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Young Eclectus Feathers

MyDjango

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Howdy people! I just signed up and thought I should start asking around about this after coming up empty reading other forum posts. I've seen two vets now and had my 9 month old tested and checked to make sure his diet isn't an issue or that he isn't having some underlying problem. Both vets said he needs to molt his baby feathers (which he still hasn't finished doing, although he's been growing new feathers since November but still hasn't lost/grown any primaries). One vet mentioned that it could be a genetic issue (possibly he's inbred), or that it could be from how his feathers developed when he was being fed from the breeder. The first photo is from when I first got him, he had stress bars and his feathers were more yellowish than greenish and they all started to turn blackish when he started preening, which started around last September/October. It's just gotten progressively worse to the point where people who don't even know anything about parrots are asking about his feathers and if that's normal. It isn't. So I am just reaching out to see if anyone else has had any issues with how feathers look before a molt. The only thing I can think of is that it's very dry in our new house (just moved in November), and he does seem quite itchy and his feathers seem dryer/more brittle. He has a humidifier in his room, but I take him around the house with me during the day, so not sure how much that's helping, although I do mist him with water twice a day and he gets a shower every 3 days. It's just very upsetting to see his feathers in this condition when we feel we're trying hard to do everything right and his behavior is so good and he seems so happy aside from him aggressively preening sometimes.

One other thing I found odd (and scary) is that both vets said to feed him more pellets, not the veggies and beans I've been giving him. He gets a variety of fresh foods and also the Birdtricks/tops pellets, but they said I should be giving him more pellets than I am. I'm not even sure he should be getting any pellets based on what I've read about ekkies, but he's a very picky eater and tends to throw out the veggies he doesn't feel like having from one day to the next. Sometimes it's a good day for carrots, other days he won't touch them, and he refuses veggies in chopped form, so he justs gets a variety every day and chooses what he wants from that. I weigh him every morning/night and his weight has been fine and steady. He currently weighs around 240 in the mornings and about 25-260 in the evenings.
 

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Fia Baby

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Is he very playful? Rowdiness in babies is a big cause of feather damage. They can take on a blackened look when they've been rubbed on too much. I don't have an eclectus, but based on everything I've ever read I would really limit pellets, not give more. If he needs more variety in his diet, it should come from fresh foods. Hopefully an eclectus person will chime in; I know these guys can be challenging to care for. It sounds like you're doing a pretty good job, and he just needs to molt out his baby plumage. You're already doing what I'd suggest - good diet, limited (or zero, in the case of an eclectus) pellets, misting, showers... Can you give a run-down of his total diet? Where does the fat in his diet come from? Red palm oil is a favorite among many bird people, and it may be a good addition in this case as well.
 

Fia Baby

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One other idea - what is his vit. D source? It needs to be D3, and that can be hard to find in foods.
 

MyDjango

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For D3 I give him hard boiled eggs (he'll eat the shell, some white, some yolk). The vet didn't think he needed a D3 supplement other than to give him Tropicana pellets which are fortified with D3 (so I give him a few of those every day). However, I don't think this is a diet or D3 issue since I was taking him outside almost every day up until November, and the feathers started turning late Sep/early Oct. The weird thing is that his new feathers are growing in green (he molted most of his head). We do play with him a lot, flip him upside down, etc, and he's a very playful bird, both in and outside of his cage. He has a lot of toys and perches and also flies regularly around the house. The way the vet explained it (and this makes sense biologically), the feathers shouldn't change color after they're constructed from molting because they no longer have blood flowing to them. Not that the diet doesn't matter, but he explained that if it's diet related it was whatever he was fed as a baby when his first feathers grew in before I got him. Seems reasonable, I just don't know what he was fed other than formula and frozen veggies (which have almost no nutrients and are basically water anyway). The reason the diet issue bothers me is because I've reached out to many ekkie owners on instagram after seeing how their feathers look and they are telling me horrifying things they're feeding to their ekkies (and have been for a while), such as pizza, pasta, cheetos, crackers, greasy snack foods, etc, and their feathers look great on these birds. I highly doubt the birds are healthy so I wouldn't even consider doing that, but it's annoying that their feathers are bright and beautiful when they've been feeding such crap for years. It seems not everything relates to diet. I'm wondering if it's possibly an immune issue, or something genetic or something biologically that happens while the feathers are forming (like some aren't efficiently using protein for keratin, or maybe aren't absorbing it properly).

Just noticed your question about the source of fat. He gets such a different variety every day I'm sure I couldn't even list everything off the top of my head that I give him, but the typical go to list (in no particular order) is carrots, broccoli, peas, quinoa, lentils, chick peas, spinach, arugula, parsley, cilantro, corn, pomegranate, blueberry, pecans or walnuts for training only and limited to 2 at most, red cabbage, eggs plus the shell for protein and calcium while he's molting, cauliflower, radish, and occasionally sprouts when I can find them. I live in a rural area so it's very hard to find most of these things in organic form, unfortunately. I'm sure there's more, but that's off the top of my head, also it's always fresh and never frozen, and nearly all is raw other than the beans and quinoa. I limit his fruit when he does get it, which is probably only a couple of days a week because I worry about the sugar even though he does a lot of flying. When it was warm we took him out on the harness and flew him outside quite a bit, but even then his feathers were turning before it got cold. That's why I'm wondering if it could be genetic or biological in some way not necessarily related to diet.

One other idea - what is his vit. D source? It needs to be D3, and that can be hard to find in foods.
 

Monaco

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I'm sorry you're getting pellets recommended by the vets. I did too. I fully understand the reasons, but I also fully disagree with the 80 percent of the diet for ekkies. If you're seeing healthy feathers coming in, then it's likely a waiting game, and the rest should follow suit.

I'm really interested in the "aggressive preening" because my girl has what I call karate preening episodes. I've decided it's a behavior thing rather than a health thing, but I could be wrong. She also gets very itchy, and a week or two later I am sweeping up tiny molted feathers. We're in a pretty high humidity area. I suspect the itching is part of the molt. Monaco doesn't seem to let go many at a time, but rather a more regular one week a month. I read somewhere there's not really a standard for how and when ekkies molt. She's currently shedding a little bit more.

@EkkieLu might have more to add. You've got a good start on the diet, and I still don't know how to talk to vets about it, or if I should even try.

He's a cutie!
 

Fia Baby

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Your vet is partially right - feathers won't change colors after they molt, but they can definitely suffer from wear and tear. Superficial wear and tear can rub off the pigment and make them appear black. This happens a lot on wing and tail feathers because they're being brushed against cage bars so often. Is your guy spending a lot of time playin on his back? Does he play rough and rub around on his cage bars or the lay on the bottom? Is there something that he's squeezing under or past during play? The fact that his new feathers are coming in green supports the idea that his old feathers are just... old, and will be replaced with beautiful ones in their own time. I think your diet sounds great, and I wouldn't add more pellets. On the contrary, I'd try to give them as little as possible with an eclectus. Your vet may not be an expert on all species of birds, but rather be making a general recommendation for all birds. Eclectus seem to be very different in terms of their dietary needs and some of their behaviors. Wait and see what others say, and ask them about giving him a tiny bit of red palm oil on a regular basis. It's supposed to be great for feathers.
 

EkkieLu

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Ekkies must have a mainly fresh fruit diet!!! The veggies and beans you mentioned should just be a small fraction of their diet. Their digestive systems are very different from any other birds. Without fruit their health and appearance suffers.
 

MyDjango

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Thanks guys! I'm just not sure why it's taking him so darn long to finish molting. He asks me to scratch his head and neck for him at night and I can feel pin feathers here and there but it's surprising he hasn't molted any large ones at all yet.

Do they eat red palm oil or do you apply it to the feathers or how does that work? I hadn't heard of that one at all! Do you know of a recommended brand?

Your vet is partially right - feathers won't change colors after they molt, but they can definitely suffer from wear and tear. Superficial wear and tear can rub off the pigment and make them appear black. This happens a lot on wing and tail feathers because they're being brushed against cage bars so often. Is your guy spending a lot of time playin on his back? Does he play rough and rub around on his cage bars or the lay on the bottom? Is there something that he's squeezing under or past during play? The fact that his new feathers are coming in green supports the idea that his old feathers are just... old, and will be replaced with beautiful ones in their own time. I think your diet sounds great, and I wouldn't add more pellets. On the contrary, I'd try to give them as little as possible with an eclectus. Your vet may not be an expert on all species of birds, but rather be making a general recommendation for all birds. Eclectus seem to be very different in terms of their dietary needs and some of their behaviors. Wait and see what others say, and ask them about giving him a tiny bit of red palm oil on a regular basis. It's supposed to be great for feathers.
 

Monaco

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The red palm is meant to be ingested. It's a gorgeous color! I put it into something she's going to get for a few days so that I know it's a tiny amount (sometimes I make quinoa, but usually I just add it to warm peas or corn, and then it goes back to the fridge.) it's one that is solid at cool room temperature.

Here's a book I like, and surprisingly the authors will communicate directly if you have questions.
Screenshot_20200130-165719.png
 

Les charlson

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Hi. Just wanting to know how your bird is doing. My Ekkie did two moults to grow a complete set of new feathers after I got her. It was unusual. Her previous owner had cut her feathers. Some of the cut ones didn't drop until the second moult. Diet is important as
EkkieLu mentioned. Definitely more fruit than vegs. The feather problems could be diet, sun related, or could be for a poor quality neonatal food when a baby. They eat fruit so they need food with lots of moisture. Vegs come second. Have you though of offering butternut squash and pumpkin, and sweet potato mash?
 

Fuzzy

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I see the stress bars in the first picture.... with perhaps a little over preening/feather snipping? Then I see bronzing in the last two pictures. Over handling will produce this blackened look - especially if hands are greasy/sweaty. It happens to my Pionus if I handle him too much. They will molt out and lovely new green feathers will grow in. Any flight feathers yet? Here is a pic of a young Kobe with his blackened feathers before I realised I had to be careful handling him:



The beans/legumes you have been feeding I would say need to be balanced with more grains - sprouted or cooked. I would stop feeding quinoa though because of the iron content. The fruit and veg sound great. You can sprout your own legumes and grains - I do for all of my birds.
 

mythic55

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I just wanted to chime in: unhealthy ekkies WILL change the color of their feathers. Unlike almost any other bird. They will get that black appearance (that is a massive warning sign!).

Please post your diet immediately so we can assist.
Red palm oil in Ekkies should be used in moderation- and by that, I mean dont give it at all.
 
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