"But that is just how this bird is...."

[saroj12]

Is something I've heard a lot on bird forums.
I don't have a lot of experience with bird behavior or 'difficult' birds but sometimes when i hear that bird A or bird B or bird C does not like being handled, and is not social i think about Big Scooter. The rescue lady said he will lunge if you touch him, but he will step up nicely, and will kiss you on the lips. Just don't try to pet him and such. And that was very accurate at the time.

Many many many many hours of being together and many many many incremental steps later he is now a bird who loves to lie on my chest for hours and hours at bedtime and get cuddled and scritched and whatever else i want to do, like hold his feet and stuff. And i can carry him around like a baby around bedtime. In the daytime he will offer his head for scritches but still shies away from being touched anywhere on his back. In time i believe he will be more accepting of that too. So do you guys feels birds can change IF you give them infinite amounts of attention?
I tend to think so

BScoot is 17, arrived at 14 yo

 

[itzmered]

That is so great that B Scoot is more accepting of affection. I think it depends on the birds personality. Just like some people that are touchy huggy types and some dont want you to invade their space, I think some birds like it and some dont no matter how much time and attention you give them.

 

[birdlvr466]

It sure sounds like it from your experience Saroj. I do believe love patience and a lot of one on one time can make a huge difference. Also if a bird feels safe in its new home I think that can bring about a huge change. Congrats on all the progress you have made with B Scoot.

 

[Cydney]

That's great about BScoot!

I think it tends to depend on the bird. With Kai, it's 'just how he is'. He was originally intended to be a breeder but the fellow who originally had his name down on him backed out. I got Kai at about 5 months old. He wasn't afraid of people by any means and could be handled but didn't know 'step up' and wanted no part of being scratched. Now he seeks out my attention, loves to play, lets me roll him on his back and stretch out his wings and tolerates me petting him but refuses to let me rub his head or 'preen' him. He's not afraid and he won't bite but he'll meet my fingers with an open beak trying to play. He also tolerates me holding his body in one hand and getting the pin feathers on his head with my other hand. He'll actually fluff his feathers and roll his head around to help me for a few seconds at a time but he acts like there are MUCH more important things to be doing than preening... like wrestling!

Forgot to say, when Kai was sick all he wanted to do was cuddle up under my chin and have me rub/preen his head. He was content to lay on me and get pet and cuddled for hours at a time.

 

[Birdlover]

I think it depends on the bird and the person they are with. Some just click with each other and make progress others might not be able to. But there are some that I dont think will ever accept certain things, no matter the patience and time. Ringo, as an example, is so fearful of people and though he has made HUGE steps in becoming secure and happy, I dont think he would ever step up and allow cuddles. But, I dont blame him one bit since he was taken from the wild and has probably not had a very nice life Im just happy that he isnt afraid of me standing near him and that he sings for me. To me that is enough and I dont need to touch him if he doesnt want to go that far. Love my boy

I think it is awesome the progress you have made with B Scoot and shows how much time and love can do!

 

[Merlie]

I think some birds can "change" so to speak, in the right environment. I've definitely seen in within my flock.

However, I also believe that some things may never change, depending on how deeply they've been ingrained.

I often feel that progress with certain birds moves slower than molasses in winter time

 

[igors mum]

i think a lot depends on the bird and the issues it has .
my female galah was nasty as could be when i got her.she would lunge and bite with no warning at all. was a job changing her bowls out lol. but after a few years she has turned into a sweetheart. still wont step up yet but i can rub her anywheres now.she will let me play with her toes lift her wings etc but that step up onto my hand forget it.and now when she does bite its more of a beaking then out for blood like before (maybe she didnt like the taste of my blood after all lol)

i dont force anything on her if she isnt wanting it but come night time she has to have her head scratched and will follow the cover going over the cage to where im standing demanding more lol

 

[Saemma]

That's awesome what you have with B. Scooter.

 

[Birdasaurus]

I would just say that sometimes it's the way they are, and sometimes it can change.

Tango didn't want to be touched at all, but I knew it was because he was afraid. With love and patience I can now kiss his head, his beak, rub his feet, and sometimes touch his back if he's in a more relaxed mood.

I definitely cannot do this to him whenever I feel like it though, as he is not by definition a cuddly bird. He is independent and likes things on his time. That I know won't change...its his personality. This is completely the opposite of Honu who I can pick up and snuggle whenever I feel like it.

 

[Shade]

I also believe it can happen, but that it depends on the bird.

Joey, when he first arrived, was rather nippy with me. We've worked on it and he's much MUCH better.

Zuri has also come out of his bubble more since I got him and there is still progress being made.

But, however I can wish this to happen, I don't think Petey will ever be great with me. At this point, I'm gunning for a mutual respect - while he might never want to be with me, that at least he doesn't seek to attack as he does from time to time. I seriously believe something terrible happened to him before to make him this way and I do think it's really part of who he is - he's been here for nearly 3 years and while he's improved a lot with his attitude towards the other birds, I don't think it'll ever improve that much between him and women.

 

[Shade]

Ironic that as I finished typing this he just tried to do an aerial attack on me.
But life goes on

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

The basic nature of relationships is that they are always changing and this is demonstrated very well in our relationships with our birds. As they learn more about us and we learn more about them, change is inevitable. Add a modicum of trust into the relationship and you can have miracles.

 

[JLcribber]

the basic nature of relationships is that they are always changing and this is demonstrated very well in our relationships with our birds. As they learn more about us and we learn more about them, change is inevitable. Add a modicum of trust into the relationship and you can have miracles.

like!!!!

 

[allison]

I think there are some birds who would never learn to accept human affection. Some of the birds at the rescue, especially the wild caughts, I cannot picture ever getting fully tame.
Toady was handfed and a "pet" for a few years before becoming a breeder so that is why I think he was more accepting of human attention. It still took a little work though.

 

[Anne & Gang]

yes, fo course they can change and that is awesome that Big Scooter has learned to love and accept you...I think some birds may never change and that is ok too..as long as they are loved and cared for...just look at Mitch..now there's a change!

 

[HungryBird]

(The people I am referring to are not you guys! Other people, stupid people, not bird people.)

I don't think birds should have to suffer our touch if they don't want to. I think there is nothing wrong with a bird not letting you pet him or cuddle him. I like "mean" animals. I feel that quite often animals are labeled as mean because they don't like to be touched, which I see as normal. Why should a parrot let you scratch its neck? If I was a parrot I would allow my human slave to feed me and I might consent to sit on them but any other touching would be on my terms alone.

I do think that over time you can make progress but I think a lot of people have unrealistic expectations of their pets. Animals were not put here to amuse us or to allow us to have something fluffy or feathery to pet. I interact with two Amazons at a local pet store but I don't try to pet them even though the people in the store encourage me to. I just don't really believe in it. Sometimes they sit on me but mostly they just say hello to me. I can tell they don't really want me to pet them so I leave it alone. It actually drives me crazy when I see people forcing birds to step up or be touched. If I was a parrot I would bite people all the time for being so stupid as to think I wanted to be touched when I obviously wasn't asking for it.

Those people are the same people who think they should be allowed to pet every dog they see on the street. I love dogs, a lot. I don't run up to every strange dog on the street to pet it. My dog does not allow strangers to touch him. He's not mean about it, he just backs away from them. I can't tell you how many people have asked me to hold him still so they can pet him. They are shocked when I tell them he doesn't want to be touched and I'm not going to make him put up with it. My dog does not have some sort of psychological disorder, he loves being touched by people he knows, but he does not immediately accept strangers. There is a short introductory process you have to go through first. Then he will be stuck to you like velcro because for all his standoffish behavior on the street he is a cuddlebug.

I much prefer animals that choose who is allowed to touch them and who is not. I am the same way. I do not like to be touched by people I don't know. I hate those men who go around trying to hug every woman they meet, when we meet up and when we are parting. I love physical contact with the right person though! I've always dreamed of getting a really mean and nasty African Grey because I don't think I would mind not being able to cuddle with it and I would still love it and treat it well. I also think parrots are often "mean" because they are not having their needs met. I recently saw a Grey that is "mean" but the Grey is kept in a tiny rusty cage so that probably has a lot to do with it. He doesn't seem too mean to me. When I talk to him he looks at me and when I put my hand near the cage he doesn't lunge. Of course, he could very well be waiting for me to be stupid enough to put my hand in biting range! I just feel bad for the poor guy, he deserves better. I've had lots of success with "mean" animals and have had a few super aggressive animals that have been fine with me. I think once they realize I am not requiring them to do anything they don't want to do they are more accepting of me.

 

[Harley's Mom]

The basic nature of relationships is that they are always changing and this is demonstrated very well in our relationships with our birds. As they learn more about us and we learn more about them, change is inevitable. Add a modicum of trust into the relationship and you can have miracles.

Oh I certainly hope this is true, for Gryphon. He's made great progress in the two months he's been here. He also has 20+ years of baggage he's carrying with him, including being captured and ex-breeder. I feel so bad for him when I see him watching me cuddle with my other two. He will chirp over and over, but he's too scared of hands right now to even try scritches. He's always on guard like he's waiting for me to do something bad to him.

 

[Archiesmom]

That is so great that B Scoot is more accepting of affection. I think it depends on the birds personality. Just like some people that are touchy huggy types and some dont want you to invade their space, I think some birds like it and some dont no matter how much time and attention you give them.

I think this is a great answer.

 

[Thugluvgrl187]

Honestly, I think it depends on the bird. Some birds are more stubborn to change than others.

 

[ParrotsforKeeps]

It depends a lot on the bird, and why they exhibit the behaviors as to how long it will take and whether they will change. Change is the the only constant, as they say, so I don't think any bird's behavior is set in stone for life.

As far as taming for "pet quality", that depends a lot on your opinion of what constitutes "pet quality" behavior. Some people think a bird is not tame unless they always hop up to your shoulder, give kisses and ask for scritches. I consider them tame when they do not get upset with me close to them and will allow me to clean their cage, and will cooperate with me. Usually at this point they also really like interacting in some way and seems happy to see me, but I suppose that is not necessary.

If your goal is the former, then you may not ever get that, and your parrot will feel your expectations and start locking up. Not good. That is why I do often use the phrase "that is just the way they are" although I always add that can change with a lot of work, just don't count on anything.

If you consider that in the pat people made tame loving "pets" out of wild caught adult parrots, not to mention people taming their backyard finches, I see no reason why any parrot should be considered untamable.