Blue Fronted Amazon

[chichi23]

I need help I have an almost 8 month old Amazon who keeps biting my hands. She was doing okay with some bites but it has got so bad. She never flies out of her cage by herself she always waits for me to get her out. Which goes smoothly I ask her do you wanna step up? She steps right up. I don’t put her down right away I usually talk to her a bit and then put her on her play stand. She will usually fly right back to me I stand with her offer her treats but that then turns into biting. I put her on her play stand and walk away but the time I turn around she has already flown to me. We start the process all over again she starts biting even if I offer her a foot toy she rather go for my hand. I at first thought she wanted to play but now I’m thinking I’m totally wrong. I’m kinda lost and becoming scared. This is my first parrot ever. I’ve only had her since November. Any advice on what I could be doing wrong?

 

[MommyBird]

welcome!
I had to learn a lot about behavior too, when I got my first BFA.
There are several things you could do right away and another that might take some thinking.
What is your BFA's name?
I know part of the problem is her flying to you, but teach her to stepup onto a long stick that has a guard to protect your hand ( like a plastic soda bottle cut off and slid onto the stick) then get her onto the stick right away.

Have you done any clicker training aka positive reinforcement? You can eventually use that to teach flying to you for a treat (aka recall and a valuable thing) on cue. Then she doesn't get rewarded for doing it without a cue and that will cut down on it. it she does fly to you get her on the special stick right away.

Learn the ABCs of behavior. Antecedent Behavior Consequences. What happens immediately before the behavior and what happens right after the behavior? If you can change the antecedent or consequences you can often change the behavior. do some reading: Written Works: Learning and Behavior - BehaviorWorks.com

Also check out one of our member's sites at Think Parrot - The Parrot Lovers' Information Source for more ideas.

 

[Parutti]

Welcome to AA!

@MommyBird I was hoping someone with Amazon knowledge would post before I finished mine!

I don't have experience with pet Amazons (only sanctuary/untamed ones), but I do have experience with a young Quaker parrot who definitely went through a phase of realizing bites mean something to people.

To me it sounds like she's kinda training you Is there a pattern to what you do after she bites that might accidentally be rewarding to her? For example some parrots figure out they go back in their cage when they bite, so something we think is a deterrent ends up being a reward. My Quaker finds it very rewarding when I react at all with a flinch or ow etc. With him the good part is that he LOVES praise and drama telling him he's a good boy and so smart

I'm still trying to figure this out myself, since when my guy gets in a (playful) bitey mood, I'm still too slow to react in a way that makes sense to him. Or I react too much and he likes that too.

Positive reinforcement training has helped me with every animal I've ever worked with. It can take time to learn what THEY consider a reward, but Even starting with target training can help a lot.

For Opie one thing I've noticed is that he needs more direct attention and mental exercise. So I'll have him do some training tricks - he likes "can I touch your foot" "can I touch your beak" "can I touch your head" and then have him fly to me all over the house "ok wanna practice Come?! Step down, ok wait.....(walk away) Opie come!" He is a MASSIVE sucker for praise and excitement though so attention and "work" are his biggest rewards, more than food for sure.

 

[chichi23]

welcome!
I had to learn a lot about behavior too, when I got my first BFA.
There are several things you could do right away and another that might take some thinking.
What is your BFA's name?
I know part of the problem is her flying to you, but teach her to stepup onto a long stick that has a guard to protect your hand ( like a plastic soda bottle cut off and slid onto the stick) then get her onto the stick right away.

Have you done any clicker training aka positive reinforcement? You can eventually use that to teach flying to you for a treat (aka recall and a valuable thing) on cue. Then she doesn't get rewarded for doing it without a cue and that will cut down on it. it she does fly to you get her on the special stick right away.

Learn the ABCs of behavior. Antecedent Behavior Consequences. What happens immediately before the behavior and what happens right after the behavior? If you can change the antecedent or consequences you can often change the behavior. do some reading: Written Works: Learning and Behavior - BehaviorWorks.com

Also check out one of our member's sites at Think Parrot - The Parrot Lovers' Information Source for more ideas.

Her name is Chi-Chi. she does recall super well! I have been treating when she just flies to me so maybe that’s part of the problem. I almost feel like she’s always on edge. I have done some clicker and target training which when she is doing target training she does it so well. It’s the moment she is on me for more than a minute I start getting bit.

 

[April]

@Clueless

 

[chichi23]

Welcome to AA!

@MommyBird I was hoping someone with Amazon knowledge would post before I finished mine!

I don't have experience with pet Amazons (only sanctuary/untamed ones), but I do have experience with a young Quaker parrot who definitely went through a phase of realizing bites mean something to people.

To me it sounds like she's kinda training you Is there a pattern to what you do after she bites that might accidentally be rewarding to her? For example some parrots figure out they go back in their cage when they bite, so something we think is a deterrent ends up being a reward. My Quaker finds it very rewarding when I react at all with a flinch or ow etc. With him the good part is that he LOVES praise and drama telling him he's a good boy and so smart

I'm still trying to figure this out myself, since when my guy gets in a (playful) bitey mood, I'm still too slow to react in a way that makes sense to him. Or I react too much and he likes that too.

Positive reinforcement training has helped me with every animal I've ever worked with. It can take time to learn what THEY consider a reward, but Even starting with target training can help a lot.

For Opie one thing I've noticed is that he needs more direct attention and mental exercise. So I'll have him do some training tricks - he likes "can I touch your foot" "can I touch your beak" "can I touch your head" and then have him fly to me all over the house "ok wanna practice Come?! Step down, ok wait.....(walk away) Opie come!" He is a MASSIVE sucker for praise and excitement though so attention and "work" are his biggest rewards, more than food for sure.

I do feel like she is training me. When she bites I instantly drop my head which sometimes makes her bite harder and growl and other times she stops. I go to her play stand and turn my back to her. I do target training which she caught on fairly quick! Right now I had her out of her cage and she literally flew right at my face. I’m not sure if I should start completely over and do all training inside the cage.

 

[MommyBird]

Her name is Chi-Chi. she does recall super well! I have been treating when she just flies to me so maybe that’s part of the problem. I almost feel like she’s always on edge. I have done some clicker and target training which when she is doing target training she does it so well. It’s the moment she is on me for more than a minute I start getting bit.

aren't amazons lovely to train? so food motivated!!!!! But yeah flying at your face is scary!
starting over in the cage is not a bad idea and you can do a lot there.
Train her to follow the target to different places in the cage, then train her to fly to several targets outside the cage and get that all as response to a cue. Then have her come out and fly directly to a playstand. keep her moving. have lots of distractions handy. If she can only be out a short time for now then that is what it is. You don't want her to develop the habit of flying and biting.

When my Hahns was 2, I had to do the same thing. He'd fly to me and bite. I just kept him moving and shortened time out of cage, and all was well fairly soon. We got past that obsession.
They just get a little worked up. Maybe try to keep your personal energy a bit lower and don't give drama rewards to keep her calmer.

Keep an eye out for those ABCs as you go and you will be doing yourself a favor.
I can't wait to hear more about how Chi-chi and you are learning together!

 

[MommyBird]

And one more idea - teach an incompatible behavior that they strongly want to do on cue.
When my male BFA Chico was hormonal he was usually not as bad as many others.
But sometimes I could see him starting to crouch for takeoff when I'd have to partially turn my back to him to do something.
There were a number of times when calling out 'Circle" saved me since he couldn't launch and turn in a circle at the same time.
He'd get a big reward for listening to the cue then

 

[chichi23]

aren't amazons lovely to train? so food motivated!!!!! But yeah flying at your face is scary!
starting over in the cage is not a bad idea and you can do a lot there.
Train her to follow the target to different places in the cage, then train her to fly to several targets outside the cage and get that all as response to a cue. Then have her come out and fly directly to a playstand. keep her moving. have lots of distractions handy. If she can only be out a short time for now then that is what it is. You don't want her to develop the habit of flying and biting.

When my Hahns was 2, I had to do the same thing. He'd fly to me and bite. I just kept him moving and shortened time out of cage, and all was well fairly soon. We got past that obsession.
They just get a little worked up. Maybe try to keep your personal energy a bit lower and don't give drama rewards to keep her calmer.

Keep an eye out for those ABCs as you go and you will be doing yourself a favor.
I can't wait to hear more about how Chi-chi and you are learning together!

Am I doing the right thing as far as when she starts the pecking at my hand placing her on her stand and turning my back? What do I do when she flies right back to me and starts biting again? Just keep redirecting? Yea she does get worked up for sure and I work 8-5 so it usually happens when I come home and i take her out immediately have her out for about 20 mins unless the biting starts I shorten it to 10-15 and I keep taking her out in intervals until her bedtime at 8pm.

 

[melissasparrots]

Amazons in general are always on edge. Some baby amazons go through one heck of a pressure biting phase between about 5 months and 1.5 years. It's not really aggressive so much as an urge to bear down and crush something. Fingers are both squishy and hard and probably feed good to try crushing. All of my amazons grew out of it by about a year and a half old. Although, it's not a fun phase. I would stop calling her to you until she has stopped biting. I would keep interactions short with no time to bite. A quick step up, praise, treat, put back in the cage and close the door. Multiple sessions a day. If she ever indicates that she doesn't want to be picked up, just back off and talk to her instead. Don't let her guilt you into getting more out of cage time, which will mean more misbeahvior, which increases her chances of being rehomed as a biter if she keeps practicing this behavior. Ask before petting and if she gives you a little head tilt or fluffed feathers, keep it short, praise and put back in the cage. Make sure she has lots of toys to kill during this stage. Get rid of any notions you have of spending quality time physically holding her for now. Just step up, praise, treat, step down, walk away, done. Just do that a few times a day with a chunk of time between trials so she can't get annoyed or bored and bite. If you have a bird safe room and want to give her out of cage time, you can let her out and just not be in the room with her. That way, she gets freedom and physically can't bite you because you aren't there. When you go back in to put her back in the cage, just step her up, praise, treat, back in the cage. I always let my biters out of the cage shortly before their main supper time so I would just walk in with a fresh bowl of food and they would be more interested in eating than biting or putting up a fight over going back in the cage. One of my female amazons was really terrible when she was young, but she been super sweet for the last 10 years.

 

[MommyBird]

Totally agree with every bit of what Melissa says. keep it short and keep her moving. Don't put yourself in a situation where you will get bit.
Use the safe stick to change either the antecedent or consequence for her by taking your body away from her beak. repeat getting her on the stick if she flies onto you without being called and do not reward the behavior you don't like.
It is much better for her future if she doesn't learn to bite. being out of the cage for only short, safe times is OK.
I've only adopted senior Amazons so I don't know the younger birds like Melissa does.
I hope you get a chance to read these articles and others on @Fuzzy 's site.
Aggression In Parrots | ThinkParrot
Help! My Parrot Bites! | ThinkParrot

 

[Clueless]

Secret is an older wild caught amazon. Blue front. Male.

I STRONGLY SUGGEST using a T stick. I do NOT use my hands with Secret. When we first adopted them, she took flesh out of my hand.

We now get along pretty well but I still keep the T stick between us when she is in my lap. When she gets excited, it is much easier to get her to step onto the stick and return her to the cage.

Remember though, I'm "clueless" for a reason and still learning.

 

[Fuzzy]

You've received so much wonderful advice already. I'll probably be repeating some of what has been said, but I thought I'd offer my 2 cents.

With biting you need to change the antecedent (the event that comes immediately before/cues the biting) as when the bird has bitten, it is too late to change the behaviour. The deed is done.

So with that in mind, maybe change up the routine. If she is responsive, ask her to target and/or other behaviours inside her cage when you get home. She is expending energy (winding down the excitement of seeing you) and earning treats (you are also pairing yourself with the fabulous reinforcers). However, you are offering these treats through the cage bars so it is harder to bite you. But also make her reach for the treats - it is difficult to lunge/bite and extend her head at the same time. When you think she is calmer, then you could try opening the cage door and having her step up and put her on the stand (no treats here for the moment as that seems to be the antecedent for the biting?). Or just open the cage door. Invent a different routine. You could even move her playstand to another location - even right by her cage so she can climb there herself. Plus you could add different toys and foraging opportunities to the playstand to keep her occupied there/to make it look different and exciting.

With behaviour, try one thing, if it doesn't work, try something else. Everyone has offered great ideas.