Hormonal help

[AviMom]

From what I've read online, Amazon's normal season (?) Runs from December to June. But does that mean they're hormonal 6 months a year? I've been reading horror stories about hormonal birds in general, bloody attacks, even from sweet, gentle birds. I admit I'm used to smaller birds, parakeets, tiels,....and mine are all really young. Our Amazon is making crazy noises like he's going to lay an egg, growling, moaning, weird wing flutters, and rubbing his butt against things with his legs spread very wide.
This lasts 2-3 minutes, and then he waddles away. He does this 3-4 times a day. I'm already leary of him. Should we just leave him alone during this time? I need some hormonal amazon advice.....please!!!!!

 

[txdyna65]

@melissasparrots

 

[BirdManDan]

There are several things you can do. I'll send you some links that might help you out.

 

[AviMom]

@BirdManDan thank you so much, already been exploring. When i have a bit more time, I'll delve deeper, and reply back.

One more question, if any one knows....when a parrot does a little head Bob, head jerky, almost looks like he's gonna wretch thing....what does that mean? It's like he's trying to tell me something, but I'm just not getting it.

 

[Clueless]

@BirdManDan thank you so much, already been exploring. When i have a bit more time, I'll delve deeper, and reply back.

One more question, if any one knows....when a parrot does a little head Bob, head jerky, almost looks like he's gonna wretch thing....what does that mean? It's like he's trying to tell me something, but I'm just not getting it.

He loves you.

MC also has a bell he does that for.

Type in regurgitation up in the search bar and you'll get far more than you want to know.

My two are boys and no, they aren't hormonal for six months of the year.

 

[melissasparrots]

From what I've read online, Amazon's normal season (?) Runs from December to June. But does that mean they're hormonal 6 months a year? I've been reading horror stories about hormonal birds in general, bloody attacks, even from sweet, gentle birds. I admit I'm used to smaller birds, parakeets, tiels,....and mine are all really young. Our Amazon is making crazy noises like he's going to lay an egg, growling, moaning, weird wing flutters, and rubbing his butt against things with his legs spread very wide.
This lasts 2-3 minutes, and then he waddles away. He does this 3-4 times a day. I'm already leary of him. Should we just leave him alone during this time? I need some hormonal amazon advice.....please!!!!!

How sure are you that he is really a he? This sounds more like female amazon behavior although males will certainly do such things. I've never heard a male really carry on with the squatting and moaning like a female will. Males might do some wing fluttering briefly and might even masturbate with some funny breathing, but hormones with males tends to go along with aggression and the actual sexual display is often brief.. Females can sometimes though not always be rather vocally explicit when feeling sexy and the squatting and fluttering can go on for a while. Especially if their favorite human is around. If you are seeing hormones and no aggression, I'd seriously think girl bird. Also, what species of amazon do you have? The ones most notorious for going hormonal, attacking people and staying that way for months are male yellow napes, double yellow heads and blue fronts. With the napes and double yellows more often being the worst. A LOT of people with females will tell you that toward their favorite person, they only get sweeter with hormones. Most females will not launch an attack against someone although if they don't like the person, they may bite if the opportunity presents itself such as a person sticking their fingers in harms way. Many of the smaller species of amazons (orange winged, red lored, lilac crowned etc) stay sweet regardless of sex or have much more minor aggression issues.

If I assume you have a DNA tested nape or double yellow head, yes, your bird can be hormonal and attack you from across the room for a solid 6 months of the year plus depending on age and the environment you keep him in. Young males during their first few years of maturity in the 7-12 year old range can be pretty hard to live with. I was warned that year 8 would be a turning point for my sweet male nape and it was, and I have scars to prove it. I also keep him in view of two mature female napes and that does not help. I also do not restrict his day light and I stay up to all hours during the summer which does not help. Even a male double yellowhead or nape, if kept as a single male that has never been allowed access to a female and you have no other green birds in remotely the same size range, and you limit him to 8-10 hours of daylight during the summer might come out of it without going nearly as crazy as my male or a male that is rehomed from a breeding situation or that has a lot of already bad habits. No guarantees when it comes to males of the "hot 3" species though.

 

[Clueless]

Wow. Guess I was blessed with my two. They're blue front males.

 

[AviMom]

Is it considered regurgitation if he doesn't actually throw anything up? I'm starting to think he answers "yes" & "no". I talk to him constantly, and ask "do you want a head rub?" And "would you like a treat?"....things like that. He definitely exhibits a head shake, "no" or the bob, "yes", to some, not all questions. Maybe it's coincidence, or my imagination, but still just getting used to him.
When we got him, not much was known about him, but his name was Melvin.....took that as him being a male.

 

[Clueless]

I think so but I'm a fairly new bird owner. Got my guys about 6 or 7 years ago.

Personally I think of it as a dry heave type of thing, like we might do if something was stuck in our throat.

When he goes in for his vet visit, you may want to get the vet to do the DNA test too. It generally takes a little while for results to come back. The vet told me it would help in future if the bird became ill to know if female or male (males can't get egg bound ).

 

[melissasparrots]

Is it considered regurgitation if he doesn't actually throw anything up? I'm starting to think he answers "yes" & "no". I talk to him constantly, and ask "do you want a head rub?" And "would you like a treat?"....things like that. He definitely exhibits a head shake, "no" or the bob, "yes", to some, not all questions. Maybe it's coincidence, or my imagination, but still just getting used to him.
When we got him, not much was known about him, but his name was Melvin.....took that as him being a male.

A lot of mine will do the head bob without actually regurgitating. My pet female amazon and macaw do it a lot. The amazon usually only during the breeding season.

 

[AviMom]

He (?) Is so weird. I let him out of the cage, he climbs over to me, and gets close (I think he'd get on my shoulder or hand if I let him, but I move away) climbs on a pillow, and for it this whole "mating" ritual. It lasts 2-4 minutes, then he make a little growling noise, then climbs back on his cage or perch and plays.
He hates my roommate, whenever he's around, the wings flare up, tail spreads out, he starts screaming, and starts down the cage to chase my roommate, trying to bite his feet.
He saw himself in a mirror yesterday and started that same basic behavior.
I started clicker training him yesterday. Rewarding good behaviors. He's doing really well.

 

[AviMom]

I seriously don't think I'm cut out for large parrots. I am so afraid of being bitten.
Sangria, one of the African grays, gives me kisses thru the cage bars. She now climbs over to be as close as she can to me, and yesterday, I believe she wanted to step up on me, but I freaked out thinking she was going to bite.
I can't seem to take that risk of testing the waters. I've read things, watched videos about bird body language, eye pinning, etc. But no matter what, I cannot bring myself to taking that step of trust in these birds.
I talk to them, give them treats, lol, risk my lips....(all thru cages) but not My fingers, hands, arms, anything that makes me feel I may be bitten outside the cage bars.
I want a relationship with these magnificent creatures. I try to gain their trust, but can't trust them back.
Anyone who did not raise their fids from babies, who maybe got a rescue bird, give me some idea of how they got to the point they felt they could trust their bird not to rip chunks out of them? When did you feel you could trust them? Was there an obvious sign? A subtle clue? Anything?
How do I get over this fear?

 

[melissasparrots]

Possibly stupid question. How did you come to have an amazon if you are afraid of them? Are you the primary owner that must handle the bird?
I got nailed by my first amazon the first time she stepped up for me. Amazons will absolutely do that sort of thing. I knew it was coming and I was willing to accept it. She's generally a little wound up but not a bad bird. Once we established that I'm not afraid of her, biting stopped being fun. She was just overly excited and a little defensive because she was in her previous owner's home still and probably knew she was about to get rehomed because she'd been rehomed a few times. I also was not a first time big bird owner. I had my cockatoo since she was relatively freshly weaned. Going from cockatiel to cockatoo was tough. I picked a sweet big bird to start with that had more fear issues than real aggression issues and then I didn't force anything on her. I also accepted that I might get bit. She went through a typical adolescent nippy/beak testing phase a few months after I got her which helped prime me for bites. Then she really bit me almost badly several times through no fault of her own. She got tangled up in some rope from a perch and I had to cut her out while she was repeatedly putting holes in my hand. It had to happen. I wasn't going to let her die like that so the choice to take the bites was pretty clear. After that, macaw beaks didn't look so large as they did before. I used to be willing to hold most birds but not macaws. After the cockatoo bite incident, I stopped really caring if I got bit. I think you can ease your way into it a few different ways. Visit some babies at a breeder and get used to dealing with some naughty babies. Go to a rescue and ask to see their sweetest tempered big birds. Or bite the bullet and go for it. Once that first nasty bite is over, you either loose the fear or it doubles. With amazons, sometimes you get a bird that just has it in for a certain person and there really isn't a whole anyone can do to change it.
That said, I'm still not a big fan of holding other people's birds. Even their little birds. Why get bit if I don't have to? If its one of my own and I must handle it then I'm willing to take the bites for the sake of training and learning about the bird. Even if its learning what not to do. I usually get my worst bites within a few months after getting a new bird and especially after getting a new species where I'm still learning body language.
Helpful hint for first time handling an amazon, consider doing it away from its cage. If the bird actually belongs to someone else, have them step it up and take it elsewhere. Or even have them put it on the floor and you can step it up from there. Many amazons are very willing to step up to anyone from the floor.

 

[Clueless]

I seriously don't think I'm cut out for large parrots. I am so afraid of being bitten.
Sangria, one of the African grays, gives me kisses thru the cage bars. She now climbs over to be as close as she can to me, and yesterday, I believe she wanted to step up on me, but I freaked out thinking she was going to bite.
I can't seem to take that risk of testing the waters. I've read things, watched videos about bird body language, eye pinning, etc. But no matter what, I cannot bring myself to taking that step of trust in these birds.
I talk to them, give them treats, lol, risk my lips....(all thru cages) but not My fingers, hands, arms, anything that makes me feel I may be bitten outside the cage bars.
I want a relationship with these magnificent creatures. I try to gain their trust, but can't trust them back.
Anyone who did not raise their fids from babies, who maybe got a rescue bird, give me some idea of how they got to the point they felt they could trust their bird not to rip chunks out of them? When did you feel you could trust them? Was there an obvious sign? A subtle clue? Anything?
How do I get over this fear?

So I'm different.

I work with a T stick. MC can step from the T stick to my arm. If I worry because of his actions, back from the arm to the T stick.

Secret can step from T stick onto my leg. I sit on the floor and I cover my leg with baby blankets first. You have the close relationship, minimize bites. I hand feed treats and even chop in a small metal container. I watch carefully with the container. MC can grab and throw it.

I type for a living. Can't do 100 wpm if I'm in bandages. No work, no toys.

There's no unwritten rule on this. My guys were wild caught so I take it slow. I have a lifetime.... mine and theirs.

 

[AviMom]

Possibly stupid question. How did you come to have an amazon if you are afraid of them? Are you the primary owner that must handle the bird?

No, it is my roommate's amazon. He also has 2 African grays. My rm is 81 years old and has macular degeneration. He had an aviary for years, but after his wife died, he lost interest in the birds. Since I moved in, and became such a bird enthusiast, his enthusiasm has grown again. I help with his birds, as well as take care of mine. He has the large parrots, 2 sun conures, which are so sweet, a Quaker parrot who is nasty to everyone but my rm, and 2 cockatiels.
He had Sangria, the AG, and she used to be tame, but sat in her cage for a few years. No toys, seed diet, and even though she's still sweet, he is afraid of her. I have gotten him to let her out of the cage, I give her fresh food, and I sit and talk to her. I also do most of the cage cleaning.
We got Smokey, another AG, and Tracy, an Amazon, from a friend of mine who was needing to rehome them. They are not tame.
My roommate has tried to handle them, and has had a few nasty bites. Please don't get me wrong here, my rm is a very sweet person, but doesn't go about taming/training the way I think he should.
I think some things that he does just makes the birds worse. His approach is a bit rough. I think he scares them, not meaning to, but none the less, partly due to his poor eye sight.
It wasn't until Moses, his Quaker got into trouble, and he had to rescue him that he started handling him again. I did get bitten by Moses once, and it hurt!! And he's a small parrot. I once tried to get Sangria to stepup, and she pinched my arm, and that hurt enough for me. Lmao, when I first got my parakeets and got bitten, I thought that hurt!!
I know I'm being a bit of a wuss, and if I really want to move forward with these birds, I have to be willing to take a bite. I feel like if I can get them more tame, my rm may take even a bit more interest in them. If I don't, they may be left in their cages again. He would spend more time with them if he was able to enteract with them more. I'm spread thin with my birds, and his. I can't mix them together, like conures and parakeets. With all the cleaning, I only have so much time to spend with each one.
I have found out that you cannot, and should not try to force a bird to do anything. It only works against you. The only time I may "force" a bird is if it was in danger. Believe it or not, my parakeets have trained me. I got so discouraged with them I thought about selling them. Then I went back to square one. I stopped trying to make them like me, and just decided to let them decide to like me. Now, they like me. They trust me. I'm still learning, and everyone here is so helpful. I learn something new here every day. This site is so helpful, so friendly, and I appreciate everyone here.

 

[melissasparrots]

I got so discouraged with them I thought about selling them. Then I went back to square one. I stopped trying to make them like me, and just decided to let them decide to like me. Now, they like me. They trust me. I'm still learning, and everyone here is so helpful. I learn something new here every day. This site is so helpful, so friendly, and I appreciate everyone here.

That is a very important concept to get. You can't make the amazon or the greys like you. But, you can treat them with respect and let them decide for themselves. Why not just handle it a little bit more laid back. Walk past and give them a treat periodically. Instead of kissing their beak as they stick it through the cage bars, rub it with a finger. Maybe someday you will get more adventurous and be able to rub the skin under the chin or cheeks. It is also good to ask if the bird wants scritches. I extend my finger just outside of bite range and as "do you want scratches?" if the bird does not flash their eyes, flare their tail or show me scary body language, turn their back on me or growl, then I proceed with caution. Do be warned, a lot of greys and some amazons will con you. They'll put their head down and then at the last second snap it up and bite you. Sometimes you just have to take a leap of faith and learn from experience. Plus, we in the civilized world have emergency rooms if you end up needing stitches. No big deal. Also, just so you know, I find quaker bites to be the least painful of similar sized parrot bites. If the grey just pinched you and it didn't leave a bruise or welt, she was probably just testing your arm or maybe just testing your response. Generally, you know when you've been bitten. Everything else is just minor discomfort that goes along with big birds. Stronger feet mean the toenails dig in more, bigger beaks means accidents happen even when they don't mean it and it also means sometimes you have to teach them to be gentle because they don't know they are hurting you. This is often the case with birds that haven't been handled for a while. They go a little feral and it takes some patience, compassion and bravery to get them back to being easy to handle.