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One Person Toos

TikkiTembo

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Chelsea
We've been working with Pamela Clark to better our lives with Chipper for almost 6 weeks. There have been no bites to my husband in that time because they have been instructed to interact only through target training. Pamela said the goal was to eliminate his pair bond with me in order to make Daniel and I equal, thus eliminating the desire to bite Daniel and chase him away. So far, we've seen tiny bits of hopeful progress with things like me teaching him to step up properly, reduction in barbering, and more confidence as bird owners. BUT Chipper still very much hates Daniel, and Dan's at the point that he's just about lost faith that Chipper will ever accept him. He's basically thinking of Chipper as only a money drain that could injure people at this point. Of course that's upsetting to me, I know how sweet and funny and smart Chipper is, but he won't share that side of himself with Dan.
Of course, it has been such a short amount of time that Chip's been here that I know it's far too early to assume anything. But I'm curious about your experiences with this kind of situation, hoping for some encouragement. I don't dream of Chipper lounging on the couch with us, or snuggling like a puppy, I just hope that he will stop wanting to take chunks out of my husband one day.
 

FlyingMacaws

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I have a one person TOO. I don’t mean to sound disheartening but sometimes they will NEVER tolerate what they deem as “competition” My husband refers to “Z” as THE “A-Hole”. Z will not only fly to attack other people but he goes for blood literally. But we work around his issues. Z is at a point where he knows if he goes to attack anyone or anything that he gets “grounded” and instantly put back in his cage. My husband bless his heart still tries to win him over. He is the one that changes out his feed and water gives him treats. But Z won’t have any of it. Z gets more aggressive during breeding season and when he has new feathers coming in.
 

TikkiTembo

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@FlyingMacaws Definitely not disheartening, I'm a realist and know that after 30 years of loving only one person, that may be how he is now. We're prepared to keep him seperate from everyone if needed, but for a minute there, we were feeling hopeful! No matter what, he won't be handled by our children or guests, so it's just Dan or I anyways. Also, he's got tons of new feathers coming in right now, so I'm sure that's contributing to his extra sass lately!
 

FlyingMacaws

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@FlyingMacaws Definitely not disheartening, I'm a realist and know that after 30 years of loving only one person, that may be how he is now. We're prepared to keep him seperate from everyone if needed, but for a minute there, we were feeling hopeful! No matter what, he won't be handled by our children or guests, so it's just Dan or I anyways. Also, he's got tons of new feathers coming in right now, so I'm sure that's contributing to his extra sass lately!
One person TOOs can be our nightmare children but they also need and want love. I’m glad to hear that he has found a home that will work around his Tood.
 

Karen

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I have a one person Macaw. I've had him for 16 years. He's always been a one person bird. He is allowed no physical contact with anyone other than myself as he could and would severely injure them. It is what it is and he's who he is. My husband enjoys him and sings songs to him. I always bring him to the midst of any get together we have in our home (he doesn't fly). Everyone in the family enjoys him as he does them. They talk to him and interact with him and he does with them too, he is a ham! He's happy because he is with his chosen person and still gets to join in on the stories and laughs and is 'part of' in his own way and within his own boundaries.

I hope you don't mind me butting into your 'Too' thread but I just wanted to let you know that a one person bird can very much be part of everything while keeping within their limits.
 

FlyingMacaws

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I have a one person Macaw. I've had him for 16 years. He's always been a one person bird. He is allowed no physical contact with anyone other than myself as he could and would severely injure them. It is what it is and he's who he is. My husband enjoys him and sings songs to him. I always bring him to the midst of any get together we have in our home (he doesn't fly). Everyone in the family enjoys him as he does them. They talk to him and interact with him and he does with them too, he is a ham! He's happy because he is with his chosen person and still gets to join in on the stories and laughs and is 'part of' in his own way and within his own boundaries.

I hope you don't mind me butting into your 'Too' thread but I just wanted to let you know that a one person bird can very much be part of everything while keeping within their limits.
I agree one million percent with this. They can be wonderful family members as long as everyone knows their boundaries.
 

sunnysmom

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I am just on my phone now and it's hard to write a long message but I will write about Elvis and my fiance in the morning.
 

JLcribber

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Took me 18 months of diligent effort to raise my value enough to not be seen as the enemy and actually earn his trust but more importantly his respect. We limit my wife's exposure to him to this day because too much of that just opens another can of worms.

Just keep saying this to Dan over and over. This is a journey. Not a race. If you try to race, you will get a ticket.
 

cassiesdad

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Pamela Clark is one the the best around. :)

Cassie B Bird was a definite one person bird...she tolerated no one else to handle her, except me. She also had an extra dislike for my wife, whom she considered a rival. We tried different techniques with Cass...all we were going for was simple acceptance of my wife in the same room with all three of us...but it simply was not to be.
In fact,after Cassie had her surgery, the vet hospital knew she was ready to come home when she tried to bite any one who had to interact with her.

We have no problems with Milton in that way. He actually enjoys people, and will readily go to anyone...he tends to get excited when he's with new people, so I have to make sure the situation doesn't get him over-excited. He'll flirt with women, which is a little weird, I guess....and try to get under the shirt with men, as he tries with me all the time....
 

Just-passn-thru

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Sorry learn about your struggles with Chipper and your Husband. My Moluccan, Coco, was a handful he could be quite intimidating at times, these big birds are challenging and not to be taken lightly handled with knowledge , caution, experience, . I hope your husband won't throw in the towel with Chipper. Like others have said … It takes commitment, and preseverance
I have a one person Macaw. I've had him for 16 years. He's always been a one person bird. He is allowed no physical contact with anyone other than myself as he could and would severely injure them. It is what it is and he's who he is. My husband enjoys him and sings songs to him. I always bring him to the midst of any get together we have in our home (he doesn't fly). Everyone in the family enjoys him as he does them. They talk to him and interact with him and he does with them too, he is a ham! He's happy because he is with his chosen person and still gets to join in on the stories and laughs and is 'part of' in his own way and within his own boundaries.

I hope you don't mind me butting into your 'Too' thread but I just wanted to let you know that a one person bird can very much be part of everything while keeping within their limits.
 

Rain Bow

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I'm going to butt in here too! Buddy's a Zon & chose my daughter first as "his" person. He got me & switched in his mind who his person was going to be. He chose me, put up w/ my husband & my daughter. Being a single person bird w/ absolutely no socialization that I found out about for probably 23 years, we accepted these fates. Then I joined AA & as you have Pamela, who's an extremely great educator, I had all the veteran members here.

I read, & modified behavior & read & modified. We got it to this.

Buddy & hubby were great segregated from me. They talked, played & hung out together. My Dad was super into music, an audiophile to the extreme before he passed. Buddy loves oldies, Beatles, Mama's & the Papa's, 1950's to almost current (Dad liked electronic & techno stuff too). I have awesome hearing, almost as good as Buddy's, Hubbys hearing not so good. Music & 3 of us just wasn't happening. Too loud for me. So that was "Their thing".

Daughter blows in & out like the wind. 1/2 hour here & hour there. I taught her how to do Buddy's PT. The exercises we did to make Buddy's severely atrophied muscles work again. This was "Their thing".

I learned that aggression seemed to come out most when there were 2 items near my family members. His large nesting cage & me. Elliminate those factors & he's a peach. The bestest bird in the universe. Slowly we began to add me into these "Their times" & he'd behave for a short 5 minute period, but then cranky bird. Slowly we built time up & re-trained most of the aggressive behaviors but it is a ton of work & persistance + lotsa body language watching to know that sometimes it was just a bad time or a bad day (try again tomorrow, in an hour whatever) The nest cage however we just couldn't make work. The hardest part was to support the family members when there was a rejection. My husband would get really sad while my daughter would get angry & leave.

I hope Chipper comes into his feathers & learns. You are still in that "Honeymoon" phase & as we both know his behavior's will change. Stay strong as they will all find their nitch w/ him whether it's sing, dancing or just enjoy the quite. They will all need your support & coaching & your a strong Chicky, I think you'll be able to handle it but it for me was THE #1 most difficult part!

:hug1:
 

Just-passn-thru

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I'm going to butt in here too! Buddy's a Zon & chose my daughter first as "his" person. He got me & switched in his mind who his person was going to be. He chose me, put up w/ my husband & my daughter. Being a single person bird w/ absolutely no socialization that I found out about for probably 23 years, we accepted these fates. Then I joined AA & as you have Pamela, who's an extremely great educator, I had all the veteran members here.

I read, & modified behavior & read & modified. We got it to this.

Buddy & hubby were great segregated from me. They talked, played & hung out together. My Dad was super into music, an audiophile to the extreme before he passed. Buddy loves oldies, Beatles, Mama's & the Papa's, 1950's to almost current (Dad liked electronic & techno stuff too). I have awesome hearing, almost as good as Buddy's, Hubbys hearing not so good. Music & 3 of us just wasn't happening. Too loud for me. So that was "Their thing".

Daughter blows in & out like the wind. 1/2 hour here & hour there. I taught her how to do Buddy's PT. The exercises we did to make Buddy's severely atrophied muscles work again. This was "Their thing".

I learned that aggression seemed to come out most when there were 2 items near my family members. His large nesting cage & me. Elliminate those factors & he's a peach. The bestest bird in the universe. Slowly we began to add me into these "Their times" & he'd behave for a short 5 minute period, but then cranky bird. Slowly we built time up & re-trained most of the aggressive behaviors but it is a ton of work & persistance + lotsa body language watching to know that sometimes it was just a bad time or a bad day (try again tomorrow, in an hour whatever) The nest cage however we just couldn't make work. The hardest part was to support the family members when there was a rejection. My husband would get really sad while my daughter would get angry & leave.

I hope Chipper comes into his feathers & learns. You are still in that "Honeymoon" phase & as we both know his behavior's will change. Stay strong as they will all find their nitch w/ him whether it's sing, dancing or just enjoy the quite. They will all need your support & coaching & your a strong Chicky, I think you'll be able to handle it but it for me was THE #1 most difficult part!

:hug1:
@Rain Bow I hope @TikkiTembo can glean solutions' from your in-depth personal experience with your Amazon "Buddy " your approach to redirecting and reconditioning is very well structured and thought out.
:teacher: :goodjob:
 

sunnysmom

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My situation is a little different than yours, but like @Rain Bow's, Elvis switched his person. Elvis is actually a pretty social bird. The only person he attacks is Howie, and Howie started out as his person. I won't go into my theories on what happened but will just address how we deal with it. And basically, I keep them separated. It's a bit disheartening as I had visions of the 3 of us hanging out watching TV, etc. (Actually not even visions- we did it the first 9 months or so that we had him.) Now, in the mornings, I get up before Howie and let Elvis out. Then, he goes back in his cage when either I leave for work or Howie comes downstairs. Elvis is in the living room during the day, which if Howie is home, that's where Howie will be too. I think this actually works well in that they get safe one on one time together. Howie will give him some cashews (his favorite) and rehang his toy clips for him. That's about the extent of it but at least it's some pleasant interaction for the two of them. In the evenings, I either take Elvis upstairs or Howie goes upstairs. Periodically, I will let Elvis out for a short period with Howie or let him visit with Howie briefly upstairs. I am always right there to intervene if needed. I keep these interactions short- like 5 minutes- because Elvis tends to get too excited around Howie too quickly. Also, if Elvis flies to Howie on his own, I take him away. Elvis is starting to understand that if he flies to Howie, he's getting scooped up and moved and is actually starting to do it less frequently.

The night we came home from Elvis staying with @cassiesdad was actually the first night in a year and a half that Elvis was out in the living room with both of us for more than 5-10 minutes. I don't know if he's finally getting that he can't fly to Howie or if he was just being a needy momma's boy after being away. LOL. But Howie didn't want to go upstairs, so I let Elvis out thinking I would go upstairs with Elvis. He flew to Howie once. I scooped him up. And then Elvis just wanted to play on top of his cage for a bit. And then just sat with me, completely ignoring Howie, until I put him to bed. I'm going to assume this was a rare occurrence and not something that's going to happen all the time, but if it just happens once in awhile I'll be happy.

So, in summary (after my long ramble, LOL). Try to have safe, positive, short interactions with Chipper and your husband. And the rest of the time keep them separated. It can be hard. And Howie sometimes gets completely fed up with Elvis. But I'm determined to make it work, as I know you are. :) Hopefully, you can find a middle ground with them.
 

TikkiTembo

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Chelsea
Thank you @sunnysmom !
I had a really productive chat with Pamela about it today, she had wonderful advice. She said if Dan wants nothing to do with Chipper for now, then that's okay. Just stop involving him for now, and continue our work. She said one day, maybe he'll look over and see how well we're doing and want to join in. She said to think of it the way I think of Chipper. Dan will do what's most reinforcing to him.. Right now, it's better for Dan to stay away, so that's what he wants. When it's rewarding for him to interact, that will feel better than staying away, and that's what he'll want. I think a lot of the problem is that Dan's feelings are hurt. He thought Chipper liked him, and he doesn't and hurt him.
So, I'll ignore Dan's negative behaviors, and reward his positive ones. Haha I told him that Pamela gave him full permission to ignore Chipper, and I think he feels relieved. And so do I! I'll just keep working with him to establish basic training, and if Dan ever wants to join us, he'll be welcomed with open arms!
 

sunnysmom

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Thank you @sunnysmom !
I had a really productive chat with Pamela about it today, she had wonderful advice. She said if Dan wants nothing to do with Chipper for now, then that's okay. Just stop involving him for now, and continue our work. She said one day, maybe he'll look over and see how well we're doing and want to join in. She said to think of it the way I think of Chipper. Dan will do what's most reinforcing to him.. Right now, it's better for Dan to stay away, so that's what he wants. When it's rewarding for him to interact, that will feel better than staying away, and that's what he'll want. I think a lot of the problem is that Dan's feelings are hurt. He thought Chipper liked him, and he doesn't and hurt him.
So, I'll ignore Dan's negative behaviors, and reward his positive ones. Haha I told him that Pamela gave him full permission to ignore Chipper, and I think he feels relieved. And so do I! I'll just keep working with him to establish basic training, and if Dan ever wants to join us, he'll be welcomed with open arms!
I understand that too. Howie's feelings are definitely hurt that Elvis bites him. It's weird because Elvis clearly still likes him- but then he bites him. What Pamela says makes sense. There's no sense in pushing the issue. I basically do the same thing I guess. I don't force interaction between the two. (Although I did buy a book on cockatoos and left it on Howie's nightstand to read................ ;))
 

Rain Bow

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Thank you @sunnysmom !
I had a really productive chat with Pamela about it today, she had wonderful advice. She said if Dan wants nothing to do with Chipper for now, then that's okay. Just stop involving him for now, and continue our work. She said one day, maybe he'll look over and see how well we're doing and want to join in. She said to think of it the way I think of Chipper. Dan will do what's most reinforcing to him.. Right now, it's better for Dan to stay away, so that's what he wants. When it's rewarding for him to interact, that will feel better than staying away, and that's what he'll want. I think a lot of the problem is that Dan's feelings are hurt. He thought Chipper liked him, and he doesn't and hurt him.
So, I'll ignore Dan's negative behaviors, and reward his positive ones. Haha I told him that Pamela gave him full permission to ignore Chipper, and I think he feels relieved. And so do I! I'll just keep working with him to establish basic training, and if Dan ever wants to join us, he'll be welcomed with open arms!
This was the absolutely hardest situation for my hubby also. I found if I pushed they just got madder w/ one another faster. In their own time they'll find one another again (Buddy & Hubby did many times) & it was a much nicer event for the 2 of them. I got nervous a time or 2 that I was going to switch places between the Hubby in Buddy's eyes. It would've hurt but I only want Buddy @ his happiest! Tons of hugs & support for you my friend! :bighug:
 
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