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Feel like I am failing my birds

DurgaRose

Walking the driveway
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11/24/19
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172
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Tucson AZ
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Emily
I have been dealing with a Lovebird who has been plucking for the last 7 months now. And now I know for certain my gcc is plucking too. I honestly am feeling so depressed and feel like I am failing my birds :( I've taken my lovie to two different vets but neither are certified in avian care and have not really helped much. I am moving to Tucson in a little over a month, right now I am in NM, and when I move I will have access to actual avian vets. The vet here did do testing on my lovie and ruled out most health conditions. My thinking was that this started due to hormones because he started plucking in late summer and was very hormonal. Also the areas he plucks, and now bites at until he bleeds, are his rear & his legs. Now recently he has also started it on his shoulder area. I didn't realize he was doing it until one day he ended up with a broken blood tail feather, rushed him to the vet and she removed it. Then he started fussing non stop with his back side and then I soon after noticed a bald spot back there. I know removing the blood feather was painful and my next thought was that he then was plucking from the physical trauma. I honestly do not know what happened first, if the blood feather was a result of plucking or if the plucking was a result of the blood feather being removed. I also am not 100% sure Kiwee, my lovie is a male. I thought male just because of the type of hormonal behavior (regurgitating, and doing this thing where he'll rapidly scratch his head while making a fast clicking sound then spins around in a circle) and there is no nesting behavior. But I am still new to having birds and am just not sure. He is very bonded to me. I had considered trying to get him a little friend but I was advised not to because of how bonded he is to me.
Then there is my beautiful, healthy gcc. Occasionally, over the last few months I would see a few grey downy feathers in his cage and was worried he too was plucking. I called a reputable parrot shop and described what I was seeing and they said he is likely still molting. But last night, Kiwee had a really rough night. He makes these horrible noises when he is "fussing" with himself and it was on and off all night. (both birds are in my bedroom) It must have kept Amigo, my gcc awake too. Well, this morning when I uncovered their cages I found an alarming amount of downy feathers in my gcc cage and also a few small colored feathers. My heart absolutely sank and I have been crying all morning. I feel like I am failing these amazing birds! It stresses me out and makes my heart break. It has been such a miserable last 7 months with Kiwee doing this I would always say, thank God Amigo is Okay!!! But now he's going at himself too!!! :sad11: I have tried so much to help Kiwee: bought him a really large flight cage, taken him to the vet dozens of times, buy them new toys, make sure they have plenty of forging activity, put a humidifier in their room, bought calming spray from Christine's Chop Shop, give them red palm oil supplement, feed them really good Harrison's pellets, give them plenty of fresh veggies and fruit, increased their dark sleepy time, put chamomile in his food, give them both at least 3 hours out of the cage with me every day, tried moving Kiwees cage to a new spot, I have tried liquid benedryl, prescribed my the vet ,and also gabapentin prescribed by a different vet. And he has good days, okay days, and bad days. Yesterday was a "bad" day and last night was awful.
I am turning here for any advise and also encouragement!! I love my babies SO much!! These are not unhappy or stressed birds!!! I live alone. My place is very quiet and peaceful!! I am home with them most of the day and work evenings for only 4-6 hours. My gcc is a happy bird! He is very playful, loves all his toys, is very vocal, and does not seem like an unhappy bird!! His feathers are bright and shiny and he looks very healthy. There is no sign of illness in either bird! And as I mentioned when the vet did a fecal lab test on Kiwee it came back with no issues. I guess these are my main ?s: Could the plucking my gcc is doing be due to stress caused by my lovie? (like the noises at night?) Should I separate them at night? Based on the behavior I described can anyone make a better determination as to whether my lovie is male or female? I was told by someone that it is more common for female lovies to have such hormonal issues, is that true? Does it sound like hormonal plucking? When I am able to take them to an actual avian specialist vet, I will. I also plan to have dna testing on both birds to determine sex for sure. What can I do in the meantime? How can I help my gcc, as this is a new behavior and I want to stop it before it gets bad!! I know this is a really long post, I am sorry! I have no one to talk to; I don't know anyone with birds :( I feel very depressed. I feel like I am failing them and don't deserve to have them as my companions even though they are everything to me. I already suffer from anxiety and depression which I have really gotten under control over the last decade or so, but this situation has really been hard on me too. It has even affected my job (I have missed many days because I was too worried about Kiwee to go to work. What if he breaks another blood feather, or mutilates himself and bleeds when I am gone!? I have had to put corn starch on him multiple times to stop bleeding) This has also affected my relationship with my boyfriend because all I ever seem to talk about is bird related stuff (whether its good stuff or bad!) Please, can someone offer me advise and support?
 

TikkiTembo

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I have a recovering plucker, and I know how your stomach sinks when you see the feathers on the bottom of the cage. I'm not nearly as experienced as others, but I'll share my personal experiences. We have seen no more plucking and less barbering once we reduced hormonal urges and behaviors. No shoulder time, no nesting material, and no favorite toys to mate with. We also cut out carbs and sugars, even from fruit.
My response will bump your post back up to the top, I hope some members here can help you find answers. You're not failing, take a deep breath and pet your birdies. They know you love them!
 

DurgaRose

Walking the driveway
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11/24/19
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172
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Tucson AZ
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Emily
I have a recovering plucker, and I know how your stomach sinks when you see the feathers on the bottom of the cage. I'm not nearly as experienced as others, but I'll share my personal experiences. We have seen no more plucking and less barbering once we reduced hormonal urges and behaviors. No shoulder time, no nesting material, and no favorite toys to mate with. We also cut out carbs and sugars, even from fruit.
My response will bump your post back up to the top, I hope some members here can help you find answers. You're not failing, take a deep breath and pet your birdies. They know you love them!
Thank you for replying to my post :joyful: I have tried stopping hormonal triggers. The regurgitating has lessened but he (my lovie) is still plucking and chewing at himself. He seems so itchy and twitchy and uncomfortable. Maybe I could take sugar out of his diet and that would calm him down a bit. He loves organic frozen blueberries and I give them to him almost daily with his veggies. But I'm going to take your advise and stop giving them to him for a bit. I spent extra time with my gcc today and am going to give him more time out with me each day and may separate the two of them at night for awhile.
 

MommyBird

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I know it's a really frustrating situation. You can spend so much energy, emotion, and $ looking for causes and solutions.
A basic question - do you have a good humidifier and hygrometer?
another possibility, you could try lupron shots to control hormones if you know that is it, in either male or female birds.
 

Monica

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Can you share recent pictures of Amigo?

This is a good website to check out. Some very thorough pages worth reading! :)




I have Bibi, who's plucking her back, but you'd never know just by looking at her. You have to physically *move* the feathers aside to see the bare spot. Her plucking does not seem to be hormone related, but as to why it's unclear.

We saw a new vet yesterday and she recommended putting her on RegeniFREE. Never heard of it, don't know what it is.... picked up some tumeric for myself on the drive back home (2 hour drive... took over 3 hours to get there thanks to the weather...)... start the RegeniFREE today. It's very orange-y.... look it up.... it's tumeric! Haven't seen her eat it... yet...
 

Toy

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Did you have your bird tested for skin fungus? That's one of the many things that causes them to itch & pluck.

Don't feel bad. Many of us have birds that nip & pick their feathers.
 

SandraK

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Maybe @Birdbabe has some suggestions since she has fids and lives in AZ?
 

DurgaRose

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Tucson AZ
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Emily
Exactly what I was thinking. You are moving to a very dry climate. Perhaps you can look into getting a central humidifier that will also measure the humidify of you home.
Yes I use a humidifier in their room but not the rest of the apartment. I was wondering if the winter season may also have something to do with it? He likes to take baths everyday and I have them on red palm oil to help with their skin and feather health. But it is very dry here. I originally got Kiwee, my Lovie in Ohio. We did not have any issues in Ohio.
 

DurgaRose

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Emily
Did you have your bird tested for skin fungus? That's one of the many things that causes them to itch & pluck.

Don't feel bad. Many of us have birds that nip & pick their feathers.
No we did not test for that. When I take them to the avian vet in Tucson I will bring that up.
Thank you for your response, it really helps me to feel better. I've been beating myself up for months! :(
 

DurgaRose

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Tucson AZ
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Emily
I know it's a really frustrating situation. You can spend so much energy, emotion, and $ looking for causes and solutions.
A basic question - do you have a good humidifier and hygrometer?
another possibility, you could try lupron shots to control hormones if you know that is it, in either male or female birds.
Its super frustrating!! I have heard of the lupron shot, my vet said it is very "expensive and invasive" But again, this came from a vet who is not actually certified as an avian vet. When I move in a little over a month I will finally be able to take them to a vet who specializes in birds! My gcc does seem itchy... and actually yanked out a couple shoulder feathers in front of me this evening. Honestly with my lovie I think its hormonal or maybe a fungal skin issue like another person suggested. With my gcc I have no idea. Do parrots sometimes pluck a bit in the winter then stop??
 

DurgaRose

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Tucson AZ
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Emily
No we did not test for that. When I take them to the avian vet in Tucson I will bring that up.
Thank you for your response, it really helps me to feel better. I've been beating myself up for months! :(
 

DurgaRose

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Emily
Did you have your bird tested for skin fungus? That's one of the many things that causes them to itch & pluck.

Don't feel bad. Many of us have birds that nip & pick their feathers.
In regards to a possible fungal issue, someone on youtube (parrot playhouse) was saying you could add a bit of apple cidar vinagar to their water to help with bacterial and fungal issues. Have you heard of this? How much would I add I wonder?
 

finchly

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Hi, you can safely add 15 ml to a liter of water. That’s a fairly low dose. Try it every day for 4-5 days to start.
 

DurgaRose

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Emily
Can you share recent pictures of Amigo?

This is a good website to check out. Some very thorough pages worth reading! :)




I have Bibi, who's plucking her back, but you'd never know just by looking at her. You have to physically *move* the feathers aside to see the bare spot. Her plucking does not seem to be hormone related, but as to why it's unclear.

We saw a new vet yesterday and she recommended putting her on RegeniFREE. Never heard of it, don't know what it is.... picked up some tumeric for myself on the drive back home (2 hour drive... took over 3 hours to get there thanks to the weather...)... start the RegeniFREE today. It's very orange-y.... look it up.... it's tumeric! Haven't seen her eat it... yet...
I can take some new pics of Amigo tomorrow and post them here. Right now you cant really tell by looking at him. But sometimes little gray downy feathers will pop up through his green feathers around his upper wing and when he is wet it looks like maybe you can tell. But then it may have always looked like that but now that I am paranoid about plucking maybe I am only now noticing. In general though, no you can't tell by looking at him.
Never heard of ReginFree either... I know the red palm oil I use is also very orangey in color too. My birds don't love it but I put it on their nutriberries and they can't resist a nutriberry!!
Going to check out that website now too. Thank you so much for sharing :)
 
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DurgaRose

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Emily
Hi, you can safely add 15 ml to a liter of water. That’s a fairly low dose. Try it every day for 4-5 days to start.
I will try it! thank you :) do you think that would help if it is a fungal problem?
 

Leih

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Its super frustrating!! I have heard of the lupron shot, my vet said it is very "expensive and invasive" But again, this came from a vet who is not actually certified as an avian vet. When I move in a little over a month I will finally be able to take them to a vet who specializes in birds! My gcc does seem itchy... and actually yanked out a couple shoulder feathers in front of me this evening. Honestly with my lovie I think its hormonal or maybe a fungal skin issue like another person suggested. With my gcc I have no idea. Do parrots sometimes pluck a bit in the winter then stop??
I'm so glad you'll get to see an actual avian vet, birds are soooo different from other animals. Their organ systems are very unique. Little dinosaurs! You'll be amazed at how much the AV will know. And don't be so hard on yourself, (I'm awful at blaming myself) you're doing the best you can for your birds but we can't control everything. I know it's hard. :hug9:
 

finchly

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I will try it! thank you :) do you think that would help if it is a fungal problem?
It doesn’t cure a fungus but it holds it down. It does that by changing the ph of the water. It’s perfectly safe to try, and when you see your vet he’ll probably tell you a different dose :D

That is the dose my vet suggested. Hope it helps!
 

MommyBird

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I have heard of the lupron shot, my vet said it is very "expensive and invasive" But again, this came from a vet who is not actually certified as an avian vet.
looking back to 2016 records when I didn't have it combined with something else... lupron was $45 for shot plus avian vet visit. It's not invasive. It's a quick shot and you have to repeat it in 7-14 days. That's it then.
The first year it worked fantastic. By that night it was like he was a completely different bird. Then the next year it started declining effectiveness. For best results you need to time it so they are not fully into hormone season, but rather just before or just beginning. I'm fairly sure his is something triggered by hormones as he barbers, not plucks and will finally molt the barbered feather stubs and be beautifully feathered until November. One year his barbering turned into mutilation that needed surgery so I've tried a lot of things too. (My other 4 birds do not do feather destructive behaviors.)
There are reports of chances of reproductive cancers in female birds with lupron, but in cases where they are mutilating or laying like mad and could become eggbound if it works it may be a tradeoff to try.
 

DurgaRose

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Tucson AZ
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Emily
looking back to 2016 records when I didn't have it combined with something else... lupron was $45 for shot plus avian vet visit. It's not invasive. It's a quick shot and you have to repeat it in 7-14 days. That's it then.
The first year it worked fantastic. By that night it was like he was a completely different bird. Then the next year it started declining effectiveness. For best results you need to time it so they are not fully into hormone season, but rather just before or just beginning. I'm fairly sure his is something triggered by hormones as he barbers, not plucks and will finally molt the barbered feather stubs and be beautifully feathered until November. One year his barbering turned into mutilation that needed surgery so I've tried a lot of things too. (My other 4 birds do not do feather destructive behaviors.)
There are reports of chances of reproductive cancers in female birds with lupron, but in cases where they are mutilating or laying like mad and could become eggbound if it works it may be a tradeoff to try.
only $45!! wow that just makes me even more frustrated at this vet!! her exact words were, it's "VERY expensive" maybe at their clinic it was! considering a simple nail trim there was $50!!! I am used to paying $5 - $15 for a nail trim! when they told me $50 I almost fell off my chair! This just goes to show how avian care is handled by a vet clinic that mainly sees dogs and cats and are willing to see birds but don't specialize in them. I had to drive to El Paso TX, over an hour away the first time I took Kiwee. The waiting room was small and SO noisy. I almost immediately regretted taking him there. Things only got worse! After an hour wait we go into the exam room and it reeked of cleaner or something. I asked the tech what the strong smell was! she said, "oh its Lysol to cover up cigarette smoke smell" I told her my bird could not be exposed to such smells and we needed a different exam room! so vets here have been a nightmare to say the least.
How can you tell if he's barbering or plucking? Most times I don't see the feathers, just bald and sometimes mutilated skin. I always wondered what is happening to all the feathers :cautious:
 
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