to fly well. It's often hard for them to recover and fly well.

 

[Emmilyy]

He's asking her if she could please hold off on the clipping at least until he comes to get her. and he's trying to convince her to clip less than seven.

I dont think she would sell an unweaned baby.. and i wouldn't want her to. My uncle hand fed his baby amazon for the last couple weeks, but that was over twenty years ago.

 

[Chicklette]

That really stinks, it’s HIS bird, he should have the say in it. I don’t understand that. Once it’s gone it’s not her bird anymore.

 

[Phoenix]

It may not apply to all situations, but each of my birds was clipped by the breeder before bringing them home. She did a very nice job and they could still fly very well. They all fly very well, and all of them have excellent flight skills.

I disagree that clipping a baby before it fully fledges can be harmful (ducks.. let me finish, y'all!). I say this, because once you get the bird, you can let the wings grow out and let the sucker fly as much as he/she wants to in order to improve flying skills. None of my birds show any personality changes for the negative for the clips that they had.

Someone mentioned directions for clipping a Grey..I would find that article and sit down and calmy discuss following the directions. If she was unable to do this, and you feel strongly about it, I would suggest you find a breeder that respects YOUR wishes, rather than staying in an uproar and keeping the boards in an uproar over a situation that is easily resolved.

That's just my opinion.

 

[Deejo]

Clipping a bird early to make things easier for the handfeeder is very wrong in my opinion. When decisions are made for the convenience of the people rather than the welfare of the birds they are bad breeders in my opinion. It just shows that most breeders care more about the ease of their jobs and making profit than the actual welfare of the birds. I am not saying that ALL bird breeders are bad, but in my opinion the majority are.

I understand the fact that a breeder wouldn't want the bay crashing into things in a new environment, but it certainly doesn't mean they should clip them early. An alternative could be to let the birds FULLY fledge and gain confidence and flight skills and THEN clip them. That way they could have the piece of mind to begin with and then once the flight feathers grow in the birds would be skilled enough at flying to not crash into things.

From my own experience here, birds that have been clipped to early and / or for very long periods of time have poorer flight skills and therefore the risk of having crash landing and injuries are higher. The other issue is that many birds don't have the proper muscles to fly well. It's often hard for them to recover and fly well.

I agree with you completely....well said.