Screaming BW pionus baby...

[rookspook]

Hello everyone,

This is going to be a really long post...

I need some advice... Since a week I am the proud owner of a 12/13 week old bronze wing pionus baby. Needless to say this I looked forward to getting this baby for a long long time and was delighted. Now, after a week, not so much anymore...

He/She screams. And I mean SCREAMS. It's the baby noises pionus make, only at the top of his lungs and very shrill. I have seen a few video of a pionus baby begging really loudly and it still didnt compare to what my baby belts out. He doesn't make any other noises than the begging noise, in different volumes, but mostly the ear piercing kind.

Now, my pionus baby regressed. That much I am sure of. He was basically weaned when I took him home (comfort feeding aside) and now he is back to 3 syringe feedings a day. He doesn't touch solid food/seeds, pellets, mashed pellets, fruits or veggies or anything. Spits everything out, he just wants syringe feedings. I read up on the subject and I think I am doing right about indulging him. I don't mind the handfeeding, but he still begscreams after. He begscreams as soon as he gets a whiff of me being around... It sounds like I am trying to murder him by just being in the room.

He doesn't really seem to want to be touched or handled, that's when he screams the loudest. But he spends at least 4 hours a day outside the cage with me, flying around (yes he flies, and is getting pretty decent at it!) and doing his thing, but this is getting near unbearable. He is begscreaming me deaf. He is moderately quiet (read: he is noisy) when I play him videos with other parrots in it or when i sit still (frozen) on my sofa... that's it. Besides blanketing his cage and closing the door to the room I have not found a way to stop this baby from screaming. He screams ALL the time.

I am at my wit's end. I don't know what to do. The screaming is keeping me from spending time with him or touching him because it is unbearable. He gets fed enough. He gets outside cage time... I just don't know what to do to make this baby happy.

I also notice myself getting frustrated and basically manhandling him (so I can feed him or to get him back in his cage for a "break") just because I don't know what to do. I want to avoid this at all costs (and I feel super guilty after) but I just can't with the screaming. I find myself hiding out in my own house just to get this baby to stop screaming for a tiny second.

I have tried ignoring the cries, I tried to soothe the cries. I tried touching, I tried leaving alone... Positive enforcement is hard when begging is the only noise he makes, besides rewarding when just noisy or quiet for 10 seconds makes the screaming start again. I just don't know anymore...

The only thing I can think of is wearing earplugs and doing my thing (like taking baby with me around the house and touching him)... The things I can't do now because of the screaming. And seeing if that helps...

...oof this turned out REALLY long... Sorry. Guess I needed to vent a bit. But I'll take any piece of advice or tips you can give me... Any personal experiences with this subject are also welcome. Makes me feel less alone

 

[camelotshadow]

Please don't ignore a baby. 12 weeks for a pionus may not be enough to be eating on his own.

He or she is hungry & you my not be skilled in handfeeding.

The food could be too hot or too cold/ crop burn or sour crop can set in & its painful & can cause the baby to die.

Manhandling a baby with a full crop can cause aspiration & it could die.

I know myself how nerve bending a birds sounds can get but this is a baby & it need to eat & its cries may be from hunger or pain so they should be checked into.

Needs a vet or at least try to get it back to the breeder so it can finish weaning before its health becomes seriously impacted.

I have earplugs & used them for 3 years straight with an older bird who was extremely vocal. Some can be naturally but it can be learned very easily & if this were not a baby that young there would be more ignoring vocal behavior & rewarding quiet but in this case you have to rule out a health problem or hunger. Its certainly possible the baby has become spoiled already but you have to be sure that this baby is getting enough to eat & does not have some physical problem that is causing pain or discomfort. Unskilled handfeeding can introduce many complications including bacteria...etc...

I am concerned for this baby so please speak with the breeder or a vet asap///

 

[rookspook]

Please don't ignore a baby. 12 weeks for a pionus may not be enough to be eating on his own.

He or she is hungry & you my not be skilled in handfeeding.

Theo food could be too hot or too cold/ crop burn or sour crop can set in & its painful & can cause the baby to die.

Manhandling a baby with a full crop can cause aspiration & it could die.

I know myself how nerve bending a birds sounds can get but this is a baby & it need to eat & its cries may be from hunger or pain so they should be checked into.

Needs a vet or at least try to get it back to the breeder so it can finish weaning before its health becomes seriously impacted.

I was expecting a reply like this, I have googled and read myself crazy the last couple of days and have actually read about all the things you are saying.

The baby is getting fed 3 times a day. I know how to check a crop and how to handfeed. I check the temp of the food with a thermometer and on my wrist. I weigh the baby every day. He is doing well.

By manhandling I mean picking the bird up and moving him around GENLTY but against his will while preventing it from flying off... I am NOT hurting my bird in any way.

The baby has had an avian vet check him/her out and got a clean bill of health...

I would really like some advice or tips on how to deal with this. Besides take him to the vet for more tests or back to the breeder... Because at this point that is not a solution to the problem or solving my stress or the stress of my baby bird.

Of course I will take my bird to the vets again if needed. But I literally just been. I have had this baby for 7 days.

 

[camelotshadow]

I still don't feel this is normal healthy behavior for a baby bird & I fear something is wrong but
I am glad that you know how to hand feed & took the bird to a vet

Is this your first bird?

Its only 7 days since you got this baby bird so they need some compassion & patience as they have left the probably only home they have ever known & possibly siblings...but I expect you know that...

You do need to find a way to deal with your stress as its very visible in your comments & likely your baby is feeling it too. Can't help you with that. Maybe others can be of more use...

I wish you luck as you have a new baby who is relying on you for the next hopefully 30 plus years...

 

[GoDucks]

Yes he is going to scream and yes he is going to regress somewhat in the beginning because he is scared.

Birds are prey animals and he has no idea of who you are or if you are going to eat him- so he goes back to the thing that comforts him the most- being fed .

 

[camelotshadow]

I might try to make sure the cage is in a place with least a wall behind it or to the side. You could try to cover 2 sides of the cage etc a corner so he can back up & have a secure place to rest if he is nervous...

Could be the cage is too open or by a window or too much activity...

Anything that helps him feel secure...
Play some classical music or put on the tv....talk softly etc
Sure you know all the rest but sometimes the cage location & giving them some partial covering can help...

 

[Lady Jane]

By manhandling I mean picking the bird up and moving him around GENLTY but against his will while preventing it from flying off... I am NOT hurting my bird in any way.

Have you given this baby bird a name yet? You are at a stage where building trust in important. Its like putting pennies in a piggy bank. The more you put in the trust bank the more your bird will be comfortable and bond with you.

 

[rookspook]

Is this your first bird?

Yes and no. I've had other smaller birds, outside birds, handreared wild birds and nursed injured wild birds. I also volunteered at a shelter.

But this is my first bird to be my companion for those next 30+ years

Its only 7 days since you got this baby bird so they need some compassion & patience as they have left the probably only home they have ever known & possibly siblings...but I expect you know that...

I know... I will try the earplugs. Maybe he needs more hands on love. With my ears safely plugged up.

Thank you for taking the time to reply. I'm afraid I was a bit snippy... I dreamed about my own bird for years and years which now suddenly turned into a nightmare in which I feel helpless... It's hard on me and frankly worries me a lot.

 

[rookspook]

Yes he is going to scream and yes he is going to regress somewhat in the beginning because he is scared.

Birds are prey animals and he has no idea of who you are or if you are going to eat him- so he goes back to the thing that comforts him the most- being fed .

It seemed less in those first days though, weirdly enough. Maybe it was the "new baby" sights and smells that made his voice seem duller on my ears.

I am indulging his need for being fed. Problem.is that it doesn't seem to stop his extremely loud begging. He could be sitting full up after feeding dozing off and still begscream as soon as he sees me...

 

[rookspook]

I might try to make sure the cage is in a place with least a wall behind it or to the side. You could try to cover 2 sides of the cage etc a corner so he can back up & have a secure place to rest if he is nervous...

Could be the cage is too open or by a window or too much activity...

Anything that helps him feel secure...
Play some classical music or put on the tv....talk softly etc
Sure you know all the rest but sometimes the cage location & giving them some partial covering can help...

His cage is on a corner, in the far end of the living room. No windows or drafts or anything to set him off...

Music helps. Also videos with other parrots. As long as he doesn't hear or see me move he is fine. He's quiet when he's alone in the room, also when I am out.

Would it help if I put him back in his cage covered after a feeding?

 

[camelotshadow]

He needs to feel safe & eat well. Those are the main concerns. The rest will come...

I would not fully cover him in the day to quiet him...It does not teach them anything. Darkness in day can upset there body...its confusing...birds don;t like that.

All of them can pluck at the nerves sometimes...They do tend to control some by sound. Its hard sometimes when you have a bad day & they won;t let you go to the bathroom without making a big deal about it. Companion birds are not for everyone. I too have a high strung personality. Earplugs can help....

Right now I would set the cage up in an area where he can see you but cover a corner so he can feel safe. Seems you have that...Can you place the cover on partially just so he has a small area he can retreat too?
I don't know how socialized this bird was but I doubt they gave him all day attention. Don't go overboard with attention the first few days & then take it away.

Routine & consistency are the bible words. Be very aware of not reinforcing vocalization beyond making sure the bird is safe & taken care of...

They can feel stress...When I am on the phone & having a bad day & trying to deal with problems..Penny will feel it & start in with crying...You need try to understand them & stay one step ahead which is not easy...

Breathe..take a break...

 

[rookspook]

Have you given this baby bird a name yet? You are at a stage where building trust in important. Its like putting pennies in a piggy bank. The more you put in the trust bank the more your bird will be comfortable and bond with you.

Actually not yet. Names usually come to me when I get to know an animal or pet. But I'm open for suggestions

So far I've been calling him baby birb xD

 

[camelotshadow]

I think he may be calling you when he can't see you & hears you...They all do that...You could give a one time short reassuance...like...You're OK...I'm near etc...they do like to know you are around...Rio won;t let me go to the bathroom without serenading me...you just have to get used to it...they are calling to you...I really never respond to him when he does that but it does not help..he does it...

 

[camelotshadow]

Do you know a bronze wing is my dream bird...You are very lucky to have found a baby...They are not easy to find...May I ask the breeders name?

They are exquisite birds & not known for being very vocal.

There is that Pionus Book by Russ...very good book & he still sells it...I have the book but have not finished it...Its one of the best books on pionus

The Practical Pionus

 

[rookspook]

He needs to feel safe & eat well. Those are the main concerns. The rest will come...

I would not fully cover him in the day to quiet him...It does not teach them anything. Darkness in day can upset there body...its confusing...birds don;t like that.

All of them can pluck at the nerves sometimes...They do tend to control some by sound. Its hard sometimes when you have a bad day & they won;t let you go to the bathroom without making a big deal about it. Companion birds are not for everyone. I too have a high strung personality. Earplugs can help....

Right now I would set the cage up in an area where he can see you but cover a corner so he can feel safe. Seems you have that...Can you place the cover on partially just so he has a small area he can retreat too?
I don't know how socialized this bird was but I doubt they gave him all day attention. Don't go overboard with attention the first few days & then take it away.

Routine & consistency are the bible words. Be very aware of not reinforcing vocalization beyond making sure the bird is safe & taken care of...

They can feel stress...When I am on the phone & having a bad day & trying to deal with problems..Penny will feel it & start in with crying...You need try to understand them & stay one step ahead which is not easy...

Breathe..take a break...

Thank you for the advice.

I am usually pretty chill and stress proof... I work with people with mental and physical disabilities and serious behavioural issues. I am used to dealing with and ignoring unwanted behaviour...

It just literally HURTS my ears when he begscreams. I can't do anything when he does it it's so loud.

I do work flexible shifts at work though. I thought it was a positive thing since you always have half a day (either morning+afternoon or afternoon+evening) to spend with a bird... But now I am starting to think this may be too flexible for a routine?

 

[Monaco]

I actually got some earplugs the other day, and I don't even have mine home yet. I have a question about your vocalization and sounds you make as you go about your day. Is it occasional, constant, steady with intermittent quiet? I'm working on a plan in case mine goes berserk.... It's to use the earplugs and chatter about whatever it is I'm doing within earshot and putting my body at 45 degrees to her as much as possible - basically shoulder toward her diagonally. Ignoring her but being busy and available at the same time... If that makes any sense at all.
Having said that, I have no idea if a baby will pick up on the turned back/45 degree thing.

It does sound like a strange desperation. Using the same cry all the time. I would want to be absolutely positive there's no pain in the crop or gi since this is a food sound exaggerated to a scream. Even an x ray may help either dispel worry or lead to a clue.

Good luck. Definitely ear plugs so you can go about your routine.

 

[rookspook]

Do you know a bronze wing is my dream bird...You are very lucky to have found a baby...They are not easy to find...May I ask the breeders name?

They are exquisite birds & not known for being very vocal.

There is that Pionus Book by Russ...very good book & he still sells it...I have the book but have not finished it...Its one of the best books on pionus

The Practical Pionus

I live in the Netherlands. They are not as crazy rare here. Though I would have crossed countries to get one

Mine came from a lady who keeps birds in her backyard. This baby along with his sibling had to be handreared because we had a crazy heatwave this summer... Heat caused her to lose 4 BW babies last year so she was quick to handrear them.

I certainly hope mine will get less vocal... He is already exquisite

I will check out that book! Hopefully I can get it here without crazy overseas shipping costs xD

 

[camelotshadow]

its not a big heavy book so shipping should not be too bad...

A pionus is about the size of Penny though a bit smaller. Not a huge bird but it can be extremely loud.

Rio can be a pain more often than Penny but Penny can be much louder & there are a few times she will do the call to he other end of the jungle///

I work from home & they can see me most of the day. I go out to shop or to the Dr. They are not alone much but I can go to the bedroom most of the time & take a nap & they are alright...

They have been quiet most of today & I always have classical on for them...

He is new so insecure...It ok for him to see you & for you to go out too...Its good for them to learn indpendance but he is a baby taken away from his only world & in a new world so he has fear & insecurity. Its good he feels safe with you near...just don't spoil him... You may have inadvertently been doing that. Its understandable is he needs to be handfed that he has bonded with you & is relying on you so he is calling to you. Again routine...start to set one up...If you leave the room then give a word of encouragement if he calls & then stop...They have to learn that you won;t run in at ever call or they will do it all day.

 

[rookspook]

I have a question about your vocalization and sounds you make as you go about your day. Is it occasional, constant, steady with intermittent quiet?

I live alone so I talk to him a lot. Though I have to force myself these last couple of days since he responds with the begscreams. I try to whistle to him a lot... Especially when I am out of the room. But that also sets him off again. All the noises and screams are related to seeing me move or hearing me. If I am out of sight or frozen still he tends to quiet down a bit.

Having said that, I have no idea if a baby will pick up on the turned back/45 degree thing.

I will give this a try tomorrow, I'll let you know if I get any kind of response except for the screams xD

 

[tka]

Hello and welcome to you and Baby Bronzewing!

I got Leia when she was about nine months old, so she didn't regress but I did have to work hard to gain her trust. Pionus are naturally observant, thoughtful little parrots - they prefer to watch and work out if you can be trusted, and they won't go to just anyone. It took Leia a month to decide that I was acceptable. It sounds like your baby is very worried because everything is new. He doesn't know if you're a trustworthy flock member yet and doesn't know if he wants to be your friend yet, but he also doesn't want to be on his own.

Talking to him, whistling, narrating what you're doing are all good. Try to teach him to target or similar - it's a clicker training technique and it will open up a line of communication. You can teach him something and demonstrate that it will get him a reward. He'll be more certain about what you're trying to ask him to do.

Try to establish more of a routine for these early days. You can adjust or modify your routine when he's feeling more settled, but right now the unpredictability is scary and throwing him off. Try to establish consistent hours when he is out of his cage and a fixed bedtime.