Who is familiar with Bird-Elicious?

[Apirog]

I just recently discovered Bird-Elicious. Website link: Organic Best Bird Food & Seed! BirD-elicious! Origins! I did find an old thread and it appeared to be a bit controversial and it also said this company went out of business. According to the website, they temporally had to shut down while husband was layed off and she was very ill. The owner runs a rehab sanctuary for special needs birds so the food company is on the side.

Is anyone familiar with their food? I am interested in any feedback you have. I realize parrot diet is a very debated subjected. As far as mutilation and plucking goes, there doesn't seem to be a "one diet fits all" out there. I want then best diet for my CAG's. I am open to introducing new things as long as the ingredients are safe and the company is reputable.

 

[Nikomania]

It's awesome food. We've purchased the Eclectus and Gray mixes. Good quality food.

 

[Apirog]

@Nikomania is there any treats you would recommend for a grey?

 

[mochiballs]

Ohhh never heard of it but will definitely be checking it out.
Any suggestions for a grey?

 

[jmfleish]

Machelle Pachion and Birdilicious have been around for at least a decade and there's always been one controversy or another with her and her food. I got on board with her in 2005 but started questioning whether I could trust her sanity after seeing how she handled dissent from the avian community and ultimately walked away.

I think that if you're looking for a diet to help a plucker that I would try to stick with something all natural and eliminate things that are known to cause problems. I know there are a few threads on this forum, most likely in the Eclectus section, that talk about doing this. The Yahoo group, Feeding Fathers will also give you a lot of details about trying such diets and if you search their archives you'll probably also find more about Birdilicious as well.

The problem with plucking is that there are a multitude of reasons that can cause it and generally a bird is probably picking for more than just one reason. So, you may fix one problem but not all of them and the issue as a whole doesn't go away. The first thing I would definitely do is get a full vet check.

Finally, the one thing that I really don't like about Machelle is that she has a lot of very interesting theories but never really backs them up with anything. You can feed your birds most of the same foods yourself just by shopping for many of the items online from places like your local food coop and Nuts.com.

 

[Mizzely]

I'm only familiar with it up to the point where my vet thinks the owner is a quack. LOL

 

[jmfleish]

I'm only familiar with it up to the point where my vet thinks the owner is a quack. LOL

I have to say that I stopped feeding the stuff because I was worried that Machelle might poison the stuff! She's really crazy!

 

[Apirog]

@jmfleish I am very torn about what i have read but I need to dig deeper to find actual feedback on the food itself. Most of the negative comments are regarding the owner's personality. She definitely sounds difficult and lacks respect for other opinions which is really unfortunate. Doctors and Nutrition Consultants have their "theories" and "opinions" on nutrition but nothing is 100%certain and therefore they should keep an open mind and respect other opinions/feedback(negative or positive). Do you know of anything in particular about her food/diet that is bad?

I was always told Harrison's was the best. I work full time so I unfortunately dont have time to make my own foods from scratch. I just want to find the best/healthiest dry mix (pellet or something like bird elicious) that I can find. And continue to feed vegetables and fruits on the side. Some of Machelle's writings and all the opposition made me question all pellets on the market and even foods like bird elicious

Now that you mention it, i can see what you mean by the lack of support. She does give some great info about pellets, ingredients and what parrots shouldn't consume but their is a level of vagueness in regards to her "findings" and the supporting facts that back them up. It is not 100% transparent. I figured their were detailed published writings about her research somewhere online. I also noticed how she puts ALL pellets in today's market into (1) category without distinguishing between different types. I personally thought Harrisons was a superior pellet that addressed common issues with pellets in today's market place.

 

[Apirog]

Gosh- I can't believe how many people have had a bad encounter. Again, it seems to be more of a personality flaw and not about her food. I have to wonder if she has some type of personality/mental disorder. I have been recently talking to her on FB and she was actually very kind and answered every question I had. She gave her opinion and thats what immediately made me visit her website because everything she said was very interesting. Here is me being optimistic but... maybe she got herself some help while she temporarily shut down her business. Her website does state that she has an illness but it goes into no specifics. She seems like she is very driven and dedicated to her research. Some of the most intelligent people are crazy... lol!

 

[Mizzely]

It's the bold statements that go against actual studies (like, parrots shouldn't eat veggies at all) that makes me question her and her food. I know we don't have all the facts about parrots and diet, but I do know that many pellets are backed by well respected vets. In my opinion, and based on science, Harrison's is superior in that they are well documented, well researched, and have very good quality control. That being said, most pellets are still better than all seeds. They fill in a lot of the holes we DO know captive, indoor parrots have, like Vitamin D3 and iodine.

Science and research wins for me, not ideology.

One of the most respected vets regarding avian nutrition it's Dr. Scott Echols. He has a Facebook group, Nutrition for Pets, and he has addressed this food before on there. I'd check it out

 

[Nikomania]

Well, I never knew anything about her story. All I can say is that the food seems really nice, and that it contains items not seen in other mixes, such as flowers.

 

[jmfleish]

The thing about nutrition that is frustrating is that it's hard to understand, even on a human level. When we throw in the fact that we don't even really know much about what these parrots eat in the wild it gets very confusing. Then we have to consider the fact that their diet is going to change considerably when they are living in our homes instead of in the living room, does it really matter what they eat in the wild? So, it gets even more confusing.

I've put a lot of time and effort into studying what I should be feeding my birds and I've come to the same basic conclusion that Shawna has. Avian nutrition is fairly new and came from chicken nutrition. It started back in the early '90s. They put a great deal of research into and the science is incredibly solid. I've had discussion after discussion with my vet about pellets and other foods and it does come back to pellets but for a good reason. My vet doesn't push one pellet over another but I do think there are good pellets and bad pellets out there. I personally feed Roudybush but I think that Zupreem is a good pellet and Harrison's is obviously at the top of the list as well. I think that TOPs is good too but the problem with TOPs is that they don't contain the synthetic vitamins. That's for a reason as there are people out there who don't want those synthetic vitamins for various reasons.

Pellets aren't going to be a complete diet but they're about as complete as you're going to get. Like Shawna, I like to look at them as the part of the diet that fills in the gaps in the diet that I can't possibly fill with a fresh diet or a diet such as the stuff that Machelle sells. There are other diets out there like Machelle's that you can buy that I would offer up. Phoenix Foraging Unpellet mix is a great one (Phoenxforagingrolls.com) that I would highly recommend. Danita has some great products at Avian Organics that you should check out if you haven't yet. Mixing pellets isn't such a bad idea for a variety of reasons, mostly because if something were to happen to you, anyone could come and pick up for you and they wouldn't be picky about what they ate. Unless your bird does have some kind of specific allergy to something in pellets, I would definitely make that the main part of their diet with fresh veggies, fruits, and nuts as another piece.

Machelle's ideas are not new. I don't think her food will hurt your bird but I wouldn't stop offering pellets. Variety is great and Machelle is offering that within her food. The nice thing about Birdilicious foods is that you will get some foraging with that. The Unpellet mix from Phoenix Foraging is similar. We are considering offering our dry mix up for sale as well. These premium mixes are expensive though.

Once again, if you really want to know more about Birdilicious and it's nutritional values, you would probably find a lot on the Feeding Feathers group on Yahoo. You can just google it and join and then do searches on the name. I know there was a lot of talk about it over the years.

 

[Apirog]

@jmfleish Thank you so much for the great advice. I checked out Pheonix Foraging's site and I really like their offering. They are more expensive but if my girls like it then ill get on the monthly plan. I like that they have a "sample" that you can buy before committing to a larger buy. I am not going to stop feeding harrisons (with zupreem mixed in) so this will just be in addition to the pellets. I am still very confused about the vegetables. Machelle has been the only one to tell me no broccoli, cauliflower and potatoes. She said botanically classified vegetables strip nutrition out of a parrot's system and leaves them with a lot less than they need to maintain health. I never bothered to question her on it as I wouldn't expect a simple answer back. I figured i could do my own research on it and to see what the popular opinions are. I would hope that feeding something like broccoli in moderation would do no significant harm. It is offered as a "side and my greys LOVE broccoli like i love ice-cream.

I did request to join feeding feathers so i will definitely research the reviews once accepted. Please keep me on your list of "interested customers" if you start selling your dry mix.

 

[jmfleish]

@jmfleish Thank you so much for the great advice. I checked out Pheonix Foraging's site and I really like their offering. They are more expensive but if my girls like it then ill get on the monthly plan. I like that they have a "sample" that you can buy before committing to a larger buy. I am not going to stop feeding harrisons (with zupreem mixed in) so this will just be in addition to the pellets. I am still very confused about the vegetables. Machelle has been the only one to tell me no broccoli, cauliflower and potatoes. She said botanically classified vegetables strip nutrition out of a parrot's system and leaves them with a lot less than they need to maintain health. I never bothered to question her on it as I wouldn't expect a simple answer back. I figured i could do my own research on it and to see what the popular opinions are. I would hope that feeding something like broccoli in moderation would do no significant harm. It is offered as a "side and my greys LOVE broccoli like i love ice-cream.

I did request to join feeding feathers so i will definitely research the reviews once accepted. Please keep me on your list of "interested customers" if you start selling your dry mix.

I'm confused...broccoli and cauliflower are not botanically classified vegetables are they? And technically, potatoes aren't considered a veggie at all but a starch. I was under the impression that a botanically classified vegetable was anything that had a seed in it. See, this is why Machelle drives me a little buggy. I think broccoli is quite good for our birds and I feed it! I did stumble upon something interesting about cauliflower recently and that it might contain higher levels of zinc depending on where it was grown...I think that's what I read but I can't quite remember. I feed less of that now but I would think your bird would have to eat a lot of it to have problems with it and that it would pertain to all veggies not just cauliflower. I don't feed potatoes in general because of the starchiness but I do feed sweet potato. I'd say, keep feeding broccoli!

I'll keep you in mind if we decide to go with the dry mix. It's mostly just freeze dried fruits and veggies with a combination of healthy whole seeds and nuts. It's expensive which is why we haven't decided which way we want to go with it at this time but I think we might try some free samples at some point soon and see what the general reaction is.

 

[Danita]

When she was opened before she closed. I had a batch of moldy stuff.
Not sure what the quality control is like now.
She does seem so radical!

 

[Danita]

It's weird, we worry so much about every little thing about diet.
I used to give my birds a little this, that, etc.
Then one day my grey became very ill. She didn't have enough nutrients to fight it. She had to be hospitalized
My vet advised me to feed her Harrison's only, no extras. Why? Because it is a complete diet and they don't pick through and eat only their favorites.
So for a year, all my birds were on a strict diet and only had the occasional treat. Just so they could get all the proper nutrition. Then I started introducing, the other foods again. Only as a treat and I am still that way.

 

[jmfleish]

It's weird, we worry so much about every little thing about diet.
I used to give my birds a little this, that, etc.
Then one day my grey became very ill. She didn't have enough nutrients to fight it. She had to be hospitalized
My vet advised me to feed her Harrison's only, no extras. Why? Because it is a complete diet and they don't pick through and eat only their favorites.
So for a year, all my birds were on a strict diet and only had the occasional treat. Just so they could get all the proper nutrition. Then I started introducing, the other foods again. Only as a treat and I am still that way.

I feed mostly pellets too. Where I struggle is with my Ekkies who just need more fresh food and need more fiber than the other birds do. I also think that the greys and Reggie D2 benefit from more fat in their diet so they get a few more nuts than the Amazons and the Galahs do. I do try to offer so fresh raw, colorful veggies and fruits but I stay away from almost all packaged foods except Doritos every now and then that I use as a bribe and a tiny bit of cheese that some of them will just about kill for!

Attached is a picture of Aspen enjoying his favorite snack, a fresh strawberry.