Bus Training

[Chewy]

As some of you know now, Sydney is a Service dog. But he is a service dog that I trained for myself. Actually what he does for me he didn't need much training he helps me with my anxiety attacks. He comes to me and sits on my lap,or as close to me as he can. It's a little Uncomfortable on my lap lol.
But I never trained him for the bus system, because when I first got him I was not riding the bus I was terrified of it. I still don't particularly like it. But it would be easier if I could get him to come too.
So here's my idea of training him. Take him to the bus stop. Let the Bus go by ( a few times). Then let the bus stop. And if he doesn't bark and growl (that's what he did to the shuttle I was riding lol.) (but it was out of trying to protect me , and fear) give him a goody. Then if I get a nice bus driver, which I hope I will, I will ask if I can take my dog on then take him RIGHT Back off. ANd have a goody waiting for him.
The reason for all this? I don't want to live with my parents the rest of my life, and they don't want me to live with them the rest of my life. And if I want to go anywhere I will either have to get a car, which I am not good at driving, so if I do, stay off the roads and the side walks, and somehow out of your houselol. Or I will have to ride the bus. Which is probably Due to what I just said will probably be the best option for me.

 

[BraveheartDogs]

If he has any fear of the bus you need to desensitize him to it. If you don't do that, he will likely sensitize (get worse) instead of desensitize. I would go to the bus stop but not be very close with some VERY high value treats. Not just a "goody" something extremely high value like chicken. Every time a bus comes or goes by open bar him with chicken. This means you literally continue to feed the chicken in the presence of the bus. Do this until he looks excited and like he is anticipating the food whenever he sees a bus. If he is growling or barking he is WAY to close and over threshold and you need to back way off. Then, I would move forward to having him step onto a bus that is not running. You need to progress slowly so he can learn to be comfortable.

 

[zoomama]

I would call the bus office and let them know of your need to have a service dog and what you want to do. They may even work with you to try to help you. Many people (certainly not all) want to help folks with disabilities. You might get lucky.

 

[JLcribber]

Does Sydney have a "service dog" vest that says that? I doubt the bus service will take you seriously or even allow the dog on the bus without it.

 

[Chewy]

yes he has a vest.Actually they are slacking on that,I have seen people get on the bus without a vest or anything and the dog is walking up to other people and asking to be pet.But he always wears his vest when he is out in public.
Brave heart that is what I will try to do. I can't do Chicken because we are in a rough spot in the house right now...but he doesn't get his "goodies" everyday, so he should be excited by those lol. I usually tend to keep them for Monday nights, where we are all at bible study eatting stuff that he can't.

 

[Bokkapooh]

He'll need a muzzle I think that's very important when training a dog to become accustomed to riding a bus.

Is he used to being walked near around people?


1) Make sure he is used to being walked with a muzzle on
2) make sure he is used to being walked and near people with a muzzle on
3) make sure he is pooed and pee'd PLENTY before going onto a bus for the first time (a nervous dog who is scared (and buses are scary!) will be dog who is most likely to pee and pooe on the bus).

 

[Bokkapooh]

Does Sydney have a "service dog" vest that says that? I doubt the bus service will take you seriously or even allow the dog on the bus without it.

Actually here in WA you can take a dog onto a bus as long as it has a proper muzzle on it

If your dog is a service dog who has been trained and has the vest and is GREAT around people and other animals in public, then he does not need a muzzle to board a bus.

I have seen a few times when people boarded without a muzzle on their dog and without a service dog vest.. I was simply annoyed...

 

[Chewy]

I will never put a muzzle on my dog. Won't have a dog that I have to muzzle. Ok let me change that I have put a muzzle on him, just when someone that he dind't know was going to put their face into his face to clip his nails. But since I do it myself now, there ain't no reason.
I did actually get him on today. He did really good. Didn't bark or growl at the bus. And led the way up the stairs so it was his idea to get on. We just rode to the VTC Valley Transit Center.
And the bus system that I go to does not haveto let dogs or cats on there unless they are properly caged, or has a service dog vest on.

 

[BraveheartDogs]

I will never put a muzzle on my dog. Won't have a dog that I have to muzzle. Ok let me change that I have put a muzzle on him, just when someone that he dind't know was going to put their face into his face to clip his nails. But since I do it myself now, there ain't no reason.
I did actually get him on today. He did really good. Didn't bark or growl at the bus. And led the way up the stairs so it was his idea to get on. We just rode to the VTC Valley Transit Center.
And the bus system that I go to does not haveto let dogs or cats on there unless they are properly caged, or has a service dog vest on.

I agree that you don't need to muzzle him. If he needs to be muzzled then he is not a candidate for riding the bus with you. He needs to feel comfortable and safe and not just be restrained and contained. Remember, HIGH VALUE treats

 

[Chewy]

Thank you!!!! He got the "expensive" treats that he rarely gets today for that. I am so proud of him. The only problem I had was he tried to go up and say hi to someone. And that was only 1 person. I then started saying "Leave-it" When people walked by.

 

[Babybreau]

Sounds like you have a plan and good luck with it!

 

[CarmieJo]

I'm glad to hear you had a successful outing! Having the confidence to try something new like riding the bus is a step many people never take.



I know it may sound like I am taking a hard line here with what I am going to say. I really do not mean to sound harsh. I just want to avoid potential problems for you or others. I want to make sure that service animals continue to be accepted whether they have been trained by their owner or a professional trainer and without undue financial burden to their owner.



I am not a dog trainer. But, I think that if a dog reacts by barking and growling when the owner is worried/stressed/upset/scared it is not really working as a service dog. Having him trained as a service dog is a good and positive thing for him and you. But a dog who barks and growls, even if he thinks he is protecting you, is not trained well enough to be a service animal.



I work in an industry where I regularly encounter service animals. I have met some amazing and phenomenal animals. I have also met some who should not be considered a service animal and make you wish that there was a test that service animals had to pass. For instance, I walk with crutches. When I was riding the bus one day a dog with a service dog vest riding on the lap of a man in a wheelchair growled and snapped at me when I walked past him. The owner stated that his dog was afraid of my crutches. That owner is opening himself up to liability if his dog was to bite someone. And, that dog is giving other service animals a bad name.

 

[Chewy]

When he barked and growled he had only been with me for 2 wks. He ain't a proffessional Trained dog. I don't know if I put in he was owner (me) trained. He even did ok after we got him on that one. he just was scared. He wasn't going to bite anyone. The cost of proffessional training, is 60 a hour. I can't afford that as I only get a certain amount of money a month to live on.
I think my problem that day was forcing him onto that bus. He did really good today. I was/am really proud of him.
If I remember correctly I didn't say I was nervous I said he was nervous. He had never in 9 yrs seen a shuttle. And then this lady got off the bus and started walking towards me and he was like hey leave my mommy alone. I know a Service dog ain't supposed to protect their owner, but hey, Most dogs would if it was something new.

 

[Bokkapooh]

I agree that you don't need to muzzle him. If he needs to be muzzled then he is not a candidate for riding the bus with you. He needs to feel comfortable and safe and not just be restrained and contained. Remember, HIGH VALUE treats

It just that is what the buses want. And I totally agree with it, an animal who is around strangers closed off on a buses, especially ones that are loud, is an animal that will be stressed and no matter how well trained, a bit scared. And without a muzzle, you are taking the chance that your animal may snap or bite or nip someone. There has been a couple times when someone had a dog on the bus and it growled and bared it's teeth at passengers! Their owners swore the animal was very friendly...

Perhaps in Eastern wa its different, but as I have tripped all around Western wa with my dog via bus, they require them to be muzzled.

It helps a dog from barking and growling and causing any issues. And you are not a liability either, so no child that may come out of no where and yank on their tail, and dog may nip, etc. I for one wouldn't go on a bus without a muzzle on my dog. And my dog is friendly! You can yank on her tail all you want... sheesh her doggie play mate pulls her around by her tail. LOL. I go out in public without muzzle, but on a bus, closed in with people who dont control themselves or their kids.. well.. I dont take the risk.

I know many people who love their dogs disagree with me, but its a courtesy to have your dog(from the meanest dog to the most friendliest dog!!!) muzzled on a bus, so I do the same too.

 

[KimKimWilliamson]

I am a certified canine behavoiralist and trainer. Id love to offer my opinion (as Im full of them, LOL)

In my opinion, your dogs reaction toward the shuttle bus was based on his perception of your anxiety. A dog can feel/sense your energy and emotions clearer than even you can, especially a service dog meant to tend to your anxiety. His senses are hightend to all the emotions you feel. If your stressing about getting on the bus, he senses it. Because he's not a human with human thoughts he doesnt understand why you are distressed, just that you are, and that he doesnt like it. Instantly his reaction is to mirror that anxiety/dislike, as well as attack the thing causing the negative energy to begin with.
The first step to encouraging your dog to change this mindframe is for you to do the best you can to FEEL and THINK positively while attempting to board the bus.

To work up to that point I suggest taking him on leash to crowded parking lots or busy streets or a bus station, and just hang out, relax, think calm/assertive/relaxed/positive thoughts while observing the chaos, with out reacting negatively. Stroke his ears every now and again, but do not VERBALLY coddle him throughout this process. Its all about energy! Your being calm and encouraging him to do so is his reward, and trust me, he loves that guidance much more than a kiss or sweet words.
Once your comfortable and he's had time to adjust, try just boarding a bus calmy with no fuss, or discussion with the driver or anything, as this might highten him to an EVENTY as apposed to just something natural. If it doesnt go well, dont push him. Exit the bus at the first stop, and try again the next day. REMEMBER TO FOCUS on how your feeling while your doing this more than how hes feeling. A dog is a dog, he does not experience human thoughts or emotions, he simply reacts to his surroundings so if you are calm, he will be too. If he reacts negatively you can even slightly correct him with a leash snap, but no words.

Anyways, I could go on forever. Im sure you will get the hang of it, just remember not to make an ordeal out of it otherwise you'll be winding him up for a climax that never passes, causing him to be stressed and even possibly imprinting this type of behavior into his routine.

Try to apply the same mindframe to your own anxiety. I suffer from Anxiety as well and the only reason I manage day to day without meds is by applying dog physcology to my own life, LOL Anxiety/excitement is weakness, and a pack is only as strong as its weakest member. How can I lead my dog if I am the weakest?

 

[CarmieJo]

Erin, I absolutely agree that many, perhaps most, people can't afford the cost of a professionally trained service animal. I am sure that the entire cost varies with the nature of the disability and how much training the animal needs. Guide Dogs for the Blind says it costs $38000 to train the dog and provide instruction for the owner. They operate as a charity and the cost to the person receiving the dog is $0. But the high cost of training is exactly my point about the guy with the service dog that growled and snapped at me.



Mercedez, I am going to guess that there are different standards for companion animals and service animals. I think that the ADA would probably take exception with requiring service dogs to be muzzled since some are trained to pick up things their owner has dropped.



I have a friend who has CP and her dog is trained among other things to pull her wheelchair, get help if she falls, take the trash out, and pick up items she drops. Once when her chair started sliding on an icy ramp he threw himself down in front of it to stop it. The chair ran over his leg and broke it but he stayed there with his leg broken until help arrived.

 

[KimKimWilliamson]

It just that is what the buses want. And I totally agree with it, an animal who is around strangers closed off on a buses, especially ones that are loud, is an animal that will be stressed and no matter how well trained, a bit scared. And without a muzzle, you are taking the chance that your animal may snap or bite or nip someone. There has been a couple times when someone had a dog on the bus and it growled and bared it's teeth at passengers! Their owners swore the animal was very friendly...

Perhaps in Eastern wa its different, but as I have tripped all around Western wa with my dog via bus, they require them to be muzzled.

It helps a dog from barking and growling and causing any issues. And you are not a liability either, so no child that may come out of no where and yank on their tail, and dog may nip, etc. I for one wouldn't go on a bus without a muzzle on my dog. And my dog is friendly! You can yank on her tail all you want... sheesh her doggie play mate pulls her around by her tail. LOL. I go out in public without muzzle, but on a bus, closed in with people who dont control themselves or their kids.. well.. I dont take the risk.

I know many people who love their dogs disagree with me, but its a courtesy to have your dog(from the meanest dog to the most friendliest dog!!!) muzzled on a bus, so I do the same too.

PS - Id NEVER muzzle my dog on a bus - If you think your dog is unpredicatalbe, it shouldnt be in public. But hey, to each their own.
But here, dogs are as welcome on the bus as humans if they pay their fare, tis the responsibility of the owner to keep the dog under control, but hte responsibility of the passengers to respect the dogs space and I dont mind telling people so when they gauk at my blue eyed huskey!

 

[Chewy]

Thank you !!!!! I won't be taking him onto a busy bus till he is 100% on the bus that doesn't have many people on it.

 

[Bokkapooh]

Mercedez, I am going to guess that there are different standards for companion animals and service animals. I think that the ADA would probably take exception with requiring service dogs to be muzzled since some are trained to pick up things their owner has dropped.

Oh ofcourse I'm not saying a service dog should by no means be muzzles. But I do believe if there is any likelihood of your dog biting, snapping, nipping barking or growling at people, it should be muzzled atleast on a bus

 

[BraveheartDogs]

It just that is what the buses want. And I totally agree with it, an animal who is around strangers closed off on a buses, especially ones that are loud, is an animal that will be stressed and no matter how well trained, a bit scared. And without a muzzle, you are taking the chance that your animal may snap or bite or nip someone. There has been a couple times when someone had a dog on the bus and it growled and bared it's teeth at passengers! Their owners swore the animal was very friendly...

Perhaps in Eastern wa its different, but as I have tripped all around Western wa with my dog via bus, they require them to be muzzled.

It helps a dog from barking and growling and causing any issues. And you are not a liability either, so no child that may come out of no where and yank on their tail, and dog may nip, etc. I for one wouldn't go on a bus without a muzzle on my dog. And my dog is friendly! You can yank on her tail all you want... sheesh her doggie play mate pulls her around by her tail. LOL. I go out in public without muzzle, but on a bus, closed in with people who dont control themselves or their kids.. well.. I dont take the risk.

I know many people who love their dogs disagree with me, but its a courtesy to have your dog(from the meanest dog to the most friendliest dog!!!) muzzled on a bus, so I do the same too.

Mercedez,

This is actually not true. Not all dogs are going to react aggressively or at all if they have been desensitized to certain stimuli. I am not against muzzling aggressive dogs that are not safe, but my point is that a dog that is not properly trained and/or dogs not have a stable temperament should not be on a bus at all. However, a stable, sound and well trained service dog is desensitized to this before being put in the situation. I totally understand that it's important to keep everyone safe, but again if the dog is NOT safe around humans, he is not cut out for service work.

I am a certified canine behavoiralist and trainer. Id love to offer my opinion (as Im full of them, LOL)

In my opinion, your dogs reaction toward the shuttle bus was based on his perception of your anxiety. A dog can feel/sense your energy and emotions clearer than even you can, especially a service dog meant to tend to your anxiety. His senses are hightend to all the emotions you feel. If your stressing about getting on the bus, he senses it. Because he's not a human with human thoughts he doesnt understand why you are distressed, just that you are, and that he doesnt like it. Instantly his reaction is to mirror that anxiety/dislike, as well as attack the thing causing the negative energy to begin with.
The first step to encouraging your dog to change this mindframe is for you to do the best you can to FEEL and THINK positively while attempting to board the bus.

To work up to that point I suggest taking him on leash to crowded parking lots or busy streets or a bus station, and just hang out, relax, think calm/assertive/relaxed/positive thoughts while observing the chaos, with out reacting negatively. Stroke his ears every now and again, but do not VERBALLY coddle him throughout this process. Its all about energy! Your being calm and encouraging him to do so is his reward, and trust me, he loves that guidance much more than a kiss or sweet words.

Actually, it doesn't quite work that way. When a dog is fearful or anxious our "energy" is not going to change that significantly. When a dog is extremely fearful most behaviorists use desensitization and counter conditioning to change the dogs conditioned emotional response to the trigger that is causing the stress. The dog needs to be exposed to the trigger VERY slowly at a low enough exposure while pairing the exposure with something highly reinforcing to the dog. I work aggressive and fearful dogs regularly and just praise rarely changes the emotional response and behavior in these instances.

Also, we know that you cannot reinforce fear. It is not a behavior it is an emotion and therefore not operant. Classical conditioning is the ONLY way to go when changing emotional responses.

Vicki