Stainless Steel ~ Cheap stuff VS High Quality.

[Saemma]

In light of my conversation with Tricia from Expandable Habitats I've been thinking about this topic a great deal today. I had never heard about Non Magnetic 304 stainless steel until today. I am aware that stainless steel is NOT rust proof, it is simply resistant to rusting in comparison to other metals.

How do we know what we're really getting when we are purchasing *stainless steel cages*?

Custom or non custom. How do we know that the stainless steel we are purchasing won't *eventually rust* or show indications of rusting in a short amount of time? When I say a short amount of time I am thinking anything under 20 years.

All feedback is appreciated.

 

[Merlie]

JLCribber posted this info on another thread ..

"The reason they are lighter now is because they make them thinner to save on material.

High grade stainless steel is not magnetic. The lower grade it is the more iron it will have in it. Touch it with a magnet and that will give you a good indication of how high grade it is. "


I always thought SS was SS until I read that. I carry a magnet with me when I go to bird fairs and such, so I can test items that are advertised as "SS". If the magnet sticks, I'm not buying. If the quality of SS is so inferior that a magnet sticks, then why am I paying a premium for SS?

As far as rusting, I'd bet dollars to donuts that the lower the quality of SS, the more inclined it is to rust at some point.

 

[Jan]

Pretty much all stainless steel cages are made with the 304 grade. 316 is much more pricey and depends on the properties in it as to how non magnetic it is. The finish on it as to whether is is dull or highly polished does not determine what grade it is.

My S/S wire I carry in stock is 304 grade and not shiny.

 

[saroj12]

my A&E cages are304 grade stainless steel and 100% non magnetic, nuts and bolts and all!

A few of the food bowl holders developed specks of rust in 3 years, and they replaced them. The bowl holders seem to be made of a different quality of ss, even though they are non-magnetic.
Nothing else is rusting, even where the lixit bottle drips.

 

[Merlie]

Saroj ..

I'm curious .. what about the SS AA cage you're replacing? You said it was showing a bit of rust. Does a magnet stick to it??

 

[trout]

all metal will corrode if you don't care for it regardless of warranties.

To determine the grade ourselves is not easy. After using a magnet to see that it's a 300 series of stainless, you'd have to start using acids to break down the metal and watch for reactions, not something anyone would want to do on something they're about to give their bird or just spent over $2,000 on, lol.

We just need to trust reliable cage makers and share information so others can know who is reliable and who's not.

 

[saroj12]

Saroj ..

I'm curious .. what about the SS AA cage you're replacing? You said it was showing a bit of rust. Does a magnet stick to it??

I'll check in a while for you
Have to grab a magnet from the fridge

 

[Bokkapooh]

I was told SS can rust if its exposed to SALT. So those that live near the sea or ocean should take utmost care of their SS cages or it'll eventually rust. (SS is weakened by salt).

 

[Merlie]

Thanks Saroj!!

I've thought if I ever did SS, not custom, I'd get an AA Stainless, as I really love the design of the AA cages .. but you got me concerned when you said one of the Quakers' cages already showed a bit of rust in a short time.

You live in a much more humid climate than I do, so I don't know if that has a lot of bearing or not.

 

[Saemma]

I was told SS can rust if its exposed to SALT. So those that live near the sea or ocean should take utmost care of their SS cages or it'll eventually rust. (SS is weakened by salt).

You are correct. Expandable Habitats provides 316 stainless steel for client's who live in those conditions. It is apparently extremely expensive.

 

[Renae]

I was told SS can rust if its exposed to SALT. So those that live near the sea or ocean should take utmost care of their SS cages or it'll eventually rust. (SS is weakened by salt).

Wow, I didn't know this!

I live near a lake, with ocean about 30 mins away.

 

[JLcribber]

All steel will rust if exposed to the elements long enough. "Polishing" the metal does increase its rust resistance. In that case you will usually see rust in the corners and crevices where it's harder to polish.

A good alternative to SS is aluminum.

How are stainless steels classified?

The three major classes of stainless steel are:

Austenitic: Chromium-nickel-iron alloys with 16-26% chromium, 6-22% nickel (Ni), and low carbon content, with non-magnetic properties (if annealed - working it at low temperatures, then heated and cooled). Nickel increases corrosion resistance. Hardenable by cold-working (worked at low temperatures) as well as tempering (heated then cooled). Type 304 (S30400) or "18/8" (18% chromium 8% nickel), is the most commonly used grade or composition.

Martensitic: Chromium-iron alloys with 10.5-17% chromium and carefully controlled carbon content, hardenable by quenching (quickly cooled in water or oil) and tempering (heated then cooled). It has magnetic properties. Commonly used in knives. Martensitic grades are strong and hard, but are brittle and difficult to form and weld. Type 420 (S42000) is a typical example.

Ferritic: Chromium-iron alloys with 17-27% chromium and low carbon content, with magnetic properties. Cooking utensils made of this type contain the higher chromium levels. Type 430 is the most commonly used ferritic.

Two additional classes worth mentioning include Duplex (with austenitic and ferritic structures), and Precipitation Hardening stainless steel, used in certain extreme conditions.
How are different classes of stainless steels used?

The austenitic microstructure is most commonly used for knives and cooking utensils. It is very tough, hardened through a process that consists of heating, cooling and heating. It resists scaling and retains strength at high temperatures.

Both ferritics and austenitics are used in kitchenware and household appliances. Austenitics are preferred in the food industry and beverage equipment due to the superior corrosion resistance and ease of cleaning. Type 301, for example, is an austenitic stainless steel, with 17% chromium, 7% nickel, and .05% carbon, and is widely used for institutional food preparation utensils.

You can easily make do with the lesser quality cookware for most oven use. For stovetop cooking, however, don't skimp on quality; buy only the better ones. Most manufacturers of high quality cookware use stainless steel similar to the Type 304 grade, with thick heat diffusing bottoms. Metals that provide better diffusion of heat, such as copper and aluminum, are attached to the bottom for heat diffusion, to prevent hot spots and uneven cooking.

Low quality cutlery is generally made out of grades like 409 and 430 (ferritic), while the finest Sheffield cutlery uses specially produced 410 and 420 (martensitic) for the knives, and 304 (austenitic) for the spoons and forks. Grades like the 410/420 can be hardened and tempered so that the knife blades will take a sharp edge, whereas the more ductile 304 stainless is easier to work and therefore more suitable for objects that have to undergo numerous shaping, buffing and grinding processes.

The best quality stainless steel knife blades have a high carbon content, and usually have molybdenum and vanadium in their composition.

Stainless Steel
The generic term for grades of steel that contain more than 10% chromium, with or without other alloying elements. Stainless Steel may also have varying additions of Nickel, Molybdenum, Titanium, Niobium and other elements. Stainless steel resists corrosion, maintains its strength at high temperatures, and is easily maintained. The chromium in the steel combines with oxygen in the atmosphere to form a thin, invisible layer of chrome-containing oxide. The most common grades of stainless steel are:

TYPE 304 - The most commonly specified austenitic (chromium-nickel stainless class) stainless steel, accounting for more than half of the stainless steel produced in the world. This grade withstands ordinary corrosion in architecture, is durable in typical food processing environments, and resists most chemicals. Type 304 is available in virtually all product forms and finishes.

TYPE 316 - Austenitic (chromium-nickel stainless class) stainless steel containing 2%-3% molybdenum (whereas 304 has none). The inclusion of molybdenum gives 316 greater resistance to various forms of deterioration.

TYPE 409 - Ferritic (plain chromium stainless category) stainless steel suitable for high temperatures. This grade has the lowest chromium content of all stainless steels and thus is the least expensive.

TYPE 410 - The most widely used martensitic (plain chromium stainless class with exceptional strength) stainless steel, featuring the high level of strength conferred by the martensitics. It is a low-cost, heat-treatable grade suitable for non-severe corrosion applications.

TYPE 430 - The most widely used ferritic (plain chromium stainless category) stainless steel, offering general-purpose corrosion resistance, often in decorative applications.

 

[southernbirds]

Excellent thread. How often have you had an inside cage start to rust? How many cages do you think a bird gets in a lifetime? We are always searching for the perfect cage. I would love a stainless but my bird is too small.

 

[Saemma]

Thanks John!!

 

[Merlie]

Great post John .. thank you

 

[saroj12]

Merlie, my Avian Adventures is 100% non magnetic but has worrisome areas of discoloration

 

[Merlie]

Saroj ..

Thank you so much for taking the time to check. I'm still a big fan of Avian Adventure cages, I have 4 of them, various ages, and no signs of problems at all <non stainless, just powdercoat>.

I do love J & C's A & E cage .. it's gorgeous!!

 

[saroj12]

Saroj ..

Thank you so much for taking the time to check. I'm still a big fan of Avian Adventure cages, I have 4 of them, various ages, and no signs of problems at all <non stainless, just powdercoat>.

I do love J & C's A & E cage .. it's gorgeous!!

I'm happy with my four A&E ss so far.....3 years into them.

 

[Saemma]

Is it possible to still purchase A & E cages?

 

[Saemma]

Wow!! Just looked them up. Very reasonably price for Good quality stainless steel cages.