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Citron Crested Questions

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Amali

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I currently have a Timneh Grey female, Amali, and, well - the thought of adding another bird has started creeping up on me, and surprisingly enough, my non-birdloving husband agrees as long as I don't bring home a species that will blast his eardrums. :p

The breeder where I got Amali also breeds Citron Crested Cockatoos that I found absolutely adorable when I was at his place so I've been doing some reading up on them. Everything I have read indicates they are the quietest of the cockatoos and make wonderful pets, but I know that sometimes all the reading in the world doesn't compare to hearing first hand stories from those who have experience with the bird. Do any of you have - or have had - a Citron? Anyone with experience around one that might give me some input?

I'm in no rush - though new baby syndrome is so much fun - and want to make the right decision for our family. If it turns out a Citron would be a bad match, I will just take my time to figure out another species that would 'fit' us.

 

Jaybird

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Do you have the time? Cockatoos are a very attention-needing species-- far more than any other parrot. They're incredibly sensitive, emotional, and more hands-on than a Grey. They definitely aren't for families that work full-time and can't devote a solid block every day to their particular needs. Feather-plucking, mutilation, screaming, misplaced aggression.. are all very common problems amongst Cockatoos, created by people who truly intended to do them right, but were unprepared for the daunting task that is being a 'Too Parront. There's a reason why there are so many in rescues; especially the large species. So please, don't just be lured in by their cuteness and charm. :)
 

Amali

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Thanks for the reply, Hope. I am definitely not taking the decision lightly - nor will I be swayed by cuteness or charm. ;) I am just starting the process of looking into what other species would fit well with our family ... no rush at all.

My husband and I both work full time so if that is an automatic disqualifier, than clearly I need to look at other species. We spend a good amount of our time off at home and Amali gets plenty of out of cage time each day after work, but that works for her - perhaps not so for a 'too?
 

JLcribber

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There is no such thing as a quiet "healthy" TOO. A healthy bird vocalizes twice a day (as a minimum). Usually in the mornings and evenings and should actually be encouraged.

If your concerned about noise at all then your going to be sorely disappointed and possibly regretful. Your "vision" of how they are and what you are really going to have are way different.
 

jmfleish

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There is no such thing as a quiet "healthy" TOO. A healthy bird vocalizes twice a day (as a minimum). Usually in the mornings and evenings and should actually be encouraged.

If your concerned about noise at all then your going to be sorely disappointed and possibly regretful. Your "vision" of how they are and what you are really going to have are way different.
HA HA! I was going to say exactly the same thing!:) I would suggest another grey personally. Of course, I have a Timneh who is now 9 and he's bonded with my Rose Breasted. Watching the two of them together is a total hoot. They get into more trouble together.

Here are a few pictures of them trying to charm their way upstairs from the bird room...

DSC03688.JPG DSC03642.jpg DSC03646.jpg
 
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Jaybird

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Thanks for the reply, Hope. I am definitely not taking the decision lightly - nor will I be swayed by cuteness or charm. ;) I am just starting the process of looking into what other species would fit well with our family ... no rush at all.

My husband and I both work full time so if that is an automatic disqualifier, than clearly I need to look at other species. We spend a good amount of our time off at home and Amali gets plenty of out of cage time each day after work, but that works for her - perhaps not so for a 'too?
They need more than 'out of cage' time. They need time WITH YOU. They are very people-focused birds, and sometimes a little too intense for most to handle properly. And, all Cockatoos are loud. I really love John's response, because it is accurate. I think you should definitely look towards another species. Pionus are quiet, and fairly 'docile' birds-- and far less needy than 'toos.
 

Amali

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There is no such thing as a quiet "healthy" TOO. A healthy bird vocalizes twice a day (as a minimum). Usually in the mornings and evenings and should actually be encouraged.

If your concerned about noise at all then your going to be sorely disappointed and possibly regretful. Your "vision" of how they are and what you are really going to have are way different.
See - this is the thing - I WON'T be regretful. I am doing my research first. You answer my questions as if I said I'm going to get a Citron regardless of what I learn. I very pointedly said that I wanted firsthand input rather than just what several websites detailed these birds to be. Thanks for your responses, I will continue to look for a bird that will fit with our family.
 

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Haha, the quietest cockatoo is still a VERY LOUD bird. I have a Goffins which is one of the smallest cockatoos but he still loves to hoot and holler with the best of them. I am fortunate enough to be able to work from home and I cannot even imagine having a cockatoo in a home where no one is home all day. They require so much attention and one on one interaction to be happy and healthy. They are very cuddly and very cute but they are also one of the most high maintenance birds. Good for you, doing your research ahead of time. There are so many cockatoos out there looking for second and third and fourth homes because their owners did not. I got Kai when he was only 7 months old and I am already his second (and LAST) home. I would highly suggest you look into the poicephalus species if you are interested in a quieter bird that can entertain itself while you are away. I have an African Red Belly who talks up a storm and loves to be out of his cage but can also entertain himself all day in his cage if he needs to. Good luck with your search.
 

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See - this is the thing - I WON'T be regretful. I am doing my research first. You answer my questions as if I said I'm going to get a Citron regardless of what I learn. I very pointedly said that I wanted firsthand input rather than just what several websites detailed these birds to be. Thanks for your responses, I will continue to look for a bird that will fit with our family.
I apologize if I sounded harsh. It drives me nuts when people express concern about noise and then mention they want a cockatoo. I have a hard time sugar coating it because they are a contradiction of terms.

When I mentioned "possible" regret I was thinking more about your non bird loving husband.

I'd have to agree that another Grey is the most natural choice and the one that has the best chance of success. The biggest reason being they understand each other and have the same instincts.
 

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I don't know, Kishka has his moments and does like to scream when he's playing but he certainly doesn't need to be with me 24/7 and he is very good at entertaining himself. I think that what is most important with Cockatoos is that they are raised to know that they are birds and that they aren't spoiled and held constantly. Kishka was raised in an aviary with his own kind and came to me at five months of age. Yes, he still craves attention at 2 years old now but he can also play independently. I have a job outside the house 40 hours a week and run a business and he does fine. I don't think you have to be a stay at home mom to own a Cockatoo. Sometimes I think that may be a bad thing. You just have to have a bird who is independent. That's the best kind of Cockatoo in my mind.

You'll never find a quiet Cockatoo, but then again, you'll probably never find a quiet parrot. That's like asking them not to be messy. There are different levels of noisiness though. I'll take my Rosie over my D2 any day of the week and each Cockatoo is going to be an individual too but every one of them is probably going to sound off once or twice a day...if they don't they probably aren't very happy and you don't want that either.
 

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They're not quiet and they make horrible "pets". Cockatoos think of themselves as equals. Think of themselves as people. Not eveyone makes a good bird owner, and within that already small good bird owner people, even fewer make good cockatoo people.
 

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Think of themselves as people.
And that's where the problem lies. I've met wonderful Cockatoos, but they know they aren't people, they have been taught they are not people and know they are birds. Too often, these birds are treated like people and are confused about how to behave. They consider themselves to be little feathered people. Raise them to realize that they are not humans but birds, and I think the outcome is much different.
 

Amali

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Thanks for all of the replies. :)

There will be no regret for my not-as-crazy-about-birds-as-I-am hubby either because I will make sure of it. I won't bring a species into our home that I have any doubt whatsoever about it being a lifetime commitment.

I do understand that it is easy to read between the lines and assume that each new post is similar to one from the past from someone who will fly off the handle and buy some cute new baby bird because they couldn't resist the urge. But for those people who come here truly looking for information and input to help them make decisions, avoiding the knee-jerk reaction responses will go a lot farther. I'm glad I stuck the thread out rather than getting offended initially ... I truly do appreciate the input that many of you have given.

It sounds like a Citron *could* fit into our home with the right training and possibly a lot of luck in it not being a screamer. Given my circumstances though, I don't like to rely on luck and will continue to search for a good fit for our house. :) Maybe it is another grey, maybe it is a Pionus as was mentioned earlier ... I will keep looking until I know it is right to go ahead and buy :)
 

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I have to say that the greys truly melt your heart away. You have a Timneh already, so a Congo would be the next logical step and they are so different!;)
 

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It sounds like a Citron *could* fit into our home with the right training and possibly a lot of luck in it not being a screamer. Given my circumstances though, I don't like to rely on luck and will continue to search for a good fit for our house. :) Maybe it is another grey, maybe it is a Pionus as was mentioned earlier ... I will keep looking until I know it is right to go ahead and buy :)
Pionus are not always good family birds, although they are usually quite quiet. They couldn't be more opposite from a cockatoo.

This is my favorite site describing the Citron personality: Citron Crested Cockatoos - Hornbeam Aviary

Most breeders only tell you about the good, probably partially because they only deal with babies, but that breeder is well aware of the challenges a cockatoo presents. Good luck with your decision and welcome to AA!
 

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Hornbeam is excellent. I would definitely love to get a Cockatoo from them if I were in the market. I very much respect them for their knowdedge of Cockatoos.
 

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Hornbeam is excellent. I would definitely love to get a Cockatoo from them if I were in the market. I very much respect them for their knowdedge of Cockatoos.
I have always thought Hornbeam is the only place I would ever buy a Too! I probably never will, but if I did. It is very inspiring to see how they raise their babies. :)
 

melissasparrots

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Its very popular right now to go on and on about how bad cockatoos are. They have a reputation for being only for the elite or most dedicated of parrot owners and impossible to own by the average person. That is the message some people want you to believe. I would tend to agree that a cockatoo owner needs to have a certain amount of dedication more so than the average person has. And that is more difficult when you have another human in the house whose tolerance and dedication level is lower than your own. A lot of sad case cockatoo rehomes come from complications with the other human. Usually this points more to a relationship problem between the couple than a real problem with the bird, but regardless the bird ends up needing a new home.

However, I don't think they have to be that bad. You can actually have one and work full time. I have two cockatoos plus a bunch of other birds and I'm a teacher. I also (gasp) have a life and sometimes I spend a few hours in the evening away from home. And my cockatoos are still fine. In terms of vocalizations, a citron can be very hit and miss. I have a larger sulfur crest(close relatives of citrons) and she is the quietest bird here most of the day. She lets out about 1-5 ear bleeding screams in the evening several times a week. But rarely is it more than one episode a day and usually each episode is about 30 seconds or less. My goffin's isn't too bad. She came to me doing a lot more screaming than she does now and she will carry on longer than the sulfur, but she's still not a screamer. I would say, if periodic loud screaming is a deal breaker, its probably best just to not get a cockatoo. To be on the safe side, realize that within the realm of normal for a cockatoo would be 1-20 minutes of periodic screaming a couple times a day. If the bird is doing more than that, then you might need to take a close look at what your reinforcing behaviorally, and what the bird has to do to work some of that energy off and keep its brain stimulated.

I would not let your work schedule kill your idea of having a cockatoo. Unless you have such a busy social life that you just aren't home most evenings or you like to go on month long vacations a couple times a year. Plan on spending a good hour or so with your bird most days, make sure you have plenty of toys. Make sure most days he also gets another hour or more of out of cage time that is on a gym or cage top with you just around the house to interact with but not cuddle with. That should be plenty unless you spoil it in the beginning and teach it that it needs mommy around all the time to feel secure. The dedication part of cockatoo ownership comes into play when you have to be somewhere and you have to skip the out of cage time than the bird normally gets. As compensation, for a cockatoo you really should pause to give the bird something new to do before you leave. Like a foraging toy or something to stimulate the brain rather than leaving with just the same old same old toys that its been staring at for the last several days. A cockatoo low on stimulation will pluck, over preen, do self repetitive behaviors and scream a lot. Sometimes you have to be a little more inventive with toys as they age than just going to the petstore and buying a new one. They get a little jaded, been there done that and its all SOOOO boring as they get older. Keeping new stuff that is safe in front of them becomes a challenge.

Also, to set you off the right foot since most neediness problems start right at the beginning when you bring it home-make sure the breeder weans the baby fully at the bird's own pace. Don't bring that bird home until its been eating completely on its own for a good month or more would be best. Let it learn to be a bird at the breeders. If you get it home and it regresses and your not sure what to do but you feel sorry for it, and you need to hand-feed it when both you and it are insecure...I just think thats setting you up from the start to have a bird that thinks it needs mommy around to comfort it all the time. Your insecurity about what to do with a crying baby makes the baby insecure and everybody is worried and unhappy about the poor crying baby. Thats just my opinion. I think cockatoo breeders could do the species a major service by just keeping the birds until long past risk of regressing. Personally, I would suggest that breeders before sending home a baby cockatoo make sure that it isn't crying at them at all and its not doing any of the baby cockatoo head bobbing thing. If its showing any of those behaviors at the breeders, its going to do a lot of them at the new home. And that the breeder do things like take it on short road trips, move its cage around and still the bird is secure. If that sort of thing throws it off and makes it cry, its not ready to leave the breeder IMO. That might mean the breeder keeps it for one month past the last hand-feeding, or six months past the last hand-feeding depending on the bird.
Melissa
 
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Bokkapooh

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And that's where the problem lies. I've met wonderful Cockatoos, but they know they aren't people, they have been taught they are not people and know they are birds. Too often, these birds are treated like people and are confused about how to behave. They consider themselves to be little feathered people. Raise them to realize that they are not humans but birds, and I think the outcome is much different.
Im sorry, I disagree. Even a cockatoo who is brought up as a bird still thinks its equal to a person and they still have high egos and high regards of themselves. They are high maintenance birds whether they know they are birds or not. However, they are still.amazing companions to those that fit their personality and species traits. Amazing, wonderful birds.
 
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Jaybird

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Its very popular right now to go on and on about how bad cockatoos are. They have a reputation for being only for the elite or most dedicated of parrot owners and impossible to own by the average person. That is the message some people want you to believe. I would tend to agree that a cockatoo owner needs to have a certain amount of dedication more so than the average person has. And that is more difficult when you have another human in the house whose tolerance and dedication level is lower than your own. A lot of sad case cockatoo rehomes come from complications with the other human. Usually this points more to a relationship problem between the couple than a real problem with the bird, but regardless the bird ends up needing a new home.

However, I don't think they have to be that bad. You can actually have one and work full time. I have two cockatoos plus a bunch of other birds and I'm a teacher. I also (gasp) have a life and sometimes I spend a few hours in the evening away from home. And my cockatoos are still fine. In terms of vocalizations, a citron can be very hit and miss. I have a larger sulfur crest(close relatives of citrons) and she is the quietest bird here most of the day. She lets out about 1-5 ear bleeding screams in the evening several times a week. But rarely is it more than one episode a day and usually each episode is about 30 seconds or less. My goffin's isn't too bad. She came to me doing a lot more screaming than she does now and she will carry on longer than the sulfur, but she's still not a screamer. I would say, if periodic loud screaming is a deal breaker, its probably best just to not get a cockatoo. To be on the safe side, realize that within the realm of normal for a cockatoo would be 1-20 minutes of periodic screaming a couple times a day. If the bird is doing more than that, then you might need to take a close look at what your reinforcing behaviorally, and what the bird has to do to work some of that energy off and keep its brain stimulated.

I would not let your work schedule kill your idea of having a cockatoo. Unless you have such a busy social life that you just aren't home most evenings or you like to go on month long vacations a couple times a year. Plan on spending a good hour or so with your bird most days, make sure you have plenty of toys. Make sure most days he also gets another hour or more of out of cage time that is on a gym or cage top with you just around the house to interact with but not cuddle with. That should be plenty unless you spoil it in the beginning and teach it that it needs mommy around all the time to feel secure. The dedication part of cockatoo ownership comes into play when you have to be somewhere and you have to skip the out of cage time than the bird normally gets. As compensation, for a cockatoo you really should pause to give the bird something new to do before you leave. Like a foraging toy or something to stimulate the brain rather than leaving with just the same old same old toys that its been staring at for the last several days. A cockatoo low on stimulation will pluck, over preen, do self repetitive behaviors and scream a lot. Sometimes you have to be a little more inventive with toys as they age than just going to the petstore and buying a new one. They get a little jaded, been there done that and its all SOOOO boring as they get older. Keeping new stuff that is safe in front of them becomes a challenge.

Also, to set you off the right foot since most neediness problems start right at the beginning when you bring it home-make sure the breeder weans the baby fully at the bird's own pace. Don't bring that bird home until its been eating completely on its own for a good month or more would be best. Let it learn to be a bird at the breeders. If you get it home and it regresses and your not sure what to do but you feel sorry for it, and you need to hand-feed it when both you and it are insecure...I just think thats setting you up from the start to have a bird that thinks it needs mommy around to comfort it all the time. Your insecurity about what to do with a crying baby makes the baby insecure and everybody is worried and unhappy about the poor crying baby. Thats just my opinion. I think cockatoo breeders could do the species a major service by just keeping the birds until long past risk of regressing. Personally, I would suggest that breeders before sending home a baby cockatoo make sure that it isn't crying at them at all and its not doing any of the baby cockatoo head bobbing thing. If its showing any of those behaviors at the breeders, its going to do a lot of them at the new home. And that the breeder do things like take it on short road trips, move its cage around and still the bird is secure. If that sort of thing throws it off and makes it cry, its not ready to leave the breeder IMO. That might mean the breeder keeps it for one month past the last hand-feeding, or six months past the last hand-feeding depending on the bird.
Melissa
I would like to say that Goffins are FAR less intensive than the large cockatoos; most are more independent and can entertain themselves. They don't demand and generate the same kind of emotional need and stress as a Moluccan or Umbrella.
 
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