New canary questions

[Rojatta]

Hi!

I acquired a pair canaries on Friday. Long story short, I've been working with a breeder with the plan to adopt a single 2021 hen, but my fiance jumped the gun and surprised me with the pair we've been visiting for a while at our local independent pet store. The only information they had on them is that they were hatched in 2019 and they've been at the store for longer than the employees we talked to (more than 8 months). At least one is a hen (eggs). They are both active, playing with their toys, and eating well. Their nails are a bit overgrown and I suspect they have a mild case of air sac and scaly mites, but otherwise they seem to be in decent shape for not having a real "home" for 2 years. I've already ordered some Scatt. Despite not being initially thrilled by their sudden appearance, I admit that they've grown on me lol. We have a few days to return them to the store under the health guarantee so I was hoping to talk through whether it would be a better idea to revert to my original plan of getting a single bird from a breeder. My main concern is whether it will be hard for a first-time canary owner to manage dynamics between a pair and the probability of having to separate.

They seem to get along well overall, except we have noticed this morning that one would start singing and chasing the other. They were sold as a "bonded pair," but I'm not sure a small pet store cage is a great environment to tell whether they are truly compatible. Any hypotheses on whether this behavior will increase as they get more comfortable here or strategies to avoid problems? Is it a good sign that they've been together for a long time already? I ordered them a King's flight cage since the cage I had gotten was only for a single bird.

Opinions on whether we should give these older birds a home and hope for the best or return and adopt a single from a breeder...I assume it would be crazy to add a third to this pair, right?

Also, they are eating Roudybush granules and fresh foods so far and have a cuttlebone in their cage. I've seen mixed information on whether I need to be adding oyster shells/grit year-round. Do they need additional supplementation?

 

[Sparkles99]

Congratulations! Sorry I can’t help with info though. They look sweet.

 

[Rædwalda]

I keep 1 Canary and 9 Zebra Finches all adopted from people who didn't want them, some sick or in poor health which I had to medicate.

My thoughts on this and advice for you:

You have recognised that the pair need medicating and ordered Scatt which is a good treatment for mites, are you really going to return these birds to the store without treating them with the medicine you know they need?

If you return them to the store as they are, they will develop worse problems as they likely wont get treated in time (the next buyer may have no clue, or they may get ill and die in the shop).

I do not think it will be a nice experience being returned to the store as if they are faulty merchandise. Moving out of there and into a new home will have been stressful for them, but they will settle in quick and are probably happy to be out of the shop and into a proper home. Personally, sending them back there now just isn't something I could consider.

These birds are no different to the ones your breeder is selling, and as they are older, and probably lived in more stressful conditions, I would consider housing them to be the first priority.

Bearing in mind these birds can live upwards of 15 years with the proper care, a year really makes no difference. I got my Canary aged 2 years, I do not understand the obsession with "this years birds", as if we are talking about a new GPU for my computer.

You could very well take on the other Hen anyway, we can advise you on set-ups etc. They do not need huge cages if they get plenty of time out every day, however when keeping a female/male together they will certainly need considerable space.

 

[Rojatta]

That didn't really answer my question. I was trying to make a responsible decision from the start since I do not have the space to have two cages in the long run if there is a good chance they will need to be separated based on their current behavior. That is why I had planned on a single bird from the breeder. It had nothing to do with these birds' age or not being from a breeder. The store would treat them for mites. I am not a bird rescue, just a first-time bird owner and I want to make sure I end up with a set up that we can all live with (birds and humans). I have no idea if this pair is a male and a female or two hens and I do not have an area safe from other pets to let them fly free during the day, so a large cage is a priority and I don't want to overcrowd.

 

[Sparkles99]

I've never had canaries, though they are my 'someday' bird. Maybe @finchly will have some advice. She is very good with lots of birds, including canaries & finches!

 

[finchly]

Since one is chasing the other you already need a bigger cage or separation. They are probably siblings (pet shops do this) and therefore you don’t want to breed them. We can help you with that part.
I believe you have a M-F pair.

oh I just reread that you got a flight cage. Is it 30x 23x 36 or thereabouts? In a big cage you can sometimes put fake plants in to break their sight lines, and not have to separate.

 

[Rojatta]

Thanks, @finchly! Yes, the new cage is about that size. It'll be here this week. And no, definitely don't want to breed them! I thought maybe I'd do one of those feather DNA tests. I didn't notice any squabbling or chasing today, so that's good. Seems to be pretty minimal. I see the other reply that was here yesterday was deleted but is it really not okay to keep canaries without being able to offer free flight? Obviously the other pets are kept away from their cage but I have dogs and an open floor plan with no doors/walls and a ton of windows so I don't have a great way to close off a safe area for the birds. The breeder I had been talking to didn't seem to think that or the other pets would be a problem. I admit to becoming a bit attached to these little guys so I do kind of want to keep them, but not if they won't have a happy life of course. They do have lots of perches and toys and foraging cups to find around their cage so it's not as though their day is completely devoid of all enrichment.

This is Tweety


And Lemonade

 

[Sparkles99]

I love their names, especially Lemonade!

 

[finchly]

They’re fine without free flight!
Very pretty.
Our home is a typical Florida open plan, I know what you mean. We’ve had the birds in various areas, and 2 dogs. You’ll get it worked out.

 

[MnGuy]

Any two birds, especially if they are opposite sex, will have some degree of chasing due to sexual/mating behavior. I wouldn't over worry about that unless it's constant, one is physically attacking the other or the one being chased can't get to food and water or looks haggard, etc.

I've always thought it was sad that male canaries are often kept alone to keep them singing. I like seeing them in pairs like this for companionship's sake since they don't interact with humans like parrots.

Good luck.

 

[finchly]

Any two birds, especially if they are opposite sex, will have some degree of chasing due to sexual/mating behavior. I wouldn't over worry about that unless it's constant, one is physically attacking the other or the one being chased can't get to food and water or looks haggard, etc.

I've always thought it was sad that male canaries are often kept alone to keep them singing. I like seeing them in pairs like this for companionship's sake since they don't interact with humans like parrots.

Good luck.

I agree
And have kept pairs together without fights. Some of them are/were very bonded.

 

[Rojatta]

If they are a male/female pair (after watching them this week, I'm pretty sure that is what we have), how do you avoid breeding? Will the male need to live separately for that part of the year? Or just avoid giving them a place to nest?

The chasing is not constant and they are able to eat together without arguments most of the time. Sometimes one will chase the other off the food bowl or perch but there is not one consistent chaser and chasee. They moved into their new flight cage yesterday and seem very happy (still working on the interior decorating).

 

[Sparkles99]

That’s a really nice cage!

 

[Coop]

If they are a male/female pair (after watching them this week, I'm pretty sure that is what we have), how do you avoid breeding? Will the male need to live separately for that part of the year? Or just avoid giving them a place to nest?

The chasing is not constant and they are able to eat together without arguments most of the time. Sometimes one will chase the other off the food bowl or perch but there is not one consistent chaser and chasee. They moved into their new flight cage yesterday and seem very happy (still working on the interior decorating).

View attachment 398587

If you don't give a nest and nesting materials they are much less likely to try to breed but it's still possible; the instinct is strong. It does no harm to separate the male some of the year, and he will sing a lot more if he is in his own place. Just make sure he has a nice big cage too. If they insist on laying eggs and nesting, like on the floor, and you don't want chicks, take the eggs and keep in the fridge overnight then return and let the hen sit on them as long as she wants. Otherwise she will continue to lay and can deplete her calcium and die of heart failure. Minor chasing/occasional squabbles with standing tall and glaring down over stretched beaks is normal and not a problem as long as they have enough room. As long as nobody is getting injured or plucked it's OK.

Any time you have multiple birds in one cage it is helpful to have multiple places to get food and water and then one bird can't monopolize the supply. Plastic saucers made to put under potted plants make great swimming pools. "Bird does not live by seed alone". Soaked seed, occasional hardboiled egg mashed with dry bread crumbs, and occasional fruit treats like a bit of apple do wonders to keep them healthy. Canaries LOVE green food too, and as much lettuce as they want won't hurt them! I've had canaries for more than 50 years now and I "otter" know. LIttle birds like canaries don't need time out of the cage, which can be very dangerous and frightening in the average home; they need great big cages with lots of horizontal space for flight. One very key thing to keep canaries healthy that many people don't realize is that their metabolism is absolutely tied to the day/night cycle. What that means is that you can't turn the lights on at 7 AM and off at 7 PM one day then on at 7 AM, off at 6 PM when you go out to a restaurant Saturday night, then back on when you get home at 11 PM and off at 2 AM when your friends leave. They MUST have a consistent light cycle or eventually they will start to molt a few feathers all the time instead of all at once one time a year; and they will stop singing and die young from this stress of constantly replacing feathers which are mostly protein. Light cycle starts breeding behavior when the day length increases in the spring, then triggers molting when the days are at their longest in summer. You want to either follow the natural day length cycle throughout the year, or give a consistent 12 hours day and 12 hours night for healthy birds that live their normal lifespan. I hope this is helpful.

 

[Luvss2ride]

Coop .... what is the light schedule, please? I just picked one up on Sunday and currently have the light timer for on from 7am to 9pm? Should it be 7pm instead?

If you don't give a nest and nesting materials they are much less likely to try to breed but it's still possible; the instinct is strong. It does no harm to separate the male some of the year, and he will sing a lot more if he is in his own place. Just make sure he has a nice big cage too. If they insist on laying eggs and nesting, like on the floor, and you don't want chicks, take the eggs and keep in the fridge overnight then return and let the hen sit on them as long as she wants. Otherwise she will continue to lay and can deplete her calcium and die of heart failure. Minor chasing/occasional squabbles with standing tall and glaring down over stretched beaks is normal and not a problem as long as they have enough room. As long as nobody is getting injured or plucked it's OK.

Any time you have multiple birds in one cage it is helpful to have multiple places to get food and water and then one bird can't monopolize the supply. Plastic saucers made to put under potted plants make great swimming pools. "Bird does not live by seed alone". Soaked seed, occasional hardboiled egg mashed with dry bread crumbs, and occasional fruit treats like a bit of apple do wonders to keep them healthy. Canaries LOVE green food too, and as much lettuce as they want won't hurt them! I've had canaries for more than 50 years now and I "otter" know. LIttle birds like canaries don't need time out of the cage, which can be very dangerous and frightening in the average home; they need great big cages with lots of horizontal space for flight. One very key thing to keep canaries healthy that many people don't realize is that their metabolism is absolutely tied to the day/night cycle. What that means is that you can't turn the lights on at 7 AM and off at 7 PM one day then on at 7 AM, off at 6 PM when you go out to a restaurant Saturday night, then back on when you get home at 11 PM and off at 2 AM when your friends leave. They MUST have a consistent light cycle or eventually they will start to molt a few feathers all the time instead of all at once one time a year; and they will stop singing and die young from this stress of constantly replacing feathers which are mostly protein. Light cycle starts breeding behavior when the day length increases in the spring, then triggers molting when the days are at their longest in summer. You want to either follow the natural day length cycle throughout the year, or give a consistent 12 hours day and 12 hours night for healthy birds that live their normal lifespan. I hope this is helpful.