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ESA List Question

Fia Baby

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That's a long article... there's a good facebook group I might pose the question to "Fighting to Keep Birds in our Lives" - I think that's it. One of commenters from the audobon article (Kashmir Csaky) is really knowledgeable and helpful. You should check them out if you're interested.
 

MILITARYMACAW

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I always cringe when I hear people say that no one should own birds, no one should breed birds, no one does it ethically
Not to get off the subject. I’m 35 years old and grew up in era were whales ( orcas for the technicals) were extremely commercialized. I went to Sea World as a child. I like whales and want to keep them safe because of my childhood experiences. Now I have a 18 month old son and I wonder how his generation will feel or perhaps not feel towards the animals once the parks are removed. I’m not saying they should or shouldn’t be removed from parks.

We don’t kill and cows because we are jerks. We are raised to eat them. People in India find them sacred.

I guess I’m pointing out that there are some advantages to animals in captivity. Not for numbers but for attraction.

Anytime a small child sees one of y’alls birds or a stranger ask a question that child or person developes an attachment to it. You could argue pet birds are embassaders for the wild ones. It’s pretty cool if you think about it.
 

MILITARYMACAW

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Here's an angle. If selling was banned there would be nothing to violate. Its almost like dangling the carrot. If the ESA sits and waits until your tempted to sell a bird across the line, they then can slap you with a 200k fine and sink your whole ship. Who knows!
 

jmfleish

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The ESA was created in the 1970s I believe but don't quote me. It was supposed to help endangered animals. It kind of went the wrong way as far as parrots are concerned because we are now domestically breeding almost all of the ones we see in the states today, so restrictions on them don't make a whole lot of sense. The problem is that certain animal rights groups (Humane Society of America, PETA) have pushed our government to place certain species on this list with the idea that by restricting their movement and sale, we will eventually stop breeding them altogether. They do this with the guise that we are "saving their species" but what we do with domestically bred parrots here in the US doesn't really help their wild counterparts at all, it does make breeding harder. There has been significant discussion in the avian community to try and remove domestically reared parrots as being clumped in with the wild ones and they are still fighting this. There are also certain laws in some states that literally say if an animal is listed on the ESA, they cannot be owned at all...there are about 27 states that do that as well. So, you have to be somewhat careful about the species you decide to own if that species is listed on the ESA. You also have to be concerned if you live in one of those states that has laws against owning any species listed on the ESA. Hopefully this will change in the future...
 

Fia Baby

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You never know... sometimes people just aren't good at spelling, and that's their only fault... ;)

I'm still curious how you found Sister. Was she from a friend? A breeder? Someone who just had a change of heart?
 

MILITARYMACAW

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@Fia Baby
Short answer:Craigslist

Long answer: I wanted to rescue. Phoenix Landing replied to my request and said I was too far out of their coverage. they require an in home visit. I knew this when I emailed them, but Tenn is in their footprint and I’m Alabama so I gave it a shot anyways.

I’ll also contacted papyago. They replied after a few weeks. I told them in my email that I had a unique work
environment. I went on that my family owned a small business and we all decided together I could bring a large bird to work. I would finally be able to give one the attention it needed. They replied and said, nice try and that it sounded cool in theory but we would hate it.

I didn’t try to convince them otherwise and I think they missed an opportunity to place a bird with people who understand commitment. She didn’t see me, see my house, or see my office. I was actually beginning to build a large indoor/outdoor aviary for sister. I thought our small staff would enjoy seeing her and I finally had the means to provide more than a cage for one.

I didn’t take it personal. It was what it was.

I went back to craigslist and there was one ad that didn’t appear to be a scam but my faith in Craigslist was pretty tarnished. I had seen sisters ad before but I had overlooked that the contact number was in the ad and the area code was actually a local area code. I sent the person a text and they responded.

The owner was a young man. He told me was recently divorced and had a rare opportunity to fulfill his dream by accepting a job in Montana. He said he didn’t want to part with bird but he had to do this.

I told him about me and my experience. I even offered to give the bird back to him if he returned to Alabama. I offered this because I read a new owner should prepare a rehome plan before you ever bring one into your home. I didn’t anticipate that happening but after reading that online and knowing how they bond, I made the offer. He told me he wouldn’t be taking her back. He seemed very nice and normal. He answered a few texts over the next day or two. I knew there were risk involved doing this and accepted.

He had never taken her to the vet. Once I took her my communication shifted from him to the vet.
 
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MILITARYMACAW

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@Fia Baby No judging here! Between my fat thumbs and racing thoughts, I rack up some pretty low grammar scores!

I left out the “McCall”was $650
 

MILITARYMACAW

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I did find it odd he couldn’t remember the name of where he got her from.

He had a story about waiting for her. If she was born 4/28/18 and I got her late October wouldn’t that mean he had her for a very short period of time?
 

Fia Baby

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He probably only had her for 3-4 months. And that's if he did the weaning.
 
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