Why does Sunny bite me when I do these things?

[hlasdf]

Hi everyone! I was hoping if you guys could help me with some more biting problems.

When Sunny's playing with toys, he sometimes drops them and I come over to pick them up and hand them back to him. When I do this, he immediately starts lunging at my fingers as they come closer and tries to grind his beak on them when I come close enough for him to take the toy back. He didn't always do this. My first thought was that it was because he was angry that I was touching his stuff, but I'm not so sure. Any idea how to get him to be okay with getting handed his toys? He doesn't bite my hand on other occasions except for the next one.
This same thing happens when we're training and I try to hand him a treat. When this happens, I think it's because I'm not giving him a seed that he'd rather have. I usually end training as soon as this starts.

 

[Ankou]

It sounds to me like it's that you are touching his stuff.
I don't know how territorial conures are, but Peanut will have the same reaction and yes, that is what it means.

As for changing it, well... Hopefully someone else has more meaningful advice there but I'm not positive it can ever be completely changed and there is no easy fix.
Basically just keep handing him his toys and hope he eventually figures out your helping him. You are returning his object, not taking it. I went through that with Peanut, and eventually she grew to trust I would return it, and paces anxiously. Goes right back to playing instead of threatening me. It only took a couple years.


As for handing them treats, we never got past her threatening to bite me for "fingering" (for lack of a better word) certain high-value food. To this day, if I offer her a millet seed between two fingers it's basically a crapshoot whether she decides to bite or not. I just don't do it.
If I'm going to offer her a treat, I have to get creative.

And you can too.
Try offering different treats in different ways. in the middle of an open palm, stuck to a fingertip with some gooey fruit/almond butter, put the treat on a spoon and offer it that way, even a popcicle stick you can hand him with seeds stuck to it using fruit juice/almond butter/mash, keeping your fingers out of range. Or work with him on a stand with a food dish, and place treats in the dish. Try different treats too, some foods may be more guarded than others.

 

[Theresa]

Make him stretch to get the toy or treat, that way you avoid the bite.

 

[Feathered Antics]

How do you know that's what it means, though? Be careful when labeling behavior: constructs can be useful but they also give us a false sensation of "solving" a problem, when actually we most of the times have no means/intention to investigate if our assumption is correct. And even we are, it doesn't give us any info on what to actually do! : )
To me, it doesn't sound like it's has to be the touching of his stuff at all. Many parrots can become pretty excited when they play with/are handed a toy, and in that excited state it's very easy to "flip" to lunging out. Also, it's very common for some parrots to actually think it's a bit scary when hands approach them holding items, even if it's toys they are accustomed to. Might be a combination of both, or something else. Hard to say without being able to watch his body language and get more background info!

In other words: we can't say "why" he does it. No one here can read birdy minds. : ) However, my advice to you would be to pay close attention to body language when you are handing him a toy. What does he do that you can observe? What's his posture like, how does his eyes look (pinning, eye shape), how are his feathers positioned on different body parts?
Any sign of over excitement/insecurity/aggression, i would simply back off with the toy. And, like someone else mentioned above: when you give it to him, hold the item so that he can reach that, but not your fingers, just to be sure.

Does he always bite when you give him food/toys from your hands? If not, under what circumstances doesn't he do it? : )

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

I am having the same problem with Boca GCC. When I first come into the room with either breakfast or supper, Boca is so excited about getting fresh food, he immediately flips into an aggressive mode and I cannot serve his food fast enough for him. I can tell he is hungry and wants to eat, but he will take one bite and then lunge and bite me; or he will chase after the fully loaded tray and switch into biting whatever part of my body he can get hold of at the time. When he does this, I completely remove the food from his physical location, either by putting it down on a feeding station or dropping what I have in my hand. If he continues in his aggression, I cover him in a towel and remove him from my body and lay him down on a table or other flat surface and let him find his way out of the towel himself; this usually gives him enough time to forget about being aggressive and seems to reset his outlook. Then I try again, either holding a piece of food for him, or dish out his and Pichu's servings onto their foraging station. Boca has become more and more able to be redirected in most instances and he is even showing me some affection, rubbing his head and neck against my cheek or ear or even under my chin and making a sort of purring sound.

Pichu, the hen, is much less aggressive, but she is very hand shy and if I reach toward her with a treat or a toy, she lunges toward my hand but does not bite. So I have been reaching toward her to show her the treat or toy and then speaking to her to reassure her I won't touch her unless she wants me to before I lay the treat or toy in front of her to explore or eat. She has not bitten me for over a week now and is doing less lunging, often opting to just open her beak and threaten without the lunge. I think she is going to come around soon; Pichu was a hand tame pet before she was placed in the aviary and got very wild.

I see a very big difference in the level and type of aggression between Boca, the cock, and Pichu, the hen. Boca tends to lunge and bite first and think later; whereas Pichu prefers to bluff lunge or even just threaten and not bite unless pushed to accept being touched. So, with Boca, I offer treats and toys, but prefer to just place them in front of him instead of insist he take them from my hand or eat from my hand. Pichu, I just offer the toys and treats and watch her body language and if she allows, I let her take it from my hand and if she does not, I just put in down where she can reach it.

It is important to study a bird's behavior and learn what precedes a bite so one can avoid a bite, rather than just take a bite. Biting can become and endemic reaction to every situation involving hands, and one thing a bird parront wants to avoid is accidentally patterning a bird to bite first and think later. Avoiding bites and aggression is key to earning the trust and love of your bird; because by respecting their moods and wishes not to be touched, you show them that you respect their wishes to not be touched. If you constantly force your choices on the bird, then they have no reason to trust you or respect your wishes either!

 

[Hallie]

I have a GCC that does this. He will get mad over seemingly nothing and lash out (ow!) at me. I've tried ignoring him, giving him treats, putting him back into the cage, putting him down, telling him no, etc and nothing has really helped. I usually ignore the bite and continue doing whatever I was doing in hopes he will get over it, and usually he does.

Conures have a bad tendency to want everything their way, and they learn that if they lash out or bite then their owner will leave them alone. You have to teach them otherwise. Mine will bite me and scream at me for simple things like getting him off of the playstand, asking him to step up at the "wrong" time, and even touching anything around him. Recently I started to do whatever it was he didn't like even if he gets upset, this is the only way to show him that a bite will not get me to leave him alone. I usually get one or two bad bites, and then he realizes his efforts are futile and he gives up. You just have to show them that they don't run things, you do.

Usually when a bird tries to bite leaving them alone is the best option, but it's much different with nippy conures. If you leave them alone when they get nippy over something, they'll learn that the aggressive behavior gets them what they want.

 

[Hallie]

It is important to study a bird's behavior and learn what precedes a bite so one can avoid a bite, rather than just take a bite. Biting can become and endemic reaction to every situation involving hands, and one thing a bird parront wants to avoid is accidentally patterning a bird to bite first and think later. Avoiding bites and aggression is key to earning the trust and love of your bird; because by respecting their moods and wishes not to be touched, you show them that you respect their wishes to not be touched. If you constantly force your choices on the bird, then they have no reason to trust you or respect your wishes either!

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I think it's a little different when it's involving a nippy Conure. These birds are extremely moody, and if you do everything according to the moody bird's mood, they will surely learn to take advantage of it. Like human 2 year olds, Conures want everything their way and they throw fits if they don't get it. I don't believe in catering to your bird when it comes to moody and senseless biting. Papaya went through a bad stage of testing her limits with anyone who held her. She would bite them hard until they told her no, if they didn't tell her no she would continue biting. Not because of anything the person did, just because she's a conure and that's what they do. They're testy birds until they learn their limits. If my bird doesn't want to come out of the cage that's fine and I'll respect that, but if the bird is lashing out on me for asking him to step up outside of the cage or because I'm feeding the other birds and not him I'm NOT respecting his mood because if I do he'll learn it's okay. You have to teach the bird what is okay and what isn't. The birds live in my world, not vice versa. I won't be late to work because I'm waiting for my moody teenage Conure to 'want' to get off of his playstand. I'd rather show him a bite is futile and get him off the playstand despite his opposition, instead of catering to him and showing him he can completely control when he gets off the playstand. Once the bird learns a bite won't deter their owner, they get much sweeter and genuinely enjoy themselves more. I've taught my birds to vocalize their moods rather than bite, and I'm quite happy with that.

 

[Feathered Antics]

Wow, Holly, i really don't agree. If a bird lunges or nips when you are trying to get them off a playstand, "taking the bite" and showing them they have no control over the situation is not something you want to do. It does nothing to improve a birds trust in you and it's not a fun experience for anyone. Further, before that bite, the bird has shown a myriad of signals to tell you it doesn't want to play along. What you need to do is instead working on making stepping up at all times rewarding for the parrot. "Nippy conures" are no different than any other parrot here, really.

 

[Hallie]

To the OP, I'd play a throw game. Get a box of foot toys and hand him each toy. I had a box of old plastic business cards and my GCC would throw each one as I handed them to her. It made a mess for me to clean up but me handing her things became a game and something she enjoys.

Wow, Holly, i really don't agree. If a bird lunges or nips when you are trying to get them off a playstand, "taking the bite" and showing them they have no control over the situation is not something you want to do. It does nothing to improve a birds trust in you and it's not a fun experience for anyone. Further, before that bite, the bird has shown a myriad of signals to tell you it doesn't want to play along. What you need to do is instead working on making stepping up at all times rewarding for the parrot. "Nippy conures" are no different than any other parrot here, really.

It's Hallie
To each their own, I thought the same thing when I got my first conure. Two conures later I've learned what works best for my conures and my flock. My birds trust me immensely. I can do anything with my sweet Papaya. I can roll her over, pet her, put her on her back, put her in my pocket, and anything else I'd ever want to do with her. She is an extremely well behaved bird, my other two are on their way but they're still very young hyper birds. Not every bird is alike, and there are differences between species. When I say Conures are different it isn't an opinion, it's a fact. In my experience they act very differently than other species. They will bite you for any reason if you let them. They key is gently teaching them that biting is not right in every situation. Conures are very headstrong birds and you simply cannot cater to their every mood (which changes frequently). If my bird wants space, he/she gets space. But if my bird wants to fly up and bite everywhere for the heck of it, that's not okay, and Conures do that very thing. They bite for every reason, and they do NOT always show any warning or anything. They're simply nippy birds, not mean birds. Most young conures aren't biting for any given reason, they're biting for the heck of it, because they want to. My youngest will fly to me and randomly bite the crap out of me. What do I do? I get him to step up and talk to him, and carry on with the day ignoring the bite. He's biting me because it's his nature to bite things, not because he needs any type of space or anything.
I think you're misunderstanding Conures in general.

 

[roxynoodle]

Rowdy does not like people touching her stuff. Conures can be pretty territorial.

They also get easily wound up and go into overdrive. I suggest if you see body language suggesting a lunge (and bite) to ignore Sunny for a few minutes to let him calm down. The good news is they calm down as quickly as they get wound up

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

Dealing with GCCs, to me, is like dealing with my little brother (Donny is 17 years younger than I am) when he was having his teen rebellion; it did not matter what the fight was about, the fight was always over the top and full out war: the goal was to remove the over the top/war from the fight and sanely have the GCC/my brother make a choice that got me closer to my goal with the GCC/my brother without anyone being bitten/hurt feelings happening and TRUST still in tact.

GGC doesn't want to step up that second and refuses a bite? Ok, I will provide a toy or treat placed near the bird and remove my attention from the bird while it checks out toy or treat and allows it to change its mood. Come back two minutes later, ask for the step up again, probably will not get the same result and hopefully the bird steps up. If not, start over again. OK. Five minutes of my time is wasted negotiating with a tempermental GCC, but eventually he steps up and goes into his cage and the bird sees I respect his emotional needs and trust is maintained. There is always more than one way to something done and if I do not have to flaunt my power over the bird to get them inside their cage, then the trust that bird is learning to give me is not trampled on and we are producing a common interaction between us that may someday become a friendship.

But if I push and always play from my power, my force, I never will win the bird over as a friend; only as a subordinate creature that knows he has to always comply with my commands. I would rather build trust and friendship.