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Say hi to pierre, he's home at his forever home now!!

TikkiTembo

Rollerblading along the road
Joined
5/13/19
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1,447
Real Name
Chelsea
Kim admitted to me that the bloody nose was from her trying to get him into the carrier to take him to the vet clinic. I sincerely hope she wasn't rough enough to also hurt his wing. I've been disappointed in some of her choices recently, I hope this isn't something else to be concerned about with her. Also, I watched Dr Scott do everyone's nails, they did look short to me. I think I'll refuse a nail trim for Chipper when he goes.
Poor, sweet Pierre. Nobody will ever hurt you again.
 

Ulis_Beast

Rollerblading along the road
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Doroteja Lenassi
Well it was Time for Grey grey's check up so I decided to take Pierre in to my vet. She never seen a bird in a while so traumatized by hands. She only had a couple that were like this.
The vocalization is a cry of extreme fear. Not your typical awk awk... This is a bit unusual for a 20 yr. old bird. They normally put their head down if not wanting to step up or simply walk away. And like she said, he's not being aggressive he's being scared for his life with the hands.
There is also dried blood under feathers around beak, nostril. And a bit tender. And has a swollen wing. This was within last 2 weeks.
And to clarify, this is not anything that happened with or at Chelsea"s...she hadn't had the bird but a day. This happened at rescue, and before.
Even Prior owners possibly.
Pierre hasn't crash landed at my house, besides, his wings are clipped and nails trimmed too short. Vet said … you want my honest opinion??
He was either intentionally hit, or accidentally hit. The vet , myself and wife are agreeing on first one. We're pretty positive on it.
I've dealt with many types of parrots in my life time, Nearly 30 parrots, as I myself had a private rescue and rehomed birds to proper homes. I have never seen
a bird this traumatized by hands. And vet has seen similar in a couple badly treated birds. But again said, Pierre has a lot of potential to
over come this. because he's not aggressive. Doesn't show the will to attack, and is calm if you keep hands away.
Whats done is done, I can't change that or dwell on it, The key now is focusing on what I can do to change that and get his trust back
with hands. He's a lovely bird, and intend on giving him and the care and love he needs to help over come what ever happened.
So, my suspected offense...he's been badly handled to point of sheer traumatizing and even pain which caused bleeding... probably happened far more than once.
But as I said, I'm in no way going to ever give up on him, heck no. He needs his confidence rebuilt, his trust regained
and yea that'll take time, big deal It's going to be fun. I'm getting his confidence back up by offering him treats from hand.
He wants to take it, some times he will, but slowly and cautiously then hurries back away from hand. Other times he will cry if hand is too close.
So.....that's where we stand.
That is just heartbreaking. The things "our pets" have to suffer due to our ignorance, negliegence, misunderstanding or plain cruelty. They are the perfect victims. :sad8:

I know Pierre will thrive in your gentle hands! :angel6:
(Pun intended)
 

webchirp

Joyriding the Neighborhood
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Congrats!!!
 

Hawk12237

Biking along the boulevard
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Michael
Kim admitted to me that the bloody nose was from her trying to get him into the carrier to take him to the vet clinic. I sincerely hope she wasn't rough enough to also hurt his wing. I've been disappointed in some of her choices recently, I hope this isn't something else to be concerned about with her. Also, I watched Dr Scott do everyone's nails, they did look short to me. I think I'll refuse a nail trim for Chipper when he goes.
Poor, sweet Pierre. Nobody will ever hurt you again.
I don't think it's all Kim, Chelsea. I think it goes long before Kim. Kim probably had to deal with the fear of hands as well with pierre. And transferring Pierre to a carrier is not going to be an easy task for anyone. So yea I can see Pierre probably got hurt thrashing around being put in carrier. My self, I secure the wings,,using both hands. Less likely to thrash around. He was fine once in carrier. It's the hands.
You see, the brain is a powerful tool. It doesn't matter if your human, a bird, dog, cat any living creature. You associated things in many ways, either the action will generate pleasure, fun, relaxing....or it will generate pain, fear, resentment or defense mode.
For every action, there is a reaction. That's how the brain works in any creature.
For example, when you do something that causes pain or discomfort you avoid it or seek a different way of enjoying it without the pain or discomfort.
In pierre's case, this most likely goes back a ways. Repeated discomfort, and it pain. So avoids it...most likely improper handling.
I've had one rescue way back that was surrendered to me. They claimed bird was impossible, and didn't want to deal with it anymore. A female electus. Also had a bad fear of sticks or being covered. I watched how they got him in cage...they always used a butterfly net to scoop her up!!!
I asked " how long have you had to revert to using net?? " they said for 6 years, we're to afraid to try hands or t stick. I was so eager to get that bird out of there.
I got her sorted out and was a sweety. Stepped up no problem. But was terrified of you got a broom out...or sheet like cover cage.
turned into nice bird and was able to pass her on to a great home. That was 17 yrs ago. To date, she's still with that new family and doing wonderful.
Point is, fear can be over come takes a bit of work, and lots of patience. And with pierre, it can also be over come. I just need to identify exactly what it was that is fearful with hands.
As for Kim, I have no comment. I haven't seen how she handles and cares for birds.
I've only spoken to her a few times via email in past. But I'm grateful to her to have gotten Pierre from her and into a good home....mine.



 

Hawk12237

Biking along the boulevard
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Michael
That is just heartbreaking. The things "our pets" have to suffer due to our ignorance, negliegence, misunderstanding or plain cruelty. They are the perfect victims. :sad8:

I know Pierre will thrive in your gentle hands! :angel6:
(Pun intended)
He will, takes time. I have a rescue dog, very very good with the birds. I don't worry with her. But she had an issue with hands. Go to pet her and she finches and cowers up like your going to beat her or something. I would never hit an animal. There s just no sense in that.
Our finally came out of that after a year and half...now is not afraid of hands. It takes time.
I just never got around in my head why people hit animals. Just because they won't do exactly what you want
Is no reason for it...
 

Hawk12237

Biking along the boulevard
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@Hawk12237 We save them one at a time. I'm sure you will help Pierre get over his fear and once again live in peace.
I will Mary...baby steps... But he's already showing signs he much happier here. Talking a little, calls for me when I can't be seen. Started taking treats now without running off in fear... So tiny steps... Building that trust up.
 

Ulis_Beast

Rollerblading along the road
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Doroteja Lenassi
He will, takes time. I have a rescue dog, very very good with the birds. I don't worry with her. But she had an issue with hands. Go to pet her and she finches and cowers up like your going to beat her or something. I would never hit an animal. There s just no sense in that.
Our finally came out of that after a year and half...now is not afraid of hands. It takes time.
I just never got around in my head why people hit animals. Just because they won't do exactly what you want
Is no reason for it...
I rehomed a mare that was tied with a 30 cm long chain to a through, her head always in the ground. In perpetual darkness. When the rest of the herd was sold off she was moved from the pastures into that barn and left there. She was fed, but would be beaten every time she was expected to move. Bad bed sores on both her shoulders...
Anyhow..
When she was united with my small herd we took it a day at a time. It was in no time, that she came to me, letting me touch her. I think it really helped, her seeing me handle other horses and them being totally cool with it.
Parrots are much, much smarter and Pierre will surely learn from Grey greys example.
 

Rain Bow

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@Hawk12237 We save them one at a time. I'm sure you will help Pierre get over his fear and once again live in peace.
Couldn't say anything better myself. Mary has ALL the wise word's!

Buddy makes sad noises & I've heard bad aggravated noises from him @ the old vets when they toweled him & I wasn't holding him. I cannot imagine how terrible these sounds you describe are. Well, I can imagine & am glad Buddy hasn't made them. Poor Pierre! :bighug:He's landed into safety finally!
 

Hawk12237

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We made some significant progress this evening. I put Grey grey away so I could work with pierre without interruption.
I got my T stick out to try. He managed to place one foot on it, the other he wasn't quite sure about.So he was half on half off debating if he wanted to go both. he backed off. but no screaming. Gave him praise for that. Great try for him.

I left cage door open to allow him to come out on his own...took him a bit, but he managed to climb on top of cage and
hang out. again I tried T stick...wasn't going to do it..but didn't freak out or scream.

After letting him have a bit of time there, i decided to sorta target train...in other words point and say where I wanted him to go
without too much use of hands. I took a treat i now know he likes and tapped it on open cage door indicating and telling him this is where I wanted him to go. After repeating it about 4 or 5 times, he actually made way to door and sat. Now to tap on perch which is
mounted on inside of door facing in. I tapped perch with treat and placed treat in bowl. He looked at perch then bowl then back at me.
I took treat back out of bowl, tapped it on perch, then placed in bowl as I said step up down here pierre, good boy you are
lets have a yum yum. I repeated these moves and words 5 or 6 times, he finally stepped down to perch and to bowl on inside.

I call it a significant progress with no screaming and without too much show of hands. Tomorrow I'm reversing it to have him come out to door perch then to top of cage, then back in the same way....were making progress. Pierre is a smart bird and just needs a bit of positive reinforcement. He's going to be a great bird, I can see it already. Some will say it's too soon or moving too too fast. No actually not. You don't want them to get too conditioned of just sitting around. a little each day. baby steps...
IMG_20200207_195718.jpg IMG_20200207_195704.jpg
 

camelotshadow

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Birds are reactive reflexive response types...Pierre will come to know hes; in a safe place seem slike sooner than later as he;s in good hands & he;s seems to have kept his sweet soul waiting to find someone to unlock it...:heart:
 

Wthensler

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William hensler
Pierre is welcome to sunny FL anytime. He’d love it here! We have a giant aviary which our other birdies share. Perfect birdie weather now, too.

Only problem - once wife sees him, you may not get him back.....
 

Dorcas George

Rollerblading along the road
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Love these pics of Pierre outside cage. He’s so pretty, of course, and it’s so nice to hear that he calls for you etc. Progress indeed! :yah:
 

Hawk12237

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Last couple days been working with Pierre on eliminating the fright of hands. Yesterday was a good day. Instead of moving my hand to him, I made him come to me offering him a treat. He came to me and took treat. We made progress.

Today though we took a step backwards. That was mostly my fault. After making note of how he proceeds in cage, I wanted to make some adjustments inside cage to make it more efficient and better. That however require him to come out.

He came out on his own and though I had to grab him with both hands assuring him it was ok. And place him on gym.
Had to go through same procedure to put him back in cage a bit later.
He wasn't happy about being handled, but unfortunately there was no other way. Once he calmed down he came back out.

His climbing ability is hampered a bit because his nails were trimmed a bit too short. After spending a good while out, I needed to get him back in cage. Grey grey wanted out. Well Pierre wasn't going back in cage easily. He fluttered down to floor, so I let him have a walk around...seemed to really enjoy it.

Then came time to go back in cage, (let me tell you an amazon can run around under the dinning room table pretty fast, lol...there was no catching him) my wife and I sat on floor. Kinda like corraling him in... When I approached on floor, he moved closer to my wife then stepped up onto her arm!!!!!! Wow..! What a shock. My wife put him on top of cage.. I thought oh crap hon, I wanted him inside cage. Thought were going to have to do this all over again...nope.... I got to one side of cage he moved away from me and climbed up onto my wife's arm again, she put him in cage.

Wow again!! My wife just looked at me with a snicker... And said " it's a woman thing, we have that special touch" ..ha ha! Ok if you say so.

So it got me thinking, it's not so much fear of hands, but traumatic experience from perhaps a male figure, and I resemble that figure to pierre.
Maybe even a male avian vet!?!??? I don't know many parrots that are fond of a vet visit.
Hmmmm, what do you all think??


 

Birdie Mama

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BC Canada
I bet you that you are getting close to it. My mom’s dog used to go nuts if someone wore a hat....after a while we started realizing that it was only the apt manager that he reacted too, but would be leary overall around men with hats. Turned out the manager would come in for repairs and because he hated dogs, used to swing his hat at him and nailed him a few times. once we got another manager, we tested it and the dog was uptight and anxious, but never went nuts again. Took a while though but it was the other guy and his actions that had been the problem.

I think you may be on the right track based on how he reacted to your wife’s arm.. :heart:
 
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