Don't know what to do- please help!

[tina472]

thats a disheartening story! I hope every thing gets better. I would try to coat the collar in a really thin fabric. That might help. Or in the least might make it more comfortable

Yes, I definitely want him to be comfortable. Thanks so much for your support

 

[Tangle Elf]

I don't usually give him spray showers, but I think that's a good idea, thank you! The cape you posted in the link sounds great. I don't know where I could get one though because in that shop it seems all are sold out.

If he prefers baths to spray showers, you can put it in the water. It's fine if they drink it. Just make sure it's 100% aloe juice, not the stuff made for people to drink. You can find 100% aloe juice at a health food store. It's made for humans to drink too, but doesn't have the added flavors and things that grocery store aloe juice has. Just make sure you don't leave his water out too long with it. It is a juice and can go bad.

 

[tina472]

Sorry about your baby. I would get a 2nd opinion from a different certified avian vet. It is so hard to watch them pluck I know how devastating it is. I hope you find answers to your baby's problem. Hugs to you both
Have you tried spraying him with water with a little aloe?

Thank you so much for all your support!! .

I haven't, but I will try that, thanks.

 

[southernbirds]

He must be very itchy if he is so determined. Are you near a Vet school? I wonder if now he is on too many meds. I am no expert but just one who feels bad for your situation. Others have very good suggestions.

 

[tina472]

Sorry about your baby. He sure is cute! Did they test for Giardia? This can definitely cause plucking. Here is a great soft collar that my Dexter wears. I can put you in touch with the lady if you are interested. Just let me know.
View attachment 106114

Aw your bird Dexter sure is a cutie too! I am not sure if they have tested for that disease.

I really love how that collar looks, if you can put me in touch with the lady that would be great, I am definitely interested.

 

[tina472]

That is hard. Okay, so it started a few years after you got him... Avian vet has tested for major diseases, done swabs, taken his blood. When they took the samples down the beak and the cloaca/vent, did they just do gram stains or did they do a culture and sensitivity? With the blood, what did they test for? Did they do a CBC (complete blood count) as well?

As for testing for food allergies, you gotta just take it one step at a time. Stop giving one food for a couple or few weeks and see if there are any changes. If not, move on to the next food for a few weeks and so on. I would start with the pellets, if you feed those. I know some birds that are allergic and have to eat rice-based pellets. Can you give us a list of the different food items you give him?

Well I know he's definitely gotten a culture. I don't know what sensitivity is, he may have gotten that tested as well. I know they did a CBC on him, I don't remember what the blood tests were specifically for, just he got his blood samples taken many times

About testing for food allergies, my bird has his variety of seeds with nutrients that I put in his cage, but he also loves being in on the action in the kitchen to see what someone is making, and so I usually set a plate aside just for him so he can have a bite of what we are eating. I make sure to never give him chocolate, sugar, avocado, too much anything, but other then that he eats literally everything. I guess I can still try to stop giving him certain foods..

 

[BirdsFTW]

The C&S is the same test. They take a culture and do a sensitivity test on it to see what med will work to kill whatever the bacteria/virus is.

When he eats what you guys are eating, what kind of stuff do you eat? Do you use butter, oil, etc? Does he eat pellets at all or are seeds his "primary" diet?

 

[tina472]

Giardia doesn't always show up in a single sample. The best way to find it is a three day collection of samples from the "morning bomb." As far as the collar, a soft collar facing the other direction like Judy posted or a sock cut to cover the problem areas may be a good option for you. I hope you get answers and you're able to stop the tongue problem.

Here's a link to one of the capes Cape Collar Cover Ups© for Pluckers XSmall - PLUCKERS & OVERPREENERS by MY SAFE BIRD STORE
Here's a link to a rice diet Roudybush Rice Diet MINI 3 LB - PLUCKERS & OVERPREENERS by MY SAFE BIRD STORE

I didn't know that about Giardia, that means my bird may have gotten that tested before but may have it. Thank you for your input and support

 

[tina472]

Please be very, very, very careful about the vet giving your bird this and that med. I don't know exactly what medicines your vet has given or is giving you and how close together the meds are prescribed, but Mika was on different meds and broad-spectrum antibiotics for an ENTIRE YEAR, back to back to back, because my former Exotics vet and then former Avian vet couldn't figure out what was wrong with him. This severely compromised his immune system (lovebird experts who were given the list of all the meds he took were SHOCKED he wasn't dead) and now he gets sick very easily. Needless to say, I see a different Avian vet now.

Definitely find out if your bird has been tested for giardia if you aren't sure.

Aw, I hope Mika is doing well. I will definitely keep this in mind whenever I can go back to vet. Thank you so much for your help

 

[tina472]

Where are you located? Maybe we can help you find a different certified vet we have had experience with.

Actually this would be good help, I am located in Boca Raton, Fl.

 

[tina472]

The C&S is the same test. They take a culture and do a sensitivity test on it to see what med will work to kill whatever the bacteria/virus is.

When he eats what you guys are eating, what kind of stuff do you eat? Do you use butter, oil, etc? Does he eat pellets at all or are seeds his "primary" diet?

Ohh ok.

Seeds are his primary diet. I don't use oils, and little butter. his favorites-plain rice, plain noodles, cheerios, corn

 

[Mizzely]

Ohh ok.

Seeds are his primary diet. I don't use oils, and little butter. his favorites-plain rice, plain noodles, cheerios, corn

I know there is some debate regarding smaller birds, but my opinion is that they should still get at least some pellets. Seeds do not offer a lot of nutrients, and when you get the "vitamin fortified", those vitamins are all on the hull of the seed, which falls to the ground or back into the bowl, and the bird gets none of it.

Regardless of the pellet vs. seed debate (which is only for the small birds, larger ones definitely cannot be on a seed based diet), fresh vegetables and fruits have to be included everyday. And not just peas, carrots, and corn. Sweet potato, beans, kale, apple, cranberries, etc. Since the seeds don't provide the vitamins and things that they need to thrive, the veggies, fruit, legumes, grains supplement that for them. Essentially, its like if you ate Ramen noodles every day for your whole life. Yeah, it fills you up, but its not exactly healthy. You have to eat other things to make up the deficits. That's why pellets are great, because it gives you a base that includes most of the nutrients that they need, where with a seed diet, you have a lot more work ahead of you to make a complete diet.

Based on the information you've provided, Gardia is a possibility, but I would definitely be tackling the diet portion.

 

[BayuCah'ya]

I completely agree that giardia and food allergy are the two most likely culprits in your scenario. And whoever told you that it sometimes comes back as a false positive is exactly right. The way we diagnose giardiasis is by looking at a fecal sample under a microscope to find either the cysts or the trophozoites. The problem is that trophozoites usually stay attached to the intestinal walls, unless they are in the process of dying or reproducing. So if the existing trophozoites aren't dying or shedding cysts, or if they are only doing so in small enough numbers to have not been caught in the fecal sample, the test can appear to be negative when in actuality the animal being tested in infected. The good news is that the antibiotics/anthelmintic used to treat giardia is relatively safe with few side effects, so oftentimes if giardiasis is suspected, a vet will prescribe the medication just to be on the safe side.

It seems to me, however, that a food allergy is much more likely. By far, the most common food allergens in birds are corn, wheat, and soy, so it is probably a good idea to start by eliminating those COMPLETELY from his diet. You can't cheat and give him just a bit of this or that here and there. Any molecule can trigger an immune response. The other thing is that it takes THREE MONTHS for an allergen to be completely eliminated from the body, so you have to put him on this diet for a MINIMUM of three months in order to know for sure whether or not it's helping. If, after three months of religiously, fanatically keeping corn, wheat, and soy out of his diet, he's still itchy, you can move on to other possible allergens. Birds can also be allergic to food dyes, peanuts, or any number of other foods. He could possibly even be allergic to one or more of the seeds he eats. But start with the most obvious/likely foods and go from there.

The other thing worth noting is that animals with food allergies often respond really well to omega 3 supplementation. DHA and EPA help reduce inflammation, which in turn reduces itching, and helps normalize immune response as well. It might be worthwhile to buy pharmaceutical grade flaxseed oil (Vitamin Shoppe is one of the brands that passed consumerlab's inspection, and off the top of my head it's the only one I can remember) and give him 0.2 - 0.3 mL of that daily. It might take up to a month to see results, and you might not see any results from that at all, but it's worth a shot, IMO. Since omega 3s have so many other health benefits, I kind of feel like it would be a good thing to supplement regardless.

I also agree with the daily shower suggestions. Adding George's Aloe to the water could be helpful as well.

And I also agree with those who suggested getting a second opinion from another board certified vet.

So basically, this was just a really long-winded way of saying that I agree with what others have already said. Glad I could be redundant for you tonight.

 

[BirdsFTW]

Seeds are his primary diet. I don't use oils, and little butter. his favorites-plain rice, plain noodles, cheerios, corn

As Shawna said, your bird should be getting some pellets. A primarily seed diet sometimes causes fatty liver disease. And Shawna is right about the "fortified nutrients" being on the hull of the seed and your bird doesn't ingest it. If it's not giardia, it really seems like it's diet/allergy-related. Butter isn't good for birds at all and I would stop giving that to your bird period. I know there are people on the forum that give a little bit of their food to their birds but, personally, unless it's cooked without butter and added stuff I wouldn't give it to the birds. I actually cringe when I see people give their bird a potato chip or french fry - I used to see people in my local parrot club do that. There are also more nutritious treats than processed cereal, but I digress. One of the healthiest foods you can give your bird, especially if they are picky like Mika who refuses fruits and veggies, is fresh organic sprouts. I sprout every few to several days for my boys.

Emily's response was thorough and informative. It may have been redundant to a point (so silly to even point that out! LOL), but she went more in depth which was awesome.

I really hope we can help you get to the bottom of this.

 

[waterfaller1]

I would recommend Dr. Joel Murphy, or Dr. Theresa Lightfoot. If you cannot travel at all, I can give you a name closer to you. It is always so difficult to pinpoint a plucking problem. Sometimes...oftentimes,it is not medical at all, but hormones and habit.Hugs to you & healing thoughts to your little one.

 

[BayuCah'ya]

Right! Incorporating pellets is a great idea. And it is possible to do so while still avoiding corn, wheat, and soy. Totally Organic Pellets are corn, wheat, and soy free, and in my opinion are some of the best pellets available. Roudybush also has a rice-based pellet designed specifically for birds with corn/wheat/soy allergies. You can try either or both of those.

And yes! Tanya's right to mention that plucking has many causes, some of which are behavioral rather than medical. The only reason I think your case might be medical is because you said he has a tendency to attack specific spots on his body. In my experience, when a bird frantically attacks one or a few specific spots on the body, it's usually a medical issue. E.g. plucking at the leg feathers can indicate coronary artery disease; plucking under the wings can indicate respiratory/air sac infections; plucking over the crop can indicate crop infection; plucking over the wings/shoulders can indicate food allergies. This obviously isn't scientific or 100%. I'm just stating observations I've made in the two decades of working with birds in vet clinics, aviaries, rescue facilities, and in clients' homes.

 

[Jally]

Sorry about your baby. He sure is cute! Did they test for Giardia? This can definitely cause plucking. Here is a great soft collar that my Dexter wears. I can put you in touch with the lady if you are interested. Just let me know.
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Judy, will you let me know who made that awesome collar, too please? I'm using fleece squares that I cut and decorate. Then I add a baby sock to the neckline to make a little turtleneck. They work well, but while she isn't picking at her neck and shoulders, she can lift up the bottom to get her belly and legs.

 

[Jally]

Bumping this up so Judy sees my request for the maker of that awesome collar.

 

[Lauren]

I've been reading over this thread and lurking for the past couple of days.

You guys have given some great advice and I too definitely agree with what has been said in regards to it being his diet.

I hope he gets better <3

 

[Greycloud]

So sorry guys! Been very busy! Have gotten permission to let you know Patti Lemaire on Face Book makes these collars. You can message her there. She is very nice to work with. Will send you both PMs with her email addy too.