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pellet brand

Vera

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at the moment my bird eats harrison and Top pellets. this for the cominationa fortified pellet/ veggies and divers ingredients in the other pellet.
i only have one small bird, parrotlet, and when she finishes this, i want to switch her to a pellet with all in it.
she doesnt eat Caitec. she likes Beaphar (but contains menadione, only about 1mg/kg) haven't tried any other brands.

how bad is a small protion of menadione? beaphar is vitamin fortified and has a good varied ingredientlist.
i am also thinking about roudybush. no menadione in it. but i think the ingredientlist is limited. would the california blend be a good option?
 
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Mizzely

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It's unnecessary for a bird, but deadly levels are at 1000 times normal dosage .


Vitamin K Substances and Animal Feed


Here is a list with ingredients Pellets for Parrots

The California blend from what I understand is just regular roudybush pellets mixed in with dried fruits and veggie, so your bird doesn't normally eat that stuff, it is cheaper to get the regular pellets.
 

Vera

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But i don't think such a small amount of menadione is harmfull or bad?

Anybody here feeds the roudybush california blend to their small birds?what is your experience?do they eat all of it?
 

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That's what I'm saying. The amount of menadione would have to be 1000 times higher than is present in the food to be lethal. Even if it was 100 times what it is in the food it likely would have no effect.
 

Vera

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What are the experiences and opinions on roudybush and zupreem vs harrisons's or Top's?

I have only one bird and at the moment i have to order food from 2 different webshops:
Webshop 1:
-sells organic low fat seedmix with dehydrated herbs and flowers.
-sells organic sproutmix with grains and pulses
-sells cooking mixes with different grains,pulses and dehydrated veggies.
This webshop only sells roudybush and zuprssm pellets.

Webshop 2:
-normal seedmixes.not as good and fresh as the mixes in the other webshop and not that varied.
-sells vitakraft salatmix , has dehydrated herbs in it.
-sells Top and Harrison and Beaphar pellets.
-sells organic sproutmix with grains and pulses.

If you want to order food from only one webshop.
What would you choose?
 

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Tops is a good addition to the diet but does not have some of the vitamins that birds need, like D3. If your bird gets unfiltered (not through a window) sunlight 3 times a week for at least 15 mins, you may not need the D3. I am stuck inside for 6 months a year so have no choice!

Roudybush is a good pellet and does not have menadione if you are trying to avoid it. Zupreem is well received by many birds, including my own. I dislike the dyes in the fruity, and wish they had a sugar free option though. That's the main downside with it. That said if I could choose any of the pellets (no experience with Beaphar) I would go with Harrison's. Just personal preference. Bird preference however... :lol:

I currently also shop multiple places for the seed mixes I like and the pellets I feed. If I had to choose one option though, I personally would go with option 2 because I don't feed a lot of seeds
 

Vera

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I like to feed some dry seed daily. What is your opinion about nutriberries? Especially de el paso en garden veggie?

Can this be feed instead of pellets/seed or both?
Wath about the ingredients and analyses?
 

painesgrey

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But i don't think such a small amount of menadione is harmfull or bad?

Anybody here feeds the roudybush california blend to their small birds?what is your experience?do they eat all of it?


I feed California Blend to my birds (in addition to Zupreem Natural and other mixes for variety). I noticed that they weren't eating all of the dried fruit/veg in the blend so I switched to just the Daily Maintenance to save money, and they did not like the pellets and would only eat them as a last resort. They seem to only like the pellets that have shared a bag with the dried fruit/veg. Figures.

 

clawnz

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Tops is the ONLY real food pellet.
Simple.
The others are lying to you.

And Menadione added to any bird food is not excepted.
It will build up over time, and then the dose that people say is so small it does not matter.
Will Really matter.

And that is only one of the items included in most pellets.
I can never come to understand why so many still back the lies.
Whatever happened to love and care of our birds?

To me their longevity is most important.
I am not going to feed them some dead ground up mush. Loaded up with manufactured rubbish.
Harrisons IS NOT totally Organic. It has manufactured additives. WAKE UP!
They lie to you just the same as so many other manufactures.
WHY! Just so you are sucked into Must Buy. Must Feed. Their bulldookey rubbish.

Vitamin K is readily available in fresh foods.
And unlike so many of these manufactured chemicals, are FAR BETTER for your birds.

Sally Blanchard has a great writ up on pellets.
You will find much more factual truth there than what some are posting or promoting.
 
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Vera

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clawnz : i understand what you are saying and i also believe that feeding fresh food is the best way to go, but if you cannot get your bird to eat enough fresh stuff and variety, you have to use other safety nets.
i don't know if the small pieces of veggies that she eats, is enough to provide the needed nutrients. and not all nutrients are providedin seeds, veggies, sprouts, grains and legumes i think? I am worried that i do her short when not feeding a pellet with added vitamins and minerals.
this are the veggies she wil eat, but only very small pieces: Chili pepper, carrot, zuchini, broccoli, brussel sprouts.
this is the grain/legume mix: lentils red, brown and black beans, frog and split peas, wheat, barley, oats, buckwheat, corn, shepherd's purse, fennel, red pepper, peppers, leeks.
sproutmix:Buckwheat, wheat, mung beans, short brown rice and adzuki beans.
seedmix: white seed, linseed, buckwheat, millet, quinoa, amaranth, sunflower seeds, spelt, oats, fennel seed, milk thistle seed, carrot, sesame seeds, dandelion leaves, buckthorn berry, and lavender.
 

clawnz

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Yes I understand what you are trying to say.

Lets try looking at it this way.

Only by feeding at the manufactures rates, Could there be any benefits.
YES! I will say even I have seen short term gains. It is the long term build up that DOES cause issues later in life. With pellet based diets.
But in every case, where I have seen gains, it was because the bird had been on horrible so called diet.

On the other hand. I have documented enough cases now. Where removal of all processed foods and supplements has seen a huge turn around in a bird.
Much better health and the birds have become far move interactive.
The yongest was only 15mths old.

So when you are only feeding 25% or less.
It is doing nothing.

Only if there is a problem Would you target that problem, not try to cover with pellets.

It is no better than putting medications in the water.
Way too random.

You are far more likely if feeding a pellet based diet of long term damage.
And as I keep saying. Over dose is far harder to test for. And Far harder to fix.

There is enough clear evidence that birds can suffer from malnutrition on a pellet based diet.
Add to that kidney and liver damage.

I run a pest free bird room.
No processed foods (well maybe a biscuit or some other treat, now and then).
No supplements. (Well again I do break this rule maybe once a month. And grind things into their seed mix.)

I would NEVER dose, prior to testing. Test first dose after. Only target what is needed.
Simple rule to follow.
 

painesgrey

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There is enough clear evidence that birds can suffer from malnutrition on a pellet based diet.
Add to that kidney and liver damage.
Please stop lying. There is absolutely no scientific evidence that shows that healthy birds fed a pelleted diet suffer from long-term malnutrition or liver/kidney problems. You're not doing anyone any favors by spreading this blatant misinformation.
 

clawnz

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Well guess what?

My blatant misinformation just maybe far more factual than, than you admitting you are wrong.

One of my contacts, referring to necropsies, done over many years, is where we accumulated some of the data.

I guess it could be pure coincidence.

Nothing I have posted is false. As far as I am aware.
I leave that up to the pellet manufactures.
 

Vera

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I think malnutrition can happen with any diet?
But how can i be most sure to feed my bird the needed nutrients?
I don't feel safe feeding her only the above diet without pellets. Not sure she eats enough variety to provide the needed nutrients and to stay healthy.
So adding pellets is a safety net for nutrients that are missing i think......
 

Gazimon

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I currently use Roudybush and previously used Zupreem Fruitblend as a 'transition pellet' to get my birds to learn to eat pellets. My choice is more due to a local limitation, as I can still find Roudybush in some pet supply shops, but I have yet to see Harrisons and TOPs unless I order online. However, ordering online for me comes with risk of pellets arriving crushed.

I use Roudybush Crumble for my budgies as the Mini size is too big for them. For my lovebirds with stronger bite, I use Roudybush California Mini. Although I am not sure they eat the dried fruit, I will continue to buy California as they seem to like dunking the bits in water... aka I'll treat it as an additional enrichment activity for them for both texture and taste.

For additional ingredients, I let them have Goldenfeast Australian Blend, and Goldenfeast Petite Legume Blend.
 

alshgs

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I use Harrisons High Potency fine for mine, as recommended by my vet.
 

Mizzely

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Don't let people bully you into doing something you aren't comfortable with. You learn about your choices, consider your situation and your bird, and make your decision based on that.
 

Vera

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I am not comfortable with any of both camps.not with the "no pellet" camp and not with the "most pellet" camp.
That is why i think i stick to a varied diet:the veggies she will eat with sprouted grains and legumes and cooked grains and legumes, a dry seedmix and some pellets. Best of both worlds.
 
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clawnz

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Don't let people bully you into doing something you aren't comfortable with. You learn about your choices, consider your situation and your bird, and make your decision based on that.
So true.

Shame it has been the manufactures, Av vets with NO Study on Avian Nutrition, And a number of others.
Who have badgered, bullied, lied, you into feeding ground up much loaded with synthetic supplements.
There is actually No independent study showing that adding any pellet to a birds diet is anywhere as good as real foods.

I have and will keep repeating the very fact that unless you are feeding 80% more of any pellet as the diet.
YOU ARE WASTING your time.

When a person accuses me of lying, yet cannot produce any evidence to show that.
What does that make them?
Sure makes makes you feel better! Right?

Same as it is WELL KNOWN that most synthetic supplements do not work the same as natural ones.

Example: Yes I know a few of you do not care that most pellets contain nasty additives.

Lets take VitK. Menadione TOXIC.
There are so many natural foods you can feed that have K in them.
So why do you need a known BANNED substance in anything you feed your birds.

Yes there is clear evidence, that once pellets have been removed, a bird can in most cases recover.
Except the toxic over loads the likes of VitA.
This is just one of them that the body cannot excrete. And here is the key to the facts I keep trying educate about.
Some people are not willing to do there only research and study.
It reminds me of a person who once said "I will never trust food that has not been processed.
Sally would call this the IDIOT FACTOR.

You have no factual knowledge, but follow blindly into commercial processed so called foods.

The list just keeps getting longer.

"The conference program I wrote about previously, each of the veterinarians and manufacturer’s representatives made it very clear that their product was by far the best on the market even though the most pushed one at that conference is, in my opinion, the worst because it is full of synthetic chemical nutrition, artificial food color, Menadione, and other ingredients I wouldn't feed to my outdoor squirrels. There is always a bias to push a product when people manufacture, represent or sell a product."

"I have paid very close attention to the world of parrots for over 4 decades. I never heard about as many parrots dying of cancer as in the last two decades or so. Is it a coincidence that this started when pelleted diets became the only food recommended by companies and misinformed veterinarians? Does the increase in cancer have to do with the reliance on chemically laden pelleted diets like it does in dogs? One ingredient that is in almost all pelleted diets is Menadione (it has middle and last names like Menadione 'Bisulfate Complex” but it is the same horrible stuff if it starts with Menadione) other also called “A Source of Vitamin K Activity” by some companies. It is banned in human foods in the U.S. and pet foods in several countries in Europe because it is considered a carcinogen but it is in so many parrot pellets that it is disgusting to me. Of course the companies will tell you that there is so little of it that it isn't a problem, but then they want you to feed their product as a total diet every day for the rest of its life – which could be a lot shorter if you do."
 

Mizzely

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Please don't quote me to further your agenda. I was calling you the bully. Making the rest of us feel bad or like we are doing something wrong by feeding pellets. You are just as "bad" as the companies you vilify.

I have a Jardine's right now that I rescued after he was fed only seeds for 19 years. He is underweight and has many ailments, all stemming from nutritional deficiencies. He won't each veggies, bird bread, etc. The one thing he WILL eat is pellets - so guess what he is eating? And he is finally gaining weight, is getting better - because of the awful pellets that are allowing his body to recover.

I took pellets away from my Quaker as he enjoys veggies and grain so much. Quite balanced. He started plucking. Is that "proof" that pellets are good? No, but certainly doesn't convince me they are bad.
 
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