Sheba has some new feathers!

[suncoast]

You know if it was me I would just start running the gamut of medicines. If she's healthy with good blood work and vitals I would start with giardia meds and go through every medicine they make for Aspers, psttichosis, polynoma, PBFD. ALL OF IT. At this point her quality of life is miserable, as is yours. The vet's can't find out a darn thing with testing. This is so hard.

Ginger

 

[suncoast]

Could she be having a reaction to the Clompramine?

Ginger

 

[jasminlana]

aww Carole, sorry the soft collar didn't work for Sheba, but I hope you find something to help.

Maybe a vest will help. I am going to try one for Ella. She has feather everywhere except her chest and I'm wondering if she is pulling the chest feathers out. So ordering this for her. Since weather is a little cooler shouldn't be too hot now.

FeatherProtector for Severe Pickers - Back Closure | Avian Fashions

 

[waterfaller1]

Has she been treated for giardia?

Ginger

She has been tested,{4 times!} but not directly treated, no. I think they treat Giardia with metronidazole.

You know if it was me I would just start running the gamut of medicines. If she's healthy with good blood work and vitals I would start with giardia meds and go through every medicine they make for Aspers, psttichosis, polynoma, PBFD. ALL OF IT. At this point her quality of life is miserable, as is yours. The vet's can't find out a darn thing with testing. This is so hard.

Ginger

Thanks Ginger. I am not sure how safe that would be, considering her liver is not functioning properly. She just went through a full course of antibiotics and an antifungal.

Could she be having a reaction to the Clompramine?

Ginger

I do not use it often, only when she is freaking out...so no, it's not the other way around. Thanks for thinking of us Ginger.

aww Carole, sorry the soft collar didn't work for Sheba, but I hope you find something to help.

Maybe a vest will help. I am going to try one for Ella. She has feather everywhere except her chest and I'm wondering if she is pulling the chest feathers out. So ordering this for her. Since weather is a little cooler shouldn't be too hot now.

FeatherProtector for Severe Pickers - Back Closure | Avian Fashions

Those vests do look cool. I hope it works for Ella.

 

[Holiday]

So much for new feathers. Sheba had a very bad day yesterday. All new feathers are pulled and gone.She poked a good sized hole in her side. We seem to have good days and bad days. I went to one of my vets yesterday to talk about making a new flavor for Sheba's medicine, so it tastes better. It smells gross, and I can tell from her reaction it tastes the same. So they are sending the 'script to the same pharmacy that compounded her other meds, so it will taste better. I hate to zone her out, but some days she really needs it.
I am waiting for a comprehensive collar to arrive, which we will try.
Judy sent me a link to this site, which makes some interesting vests.Thank you Judy! Avian Fashions: FeatherProtectors
I want to say thanks to all who are trying to help with ideas to help her. And a special thanks to Elsie[jasminlana], who sent a nice collar she had made for Sheba. It was a bit too soft to work for Sheba. But, my groomers came yesterday to clip nails for Kismet, Holly, and Cochise. I showed the collar to Paula, and she was pretty excited about it and thought it would work for a plucky quaker she knows, so I let her take it. I just wanted to say an extra thank you, and sending it will not be for naught, it might help this little quaker.
Some extra positive energy might help at this point.

Carole, I'm so very sorry

I'm sure you've been asked this before, and I know you've tried everything you can, but I'm going to ask again, because I'd love to help if I could... How many hours of out-time on a play stand does she get? And is there any way you could increase it? I ask this because the main trigger for Elvis's leg plucking is being in her cage. When she's out all day, she's fine. Over the summer, while I was here all day, and she was out all day, she grew all her leg feathers back. Now that I'm back to work, I'm starting to see some leg feathers on the bottom of the cage again. I think that, for some birds, John's anti-cage position is 100% correct. I have to leave E caged part of the time, but since I *know* what causes her problem, it makes it at least a little easier to try to take steps to combat it... Just trying to throw out an idea. I've never had a mutilator, and I can only imagine how hard that must be

 

[Sparkles]

I'm so sorry I have never had a plucker, but I do hope she stops soon. I know you're giving her all the love in the world

 

[waterfaller1]

Thank you Holiday & Iskra.

Carole, I'm so very sorry

I'm sure you've been asked this before, and I know you've tried everything you can, but I'm going to ask again, because I'd love to help if I could... How many hours of out-time on a play stand does she get? And is there any way you could increase it? I ask this because the main trigger for Elvis's leg plucking is being in her cage. When she's out all day, she's fine. Over the summer, while I was here all day, and she was out all day, she grew all her leg feathers back. Now that I'm back to work, I'm starting to see some leg feathers on the bottom of the cage again. I think that, for some birds, John's anti-cage position is 100% correct. I have to leave E caged part of the time, but since I *know* what causes her problem, it makes it at least a little easier to try to take steps to combat it... Just trying to throw out an idea. I've never had a mutilator, and I can only imagine how hard that must be

I did not realize E has a little plucking going on.I am so sorry. That is how Sheba started, legs only. But, I was told she had done her chest in the past. I just took some pics so you can see where she is. She is out, or has the option to be out all day, unless I go shopping or to the bank, which is only a few hours per week.

 

[marian]

Sorry Carole sheba started plucking those feathers out.I've never had a parrot who did this.So I have no advice on that.Just leaving you a big hug.

 

[waterfaller1]

Thank you Marian. Hugs back to you.

 

[ArloDuncan]

Carole So Sorry I just saw this thread I'm so sorry for this new set back . I was so happy for you both when I first saw the thread "new feathers" and sad now to see you had a set back. Hang in there wishing you both the very best.. Good luck

 

[Bridgette]

I'm so sorry for the setback.

 

[sodakat]

Aw. rats. Something must have changed where she decided she needed to pluck instead of doing whatever she's been doing while not plucking.

I'm kind of late to the discussion and don't know anything about her or your other flock, so forgive me if I'm asking things that have been answered.

Do you think she eats an optimum diet for her species? Does she have a good appetite and eat mostly healthy fresh foods?

Does she play and keep herself busy chewing things up, or is she more apt to sit and preen/pull?

If she hasn't lived with you too long she may be unsure of the routine and turn to plucking to soothe herself if she is worried. It might take more time for her to feel secure and know that her life is stable. Since she *can* grow feathers, I think you should be optimistic that eventually she will.

If I were you, I'd overload her with items to chew/destroy/climb on. The bigger the mess she can make the busier she'll be and the less time she'll have to pluck. I've given my birds half a watermellon and just let them go at it. I bring in branches with leaves on them and they snip them all off. I constantly gather pinecones and keep the playtop on the cage full of them. Paperback books are tossed on my cagetops also.

Six months ago I would have agreed that there is likely a physical condition that is causing her to pluck. Now, after living with two pluckers/barberers, I'm not convinced. Sure there may have been a physical cause orginally but after that resolved itself I think habit might have taken over.

The very, very best diet is IMO the first course of action. Followed by daily showers. Followed by constant chewing/destruction of items.

If you decide to try the vest I caution you to not leave it on for too long without giving her a break to preen naturally. Some parrots are very unhappy in vests.

 

[waterfaller1]

Thank you Steve,Bridgette, and thanks Kathy for your advice. Here is some of Sheba's history..most recent posts~if you have more ideas after glancing through these, I am all ears!!
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/57825-please-welcome-back-avian-avenue.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/58660-feel-like-new-mom-again.html

http://forums.avianavenue.com/pluckers-parlor/58680-shebas-new-pics.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/58896-sheba-will-see-vet-tomorrow.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/59181-quick-sheba-update.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/60198-update-where-sheba.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/59447-loot-bird-show.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-...-90-frightening-results-shebas-vet-visit.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/feathered-photos-fairway/60153-good-morning-avian-avenue.html

 

[Bokkapooh]

I'm so sorry to hear she is having a set back. When do find her plucking the most? When she is alone or caged? When Gra was alive, she would pluck and chew on her legs when caged.

 

[sodakat]

Thank you Steve,Bridgette, and thanks Kathy for your advice. Here is some of Sheba's history..most recent posts~if you have more ideas after glancing through these, I am all ears!!
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/57825-please-welcome-back-avian-avenue.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/58660-feel-like-new-mom-again.html

http://forums.avianavenue.com/pluckers-parlor/58680-shebas-new-pics.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/58896-sheba-will-see-vet-tomorrow.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/59181-quick-sheba-update.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/60198-update-where-sheba.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-boulevard/59447-loot-bird-show.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/bird-...-90-frightening-results-shebas-vet-visit.html
http://forums.avianavenue.com/feathered-photos-fairway/60153-good-morning-avian-avenue.html

I read through the threads so have a better understanding of things. She was about 12 years old when she started plucking apparently and it has continued for 3 or 4 years? This was the part I was unsure of.

Would you mind listing exactly what she eats? IMO diet is so very important, especially to birds that engage in feather destructive behavior. Until they feel good and are healthy, I think they are unable to stop plucking.

I'm interested in every single source of protein in her diet, both animal and vegetable, so if you could list all foods she eats (not what you serve necessarily, but what she actually eats) I'd like to give my input.''

Edit to add this: Have you ever tried offering her Tofu? I've had really good luck using Tofu when LaFitte experienced a major moult and it was readily accepted by both Bella and Sully in their diet of fresh foods. Maybe that would be a protein source that she would like.

 

[Holiday]

Thank you Holiday & Iskra.I did not realize E has a little plucking going on.I am so sorry. That is how Sheba started, legs only. But, I was told she had done her chest in the past. I just took some pics so you can see where she is. She is out, or has the option to be out all day, unless I go shopping or to the bank, which is only a few hours per week.

Carole, thanks for posting those pictures. That is very helpful. Looks like she has a good setup, but I do have a suggestion. Elvis spends most of her time on her flyer or on her swing--she prefers them over a static playstand. So, I hang chew toys right beside her head on the swing, so that they're right there, right by her face, if she feels the need to chew. Something like a swing or large atom with hanging, dangly toys could be appealing to your pretty girl. How do you feel about hanging things from your ceiling? I don't know if this will help, but I do have a girlie B&G who needs to be distracted from her leg feathers, and that's what works for her, FWIW. I wish you so much luck I'll be thinking of you and Sheba.

 

[waterfaller1]

That's a great idea Holiday! I don't think I can afford a flyer at this time, but I can certainly work on an orbit or atom with some toys hanging downward. You know, someone should come up with an idea for a hanging toy holder. I do have a Shepherd's hook type toy hook, that has been sitting up on top of my refrigerator, ohhh. forever..forgotten...waiting for the mechanic to bring home a drill.{need to go buy my own set of tools...who ever heard of a mechanic's household with no tools..} I wonder how hard it is to drill a little hole in that java tree? Probably not terrible hard, as they do have those studs sticking out for the screw on cups. I have absolutely NO problem with hanging things from the ceiling. Thanks so much for caring.

 

[Holiday]

That's a great idea Holiday! I don't think I can afford a flyer at this time, but I can certainly work on an orbit or atom with some toys hanging downward. You know, someone should come up with an idea for a hanging toy holder. I do have a Shepherd's hook type toy hook, that has been sitting up on top of my refrigerator, ohhh. forever..forgotten...waiting for the mechanic to bring home a drill.{need to go buy my own set of tools...who ever heard of a mechanic's household with no tools..} I wonder how hard it is to drill a little hole in that java tree? Probably not terrible hard, as they do have those studs sticking out for the screw on cups. I have absolutely NO problem with hanging things from the ceiling. Thanks so much for caring.

I would so very much love to be of some use to you, Carole. Please let me know if there's anything else I can do

 

[waterfaller1]

I'm so sorry to hear she is having a set back. When do find her plucking the most? When she is alone or caged? When Gra was alive, she would pluck and chew on her legs when caged.

Sheba will do this looking straight at you. She is hardly ever in her cage, unless she goes in there on her own to get some water, an extra snack, I go somewhere{which is not much more than the bank & grocery store}, and at night to sleep.Thanks Mercedez, for your reply.

I read through the threads so have a better understanding of things. She was about 12 years old when she started plucking apparently and it has continued for 3 or 4 years? This was the part I was unsure of.

Would you mind listing exactly what she eats? IMO diet is so very important, especially to birds that engage in feather destructive behavior. Until they feel good and are healthy, I think they are unable to stop plucking.

I'm interested in every single source of protein in her diet, both animal and vegetable, so if you could list all foods she eats (not what you serve necessarily, but what she actually eats) I'd like to give my input.''

Edit to add this: Have you ever tried offering her Tofu? I've had really good luck using Tofu when LaFitte experienced a major moult and it was readily accepted by both Bella and Sully in their diet of fresh foods. Maybe that would be a protein source that she would like.

Sheba was about 12, and yes it has been in this decline state since April of 09'. I will come back on later and write out the diet. I need to do a few chores and cook dinner.
Thanks for your help.

 

[waterfaller1]

Would you mind listing exactly what she eats? IMO diet is so very important, especially to birds that engage in feather destructive behavior. Until they feel good and are healthy, I think they are unable to stop plucking.

I'm interested in every single source of protein in her diet, both animal and vegetable, so if you could list all foods she eats (not what you serve necessarily, but what she actually eats) I'd like to give my input.''

Edit to add this: Have you ever tried offering her Tofu? I've had really good luck using Tofu when LaFitte experienced a major moult and it was readily accepted by both Bella and Sully in their diet of fresh foods. Maybe that would be a protein source that she would like.

I agree the initial reason she started is probably far and away from why she does this now. Sometimes she is like seriously OCD. Yesterday was a good day. Yesterday I also cleaned my air filter real good and set it up next to her cage. I was also wondering, if anyone can remind me, what type of aloe is recommended to be used as a spray?
I have never touched Tofu, but isn't Tofu 100% soy? I would question whether that would be wise, as if this was brought on by hormonal changes, that would definitely be a factor that would exacerbate this.

Here is her diet~She is a pellet grinder, so how much she actually ingests I have no idea. But she is a nearly 1200 gm macaw, so she's not missing much. She loves to eat, but as far as fresh foods she is a 'white eater'-corn, banana, apple, grape- so I hide the better veggies and fruits like blueberries in my birdy bread, which she eats very well. Some things, like pecans & peppers get slung out of the bowls.
{remember she has only been back with me a few weeks}
Pellets- Roudybush, Harrison's, Tops, Hagen Sticks, Pretty Bird Natural Gold{when she came to me in 04', she strictly ate pretty bird colored and a few nuts, and seeds}
Seeds-Pumpkin
Nuts in shell-presently almonds-others are added as available, and now that she is back with me I need to add some she likes that my others do not, like walnuts and brazils. She used to say everything she knew for a pine nut. I need to get some of them too.
Treats and toppers- Lucy Towbin's Unpellet, Goldenfeast's Bonito Loco and South American Preservation, Kathie at MSBS Bountiful Feast{no kiwi or pellet}
Fresh-Varies, but presently Organic red grapes, bananas, apples, romaine lettuce,carrots. Sugar snap peas,occasionally, corn on the cob,pears,peaches,pineapple..depends on what is in season-available. I offer peppers and oranges, but she will not eat them. There is some belief though, that if you cut up veggies and fruits fairly small, they do get a little benefit even from the ones they do not eat, as they rub on each other as you mix them.
Birdy bread w/ sweet potato-rice-carrot mash added & other fresh fruits and veggies such as broccoli.
This is all I can think of right at the moment.