Green Cheek Conure Feeding Schedule and other questions

[greencheekchick]

-Well my green cheek conure pair Meeka and Morpheus are determined to have babies again and as of today I have 2 babies with 5 more possibly hatching (7 babies wow). Baby #1 hatched Aug 25 and Baby #2 hatched Aug 28. This will be Meeka and Morpheus's second clutch and my first time feeding. I have researched until sick last year when I wasn't going to hand raise the babies and now that I have decided to do this this time I have re-researched until again about sick (I literally feel sick right now too). I've read/watched about every article/video I can on feeding multiple times as I don't have a close enough expert to show me. I have even practiced mixing some old formula (the just in case I had a baby not being fed by parents formula) from last year to get the hang of how the syringe/spoon works and getting the temp/consistency right that it would not clump and so forth.
-I am planning on pulling the babies as they turn (or a little before) 3 weeks old one at a time. So I still have almost 2-3 weeks to get this as straight as I can.
-I have chosen to do a syringe spoon type feed (heard of it?) so I know exactly how much I am feeding and I've read that babies are more readily accepted by the baby to use a spoon (and/or is easier for the feeder too) . I also have the brooder, weigher, thermometer, and brand new formula (Kaytee Exact) ready to go. The only thing though is I am stressing on when or how to pull the babies and what times a day I should be feeding.
-I work as a house keeper from 9am to whenever I finish and get home. My days off are Thursdays and Fridays. My mom has agreed to do at least one feed during my work hours if she has too (and after I've showed her of course)
--I guess what would be the best times to feed (at or almost) 3 week old green cheek conure babies on my kind of schedule? I've played with every 4, 5, or 6 hours? but then I don't know how long during the night they would be able to go? Like if I started the first feed at 8am (8:15am is when I leave for work) and then I say every 5 hrs? Would be 8am, 1pm, 6pm (just about always home before 6pm), 11pm, 4am? or could I leave the 4am feed and have the 11pm feed be the last and start at 8am again? I'm stressing about the time between 11pm and 8am.
--Can I sorta 'push' the parents out of the way to get the baby when it's time to pull? Meeka sits really tight and I rarely catch her out of the nest. I was planning on pulling baby #1 Thursday at midnight of September 11th so I had the full Friday to get the hang of it and if I didn't feel I could feed right, I plan to put it back with mom and dad and not pull any more either and to just leave babies with parents.
--I will be keeping the parents and babies in the same room (my bedroom) as there isn't any other room for them elsewhere. Will this be OK?

-Sorry, long read but I hope I'm clear on what I'm asking? I just want it to be perfect and there is a lot of controversy on everything Feel free to add to anything I may have missed too.
Thank you

 

[CheekyBeaks]

Initially I would recommend 4 hourly feeds when pulling at around the 21 day mark, my schedule would be a 7am, 11am, 3pm, 7pm, 11pm then have an 8 hour break overnight. I wouldn't disturb them at midnight, try pulling them at around 6 am to give them a little time to adjust to the brooder then try a feed at around 7am. It make sure their crops are almost if not completely empty before trying to feed. I use a needless syringe of feeding my babies, never needed to use a spoon to get them used to feeding, it may take one or two handfeed for them to get used to handfeeding but GCCs tend to adapt fairly easily.
The babies will also let you know when they are ready to drop a feed, they tend to be less interested especially by the last feed of the day, then you can drop to 5-6 hourly feeds, this normally occurs by around 24-30 days of age for a healthy normally developing baby.
As for how to pull babies you will find as the babies grow older mum will spend more time out of the box so you will have a better opportunity to get into the nest. Also don't leave just one baby in the nest as some hens will abandon and stop feeding if a majority of a clutch is pulled leaving just one, so leave 2-3 until last and pull them all at once. I tend with large clutches to pull in two groups, the older half of the clutch first and then the younger half when they are at the age I want.

 

[greencheekchick]

- Ok thanks this makes me feel better. I'd like to start at 8am for first feed so I have an extra hour to get home for the third feed (hopefully most of the time I'll be able too)
-- But now I'm wondering if I waited till the next week (Thursday, September 18th, 6am) to pull Baby#1 would that be OK too or better maybe? Baby#1 would be 24 days old and Baby#2 right at three weeks would it be better to pull both, and if not three (if Baby# three hatched in the next couple days, if not today)? Would they then have a different schedule by then? Also would they be close or the same feeding times too? It would give me an extra day to figure out everything too before I had to work again. If I decided I couldn't do this right would the parents take over both 2 (or all 3) again do you think? Or should I keep to original plan? Or how would you pull a 7 baby clutch (assuming all hatch)?

 

[CheekyBeaks]

Pulling the first baby on the 18th Sept would be fine as long as you pull babies by 21 days of age, after then you are going to have a very hard time getting them to adjust to handfeeding and may not socialise as well.
Also if you are giving the first feed of the day at 8am your last feed would have to be 12pm, you don't want to leave them any more than the 8 hours over night.
I use the following chart a guide from one of my favourite handrearing books (Guide to Incubation & Handraising Parrots), but you really need to observe each baby and if one needs more frequent feeds for longer than you need to be prepared for that. Also have babies of different ages you are going to have different levels of development and different feeding times, if you have some babies on 5 feeds per day and some on 4 feeds you may find you are having to do 6 handfeeding times each day. When I first bring babies in they generally take several feeds to take a full feed so I feed more frequently (eg. a chick that is on 4 feeds per day I will give 5 feeds to at first) I also feed a little thinner than a normal feed as the stress of pulling them can effect their crop movement and digestion, so a slightly thinner formula help to make it a little easier to digest at first, I only do this for the first 2-3 feeds though, I also add some electrolytes to the first feed or two.

_____
Feeding Intervals
Day 1---------- 2 hour feeds-----------(9-10 feeds per day)
By Day 8----------3 1/2-4 hour feeds--------(5-6 feeds a day)
By Day 14---------5 hour feeds---------------(4 feeds per day)
By day 24-30------8 hour feeds--------------(3 feeds per day)
At Peak ------------------------------------------(2 feeds per day)

 

[greencheekchick]

-Thanks so much I feel so much more confident in doing this now. So I'll pull babies on the 18th I think and go from there. Still waiting to see if more babies are going to hatch too.

 

[greencheekchick]

Ok so I have 3 babies total. #1 hatched August 25th, #2 hatched August 28th, and #3 hatched September 5th.
I pulled babies #1&#2 at about 9:00am when both parents were out, and left #3 for another week.
I left babies #1&#2 in the brooder for a bit till about 10:30-11:00ish and tried a first feeding which was more of a taste and then back in brooder until about 12:00-12:30ish and tried a second feeding but ended up with another taste, although #2 ate maybe a drop more. I'm planning on about every hour or so to progressively try to get them used to feeding and then when their eating go to every 4 hrs or so.
--Is every hour like this at first to get them used to it OK? Or should I be waiting a bit longer?
--How long does it usually take for them to actually start eating after they've been pulled for you? I've read a day to a couple days but not sure how often to feed or give them tastes until they are actually eating?
--Anything else I should be doing?

 

[greencheekchick]

Well I've decided that I'm not going to be able to hand feed them. Making myself too anxious and almost sick about if I fed enough, or too much, or if I did it right, and how much time between, and countless other things. Also was worried my mom wouldn't be able to help out while I was at work or something like she said she would. If I was having difficulties I'm positive she would have them too. She was basically telling me to do co-parenting too (she isn't a bird person) but told me to leave them with their parents and have me feed them once a day. I would do that but not sure when I would feed them when Meeka and Morpheus are feeding them too.
So this morning I put #1&#2 back in the nest with #3 and so far looks like Meeka and Morpheus are cleaning up my mess (think I got more formula on the babies than in them yesterday) and the babies are already begging them to feed them.
So hopefully handling them everyday and letting Meeka and Morpheus do their job I'll still get better tamed babies than I did last year. I wasn't able to get into the nest box as easily last year because it had to be on the inside and even sticking a hand in the cage door was a danger zone let alone getting into the nest box to check things.
--Anyways thanks for the help. I appreciated it

 

[CheekyBeaks]

Sorry I missed your posts I don't think I got any notifications that you had posted, sorry it didn't work out for you, just make sure mum and dad have started feeding them again.
GCC bubs are really easy to hand feed and are usually very eager to feed, I can usually get a few mls in the first feed (when pulled between 2-3 weeks old) or two and up to a normal feed after several feeds. I've got a bub in now that I pulled at 11 days old to take some pressure off the parents and he took 6mls on the first feed.

 

[greencheekchick]

Yup they are being fed but now I have a problem. I'm not sure who is doing it but the youngest baby (#3 the one I wasn't going to take till this week) has had some of his/her new feathers plucked out. But has still been being fed. But this morning check and he/she was bloody (blood was dry though) from having being plucked again but I couldnt take him/her out then because I have to work and didnt want to leave it without food for that long so as soon as I get home today he/she is being handfed. I'll just have to make it work for this guy.
-should I do anything different with him/her?
Thanks again so much for helping.

 

[CheekyBeaks]

If they are plucking to the point there is blood you definitely need to pull and handrear. I will recommend if you are taking one you should at least take one more for it to be raised with, it is never good to raise a baby on its own unless absolutely necessary.

 

[melissasparrots]

If they are plucking to the point there is blood you definitely need to pull and handrear. I will recommend if you are taking one you should at least take one more for it to be raised with, it is never good to raise a baby on its own unless absolutely necessary.

Agreed. You have to be a lot more careful with temperature in the brooder if you just pull one. With 2 or 3 in the brooder, they can move together or move apart to warm up or cool down if you aren't spot on with temp. Also, I would strongly suspect that if they are plucking one, they are soon to pluck one of the others too. It could be that they would have started plucking the babies anyway, but it could also be the result of having pulled the chicks and then put them back. When you go to hand-feed, keep the syringes in a cup of warm water and don't take them out of the warm water until the chick is in position to eat. That way the instant the syringe touches the beak, they feel something warm and will often trigger a feeding response. As apposed to letting the syringe tip be dry or cool and not getting a feeding response. If they are old enough to be a little skittish of you, try dimming the lights a little bit. You should be able to see well enough that you don't make any mistakes feeding, but dimmer light tends to reduce the visual stimuli that sometimes makes them nervous.

 

[greencheekchick]

Thanks, I think part of it is because of taking the others and then putting back and the other is that he is so much younger than the other two. He's only 2 weeks 5 days while the others are 4 weeks 2 days and 3 weeks 6 days. He's just getting those pins (they are just getting the feather part poking out of them) that are the ones getting plucked.
I dont want to leave just one in the nest anymore and I don't want to pull all of them now since the older two are doing just fine with mom and dad. And the older two are pretty skittish of me already anyways.

-- If I could (gotta ask) , do you think I could bring him to work with me in a blanketed container (to keep it warm) and I could do a feeding during my brake? Or just go with what I had planned before? Luckily tomorrow and friday are my days off so I have time to figure it out again.
Thank you

 

[greencheekchick]

So I pulled baby #3 yesterday after I got home and he/she seems to be doing well so far. Babies #1&#2 are still with mom and dad and are not being plucked as far as I can tell. They have so many more feathers in than #3 too.
Here are some pics of #3 from today. I didn't get a chance to get any of the other two so can't compare them to #3 but I'll try and get some pics of them later. This was the little guy after his 8am feed this morning. Fell asleep while taking him back to the brooder Then here after the noon feed where you can see his/her middle tail feathers were plucked/chewed off and the right wing is missing feathers or parts of a couple and was the part of him/her that was bloodied yesterday. I tried to get a better pic of the wing but the baby kept fidgeting.

 

[greencheekchick]

Ok just took this pic and from left to right #3, #2, & #1. So now you can see both 1&2 have a good portion of their feathers already while #3 is just getting them. I think #3 was getting plucked because the others had feathers already out while he/she was just getting them and (in combo of me taking and putting 1&2 back) Meeka or Morpheus or both didn't maybe understand that and were trying to 'help' those feathers? Idk but #3 seems to still be doing good. He/she is getting better at eating (or I'm getting better at giving idk) too.
#3 also started making these quiet but high pitched eeeeep eeeeeep noises after I got done feeding (best way I can describe them) is that normal baby sounds?

 

[melissasparrots]

Thanks, I think part of it is because of taking the others and then putting back and the other is that he is so much younger than the other two. He's only 2 weeks 5 days while the others are 4 weeks 2 days and 3 weeks 6 days. He's just getting those pins (they are just getting the feather part poking out of them) that are the ones getting plucked.
I dont want to leave just one in the nest anymore and I don't want to pull all of them now since the older two are doing just fine with mom and dad. And the older two are pretty skittish of me already anyways.

-- If I could (gotta ask) , do you think I could bring him to work with me in a blanketed container (to keep it warm) and I could do a feeding during my brake? Or just go with what I had planned before? Luckily tomorrow and friday are my days off so I have time to figure it out again.
Thank you

If you take him to work with you, you may end up needing a heat source. I don't breed green cheeks myself, but at his stage of development, personally I'd still have him on a little bit of heat. How much formula are you getting into him each feeding? @CheekyBeaks would be your better source of information as she has bred GC conures.

 

[greencheekchick]

Ya I didn't know about the heat source either (other than a blanket) if I did take him with me and I would also be worried about him maybe being affected by any of the chemicals we use for cleaning the rooms (not that I'd have him in the rooms I'd be cleaning either) . He'd have to be kept in the breakfast room or something I'd think but not sure... You think he would be ok with out the noon feed as long as I'm not gone for more than 8 hours. He/she would get the first 8am feed then the next at either whenever I got home or untill the 4pm feed? And then the 8pm and midnight feeds like usual? I don't want to rely on my mom for the noon feed even though she agreed to help.

The last feed was about 6ccs where the others were between about 2 and 4ccs.

 

[melissasparrots]

I think it depends on how fast his crop is moving. If he's taking 4 hours to empty or come close to emptying, then you probably need to make up for the lack of a noon feed by getting up in the middle of the night for a feeding. If he's taking 6 hours to empty or come close to emtying, then stretching it to 8 hours probably won't be a disaster. But it all depends on how much food you are able to get into him at each feed, which determines how fast his crop empties and therefore how often he needs to eat. You don't want to over stretch the crop trying to get him to eat too much food so you can skip the midday meal. But on the same note, I don't want to assume you are getting a full meal into him each feed since you are new to hand-feeding. It just depends. I don't really feed on a schedule anyway. I feed when their crop is almost empty. Whenever that is. And I let them go until all the way empty once a day. I have in the past switched their feeding schedule around when I had to work a distance away from home. They emptied all the way between 8am and 5pm and then I got up in the middle of the night and fed them a couple times. Tiring, but the babies gained weight really well and turned out just fine.

 

[greencheekchick]

Ok just got the midnight feed done and he ate 5ccs this time. It does seem like he is almost empty but not quite at the 4 hour mark so I'll just have to flip from doing the 8 hour brake from 12am-8am to 8am-4pm. So 4pm, 8pm, 12am, 4am, 8am. Oh boy this is gonna be rough but worth it
Thank you guys again so much I'm sure I'll be asking for more help too though lol

 

[CheekyBeaks]

I keep mine under a heat source until almost fully feathered, but it depends on the weather if it's really warm and isn't dropping under 28degrees than I don't use a heat source at least not in the day time. As a guide 28-31 degrees Celsius is ideal for babies 12 days through to heavy pin feathering then 26.5degrees Celsius is recommended.

I find my bubs sound a little like crickets when they chirp as babies, it's a really sweet little sound

As for the feeding 5mls sounds a little low, my little one that is 15 days is taking 11 ml per feed and is on 5 hourly feeds and usually empty by the next feed and is gaining about 3-4 grams per day, so you may need to look a slowly stretching the crop to accommodate more food. You can't do this too quickly and you don't want to go too far and over stretch the crop but have a feel of the crop after your feed, if it is very firm you cant fit more in but if it feels very soft and moveable you can go for a little more. When I stretch a crop at this age I would increase the feed by about 1/2 a ml and hold on that for 2-3 feeds sometimes a whole day depending on the chick than increase again. from memory the most one of my GCCs took was near 14 ml but I find that 12ml seems to be around the norm at their peak.
If your babies are eating these small amount and not emptying in the 4-5 hours than I would be look at the consistency and temp you are feeding at, as well as the temperature they are being brooded at, if too cool or too warm it will slow their crops.

 

[CheekyBeaks]

I should also mention that if your aren't already you should be doing daily weights to ensure they are having good weight gains.