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Vickiesbirds

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Have a moment when you well up with sadness for your birds? I was thinking to myself tonight... that no matter how much time I spend with my birds, how much money I spend to vet them, buy them the best things I can afford when it comes to food and toys, they're never "supposed" to be with me. While I love them to pieces and they make my days so much brighter, our relationship was never what nature intended. I don't mean to be "doom and gloom", but I find myself thinking about this sometimes lately. I hope I'm not alone on this one.
 

Katy

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Yes, I do think that. And how selfish we/I are/am. A variation on this theme which Saemma has already told me to shut up about :eek: is the fact that I bought an baby African Grey which guarantees she will have at least 2-3 homes in her life. That makes me sad.

I am hoping that GCC Birdie and I will time things a little better. Speaking to the planning commission about that. :D
 

Lyzzi

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Sometimes, I do. But then I remember that if Cherry or Bolt were in the wild, they risk poaching, starvation, predators. :( Cherry, especially, would not do well re-released. She's so human-focused and reliant on people for everything.
 

cassiesdad

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In a perfect world, humans would never feel the need to take a free flying animal and force it to live with humans. IT IS NOT A PERFECT WORLD. None of my birds could live in the wild-they were not wild caught.
It is sad that none of my birds will never know the freedom of flying through an area in the wild they could call their own. Ever feel the sun on their wings-feel the wind in their feathers.
BUT I give them the best care I can-they want for nothing,they are cared for by excellent AVs,and are generally spoiled rotten. It's not perfect-perfect would be in the wild...
 

JLcribber

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In a perfect world, humans would never feel the need to take a free flying animal and force it to live with humans. IT IS NOT A PERFECT WORLD. None of my birds could live in the wild-they were not wild caught.
It is sad that none of my birds will never know the freedom of flying through an area in the wild they could call their own. Ever feel the sun on their wings-feel the wind in their feathers.
BUT I give them the best care I can-they want for nothing,they are cared for by excellent AVs,and are generally spoiled rotten. It's not perfect-perfect would be in the wild...
Absolutely but that does not make those feelings Vickie is talking about any less powerful. And to me the larger and more emotional type parrots we have make those feelings occur more often because their needs are so hard to provide for.
 

Fuzzy

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Yes, I think daily about how much better a life they would have flying free. Each time I clean out their cages, and look out of them myself I hate it. I'm sad that I have to keep them caged when I go out. Even though they are out when I'm in, the house is still a prison. I built them an aviary so they can enjoy the sun, but neither want to go in. It's just another cage anyway. However much I provide for them, it's not the same as being free. I wish humans didn't have to spoil everything and own everything. It's done though.
 

Silvra

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No, I don't have overly romantic idealised ideas of how it is to live in the wild. Rather like I have no desire to go and live in some stone age, hunter gatherer tribe, even though that's 'what nature intended.'
 

Shyra

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I have to agree with Lauren. I do not feel guilty that my birds are not outside in the wild. They were not born into it and I think they are compensated to a large extent by being spoiled rotten. I hear about the toos in Australia being killed by the farmers and such, our own wild flocks of quakers here in the northeast having their nests ripped out with the baby chicks in it, Parrot habitats are being destroyed all over the world along with their food sources. Why would I wish that upon them? Yes, their lives are completely different than their wild counterparts but that doesn't mean they are living a worse life. It only means they lead a different type of life.
 

Naiera

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Yes, yes, yes, and yes again. I think about it a lot. Especially with my girls who seemingly want nothing more than to be birds and raise young. It breaks my heart that my birds, that i love so much and want nothing but the best for them, will never have what's best for them. It surprises me that more people don't feel that way ... Saddens me even, that as human we genuinely feel our way of life is best and that we are not depriving captive animals of their freedom but rather helping them. I wish nothing more than that my babies could have been born in nature untouched by humans. Yes, i realize nature is not some perfect place where my birds would live a long and easy life but they would be free to fly the skies, raise their young with their own kind and bond to members of their own species. To live in a flock of their kind and spend their days foraging, bathing, preening, sunning, flying like they're meant to, like they've evolved to.
 

AzaleaMist

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I can't say I think about this much because as it has been said they were not born in the wild and could not live that life. Do I think they would like that kind of life that God intended for them? Of course but I guess I dwell on other downers like the poor birds with horrible lives in captivity.


Tapatalk
 

Shyra

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Alyssa not to single you out, but do you and others who feel the same way about parrots in general feel that way about your rabbits, should they not also know what it's like to be wild and wake up to the dew covered grass? Take it a step further and the same can be said about other pet rodents and reptiles, and if that is true then should we have dogs in apartments that can't run around loose in yards or cats that are kept indoors? I'm sorry it saddens you that people think like I do but my birds are happy and healthy. I don't see how living in the wild could make them happier than they are now. We definitely see this from different points of views and I do not think either of us are wrong for thinking the way we do. I think of it in the same aspect of kids being raised in the big cities compared to the country. Big city children deal with completely different life experiences then those living in the country and small towns. They are taught to have different strengths and enjoy different things but one way of life isn't better than the other, no matter where they live they all have issues to overcome.

I was out with my dogs earlier and had to dispose of two young dead birds (a robin and a grackle). I'm sure they were killed by their competition since it's mating season for them right now. It was such a good feeling to come back into the house to hear Giz singing, syd playing with his toys and my other two preening contently. I definitely do not feel sad that they have good lives with me verses fighting for their survival in the wild.
 

Alan J.

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I do think about it a great deal and it does make me sad. Many will say that captive bred parrots (and hopefully all of ours are) will not survive in the wild, but if we never began breeding parrots in captivity to begin with, these birds would not exist in any event (not sure if that reads correctly) - I have recently begun to share my life with a blue and gold macaw, called Alex and love him dearly, but see his frustrations daily as well, which saddens me terribly. Dogs are domesticated, they are "of the house" - parrots are not.

Absolutely coincidentally, I spoke with a genetisist today and our conversation worked its way around to domestication and parrots and his thoughts on the issue, were that it could take up to 50 generations to domesticate the larger parrot species, if not far longer.
 

sweet francis

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In a perfect world, humans would never feel the need to take a free flying animal and force it to live with humans. IT IS NOT A PERFECT WORLD. None of my birds could live in the wild-they were not wild caught.
It is sad that none of my birds will never know the freedom of flying through an area in the wild they could call their own. Ever feel the sun on their wings-feel the wind in their feathers.
BUT I give them the best care I can-they want for nothing,they are cared for by excellent AVs,and are generally spoiled rotten. It's not perfect-perfect would be in the wild...
My sentiments exactly.
 

sodakat

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I will HAPPILY be proven incorrect, but I think that most wild parrots do not live to be a year old.
 

Naiera

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Alyssa not to single you out, but do you and others who feel the same way about parrots in general feel that way about your rabbits, should they not also know what it's like to be wild and wake up to the dew covered grass? Take it a step further and the same can be said about other pet rodents and reptiles, and if that is true then should we have dogs in apartments that can't run around loose in yards or cats that are kept indoors? I'm sorry it saddens you that people think like I do but my birds are happy and healthy. I don't see how living in the wild could make them happier than they are now. We definitely see this from different points of views and I do not think either of us are wrong for thinking the way we do. I think of it in the same aspect of kids being raised in the big cities compared to the country. Big city children deal with completely different life experiences then those living in the country and small towns. They are taught to have different strengths and enjoy different things but one way of life isn't better than the other, no matter where they live they all have issues to overcome.

I was out with my dogs earlier and had to dispose of two young dead birds (a robin and a grackle). I'm sure they were killed by their competition since it's mating season for them right now. It was such a good feeling to come back into the house to hear Giz singing, syd playing with his toys and my other two preening contently. I definitely do not feel sad that they have good lives with me verses fighting for their survival in the wild.
I do feel the same for my rabbits and also for my goldfish, I think I feel the worst for him. I feel less strongly about cats and even less strongly still about dogs because of how highly domesticated they are. Yes, I realize domestication had to start somewhere and at one point the decedents of our domestic animals were in the same place our birds are in now - I won't go off on that tangent.

We as humans fight for our freedom - none of us would care to be kept captive. Even under the best of circumstances. Why would it be different for animals? Yes, those of us here on AA take great pride in caring for our birds the best we can, but I don't think that makes captivity ideal for them. The life we live and that we provide for our animals is all centered around humans. We live life so differently from any other species on earth that I think it's almost impossible for anyone to really understand what it's like to be free - to be a wild animal. If we saw our birds plucked out of the wild first hand, hand to take them from the wild ourselves, I think the general consensus would be different. And I do indeed think that since they were born in captivity and raised in captivity it is a different situation, but my point is they are not made for the life style we force upon them. They have adapted to be happy with what we provide them, but I cannot see how it is better for them than their natural life they have evolved for.
 

Bokkapooh

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I do feel guilty for ALL animals in captivity at times. Not just/only my own birds. All Animals.
 

Ankou

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A different life doesn't necessarily mean a bad life.

For some birds, it certainly can, for whatever reason their needs cannot be met and they are unhappy. They don't adapt, and despite the fact their lives would be much shorter if they lived in the wild they likely wouldn't be unhappy.

Many birds do adapt and are happy though. Would that same bird be more happy if they had been born and grew up in the wild, certain instincts more fulfilled? Less happy because they don't have all those fun human inventions to break, food they would never encounter?
I dunno. I can't know.

The real trouble comes in when I see neglected birds or birds who are obviously unhappy. What do you do with that unhappy bird who cannot and does not want to adapt?
Why do humans bring an animal into our homes and than treat them like garbage? If they aren't even going to try and meet their most basic needs, yes, that bird would almost certainly be happier and more fulfilled in the wild. It may die to a hawk after raising one clutch of chicks but that year or two it would be alive would probably be miles better than being kept in someone's basement; alone in the dark and with nothing to do.


While I don't think you can compare a wild animal exactly to a domestic one or a human, I do generally think of it like this;
Some people will be miserable living in a big city, working 9-5 5 days a week. They would prefer a simpler life, maybe with fewer amenities many of us take for granted, but living rurally and working for themselves.
This is an attitude you see a lot in "the bush," rural Alaska. People would rather live off the grid, hunting for their food and bartering for everything else, if they have a job it is usually an extremely local job. It is not easy and there is little health care, any serious medical emergency usually means a helicopter ride to Anchorage or Fairbanks.

Yet I meet many people who grew up in the bush and loath that lifestyle. As soon as they could leave home they moved to the city, many want to leave the state for good once they graduate college. They want the stable job and big city. TV, videogames, groceries, toilets that are not a bucket.

Neither one is wrong, just some people will be happier in certain situations. They have their own individual likes, dislikes, needs and wants.
Parrots do too. The difference is, unlike the human example, one situation is unnatural, one is natural. But like I said, different doesn't have to mean bad. :)


I'm sorry you feel depressed at times. If you ever feel yourself getting too down, try to think about the things they love and enjoy despite being in your home instead of the wild. Be grateful they are in your home with a human who really cares about their happiness and tries to give them the best life they can have.
:hug8:
 

cupoftea

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I honestly will say I don't think about it. Maybe if Zazu was bred and caught from the wild... but no, he was captive bred so I don't think about it at all. While I'm sure Zazu has some survival instincts, I doubt Zazu would last long out there.
 

Vickiesbirds

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Thank you everyone for all the different perspectives... Everyone makes a good point and sheds a different light. I can say that I love my birds and would be depressed without them in my life.... As thinking about keeping them in captivity just makes me want to provide even better for them.
 

juliashmulia

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There was a time (namely right after I read Mira Tweti's book, Of Parrots and People) that my BF and I half-jokingly talked about making trips to Bolivia and West Africa to set Oskar and Silas free. So no, you're not alone.

And for those of you saying that they couldn't live life in the wild because they were born in captivity, that's not entirely true. There are whole flocks of parrots living in states from California to New York (in the city, no less) that are escaped pets. Some of them end up dying in the wild, but many of them live out a happy life in the trees like they're meant to.

I really urge you all to read Ms. Tweti's book. It will change your perspective. You could also watch the film The Wild Parrots of Telegraph Hill to see what life in the wild is like for ex-pet birds.
 
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