Honeymoon concerns.....

[BraveheartDogs]

Hi there,

I have a concern that I would like to post here and get some input on. As some of you know I am fostering Merlin a 35 to 40 year old spectacled Amazon. I have several other birds, but Merlin is the largest one. I would never have considered an amazon because of the size (but this species is smaller), and what I have heard about their temperaments, not to mention the noise. My husbands only request is that I don't have any that are very loud. I respect that as he is very supportive and tolerant frankly of my animals.

So far, Merlin is doing great. He is old and so for the most part quiet (except when he is hungry) and pretty relaxed. He just hangs out on a manzanita tree. He is starting to show some interest in toys and in foraging which I think is great. If he remains the way he is.....I could adopt him permanently.

I have heard many others mention the "honeymoon" period. I do small bird rescue and have had several other rehomes but they were all small birds cockatiels, budgies, a linnie, never a large parrot. I did not experience a huge change in their temperament after having them for a while. If anything, they all improved. Merlin has been being fostered with another rescuer for abotu 2 or 3 months and he has improved since she got him.

The deal is Merlin is for a week on a trial basis. After that time I can adopt him or foster him or foster to adopt him. I feel like he is a great guy, but there is a tiny bit of me that worries that he will turn into someone else after a couple of months. Legitimate concern or am I crazy??

 

[Stacy_b]

Its a very legit concern. A week will not show you the honeymoon period. I mean, it COULD...but usually its more like weeks/months.

 

[Cynthia & Percy]

some honeymoons last a few months I have heard but I never had one with any of my birds oh by the way it only took one day for the amazon that I was fostering to attack his normal pattern I am sorry that I can not be of more help

 

[BraveheartDogs]

some honeymoons last a few months I have heard but I never had one with any of my birds oh by the way it only took one day for the amazon that I was fostering to attack his normal pattern I am sorry that I can not be of more help

No, it helps a lot actually. I understand it can happen but like I have said I have not seen it with any of my other rehomes. They came here, they were who they were and that is who they stayed for the most part, other than improving with things I had to work on like feeding and handling and that kind of thing. It's good to hear that you have actually also not experienced drastic changes. Of course, I can deal with an animal becoming more comfortable, but if it was a HUGELY drastic change and he literally became a different animal that would be concerning.

 

[Stacy_b]

No, it helps a lot actually. I understand it can happen but like I have said I have not seen it with any of my other rehomes. They came here, they were who they were and that is who they stayed for the most part, other than improving with things I had to work on like feeding and handling and that kind of thing. It's good to hear that you have actually also not experienced drastic changes. Of course, I can deal with an animal becoming more comfortable, but if it was a HUGELY drastic change and he literally became a different animal that would be concerning.

Well there is no black/white answer. You just wont know. All you can do is understand that it can happen. And be prepared. You need to be willing to deal with and handle it. Ask a million questions here. Research...be confident....make him happy and comfortable.

 

[BraveheartDogs]

Well there is no black/white answer. You just wont know. All you can do is understand that it can happen. And be prepared. You need to be willing to deal with and handle it. Ask a million questions here. Research...be confident....make him happy and comfortable.

I guess I know that, but I wanted a black or white answer But I know that behavior is fluid and all animals are individuals, so....

 

[Stacy_b]

I guess I know that, but I wanted a black or white answer But I know that behavior is fluid and all animals are individuals, so....

I know...black and white answers would be so easy sometimes. Wish I could give it to you. But you can do this....are you comfortable with him NOW. Does he scare you NOW? Ive seen bad things happen when people are afraid of the bird.

 

[Love My Zons]

With anything, it's a one day at a time. Amazons will show you when they are excited by eye pinning, that is often taken for aggression. Rapid pinning and tail flaring are signs to stay away.

He's an older guy so he's not going to exhibit any crazy hormonal type behavior, he's been through it. With lessened day light hours as well can reduce this behavior as well should the feeling for him be there.

He sounds happy with where he is. He's eating good and enjoying himself from your other postings. Foraging toys with some good treats is always a postitive thing to keep him busy.

One day at a time

 

[BraveheartDogs]

I know...black and white answers would be so easy sometimes. Wish I could give it to you. But you can do this....are you comfortable with him NOW. Does he scare you NOW? Ive seen bad things happen when people are afraid of the bird.

Yes, I am comfortable with him now. I mean, I am adjusting to having and handling a larger parrot, he is the biggest I have ever had, but I am not afraid of him, although if he went crazy and suddenly became very aggressive, I would be uncomfortable.

 

[BraveheartDogs]

With anything, it's a one day at a time. Amazons will show you when they are excited by eye pinning, that is often taken for aggression. Rapid pinning and tail flaring are signs to stay away.

He's an older guy so he's not going to exhibit any crazy hormonal type behavior, he's been through it. With lessened day light hours as well can reduce this behavior as well should the feeling for him be there.

He sounds happy with where he is. He's eating good and enjoying himself from your other postings. Foraging toys with some good treats is always a postitive thing to keep him busy.

One day at a time

Yes! I am very excited that he is showing interest in toys. I just tied a shreddy toy onto his stand and he was messing with it. Now, he sitting there with his eyes shut... the dear old man...

I do watch his eyes and I have noticed the change in them sometimes when I talk to him, not really pinning though. Like when he puts his head down for me to scritch his neck, I watch his eyes, and his pupils stay big.

I think it would be a good idea to teach him to step onto a stick just so that I have it if I ever need it. I guess the biggest concern would be if he suddenly got very loud,which is the deal breaker for my husband.

 

[Love My Zons]

Most birds love to be talked to. Yes, you will say some changing of their pupils when you talk. When mine is going to talk and he's listening to me he will do that with his eyes. Not a sign of aggession, when they are happy and making noise they can do this as well. Even excited and happy they can do this as well.

I am glad he's showing some interest in toys. They do love toys, they also love to climb.

I had read that my Mealy's calls can be heard up to a mile. I was like.........uhm okay, thats gonna be loud if he does this. Well nobody here breaks the sound barrier. There are times the two of them get loud, but most of the time they are really good.

Foraging toys with awesome treats inside are things you break out to divert them when they get loud in here. Green beans work great inside the foragers with holes. AS does a whole cinnamon stick to destroy.

 

[BraveheartDogs]

Most birds love to be talked to. Yes, you will say some changing of their pupils when you talk. When mine is going to talk and he's listening to me he will do that with his eyes. Not a sign of aggession, when they are happy and making noise they can do this as well. Even excited and happy they can do this as well.

I am glad he's showing some interest in toys. They do love toys, they also love to climb.

I had read that my Mealy's calls can be heard up to a mile. I was like.........uhm okay, thats gonna be loud if he does this. Well nobody here breaks the sound barrier. There are times the two of them get loud, but most of the time they are really good.

Foraging toys with awesome treats inside are things you break out to divert them when they get loud in here. Green beans work great inside the foragers with holes. AS does a whole cinnamon stick to destroy.

Oh darn, I forgot to get the cinnamon sticks yesterday! I put a foraging box in his cage, attached to the side and found him rummaging around and picked out a peanut, so he is interested. I think that he wasn't given toys or much opportunity to do or enjoy anything

 

[Love My Zons]

My Avian Vet does not believe in food bowls. He thinks that birds food should be foraged for. He's huge on this and all the birds at his practice have foraging toys, foraging feeders set up with their food.

He says it gives them a sense of accomplishment and how they instinctly they know how to search for food.

Yes, cinnamon sticks are the bomb, they love to tear them to bits and they are light and easy to handle Plus they smell good too.

 

[M.C Bird Rescue]

Being afraid of the beak is a giant concern when it comes to housing a new parrot. It does suck to get bitten but as owners we understand that this happens to even the most prepared and knowledgeable owner.
He may begin to test you eventually , or he could just stay sweet and tolerant. The main thing to think of is your reaction to aggression. IF he tries to bite what will YOU do. What will you do if you DO get bitten severely. These are the issue that can change a confident owner/handler..and a tolerant bird. IF..you react poorly to an aggressive action all could change for a while until that trust rebuilds.

I would request more time on the trial. You will need the minimum of a 30 day trial to even become slightly comfortable with him.
Even then you will need even MORE time, but within 30 days you will know how you feel about him. I always offer a 30 day trail foster before the actual adoption takes place. Is this bird from a rescue?

 

[MommyBird]

I really do think they should allow you more than a week as a trial for heaven's sake!
I would say not to worry about noise increasing after a honeymoon period. I think that would probably stay the same as he is now, especially since he's an older gent. He may learn a few noises to make while playing (now that he's learning to play), but who could object to that?
The only differences I've run into is they may become a bit more assertive, like "no Mom I really DON't want to step up now"
If you are spending the time learning his body language, you would be fine.

 

[akijoy]

I have had my mealy since May and she is still in the honeymoon period. I honestly think she's not going to change at all.
Same with Ollie, the ekkie. I've only had him for 2 short weeks, but I can't imagine him biting or changing in any way in a bad day. Each day he becomes more and more bonded to me.
I do ask more and more with each day. Asking him to be comfortable with more things....opening his wings, flipping him upside down, etc. I touch his beak often, and he knows I am not afraid. His beak gets more and more gentle, and he has not bitten me and I don't expect he ever will.
I think it has a lot to do with being a loving owner, but also maintaining the alpha status. It's the same with dogs, isn't it? They are secure to know that you are the leader, and though they may vy for the alpha spot to test you , they are grateful and happy to be the follower.

 

[BraveheartDogs]

Being afraid of the beak is a giant concern when it comes to housing a new parrot. It does suck to get bitten but as owners we understand that this happens to even the most prepared and knowledgeable owner.
He may begin to test you eventually , or he could just stay sweet and tolerant. The main thing to think of is your reaction to aggression. IF he tries to bite what will YOU do. What will you do if you DO get bitten severely. These are the issue that can change a confident owner/handler..and a tolerant bird. IF..you react poorly to an aggressive action all could change for a while until that trust rebuilds.

I would request more time on the trial. You will need the minimum of a 30 day trial to even become slightly comfortable with him.
Even then you will need even MORE time, but within 30 days you will know how you feel about him. I always offer a 30 day trail foster before the actual adoption takes place. Is this bird from a rescue?

Yes, he is from another rescuer who rescues large parrots and I do small bird rescue. Also, maybe I wasn't clear. He is here for a week for us to decide if we want to keep him here to foster. Technically, he is here as a foster to adopt meaning that we are fostering him but may adopt him. He can actually be returned to the rescuer at any time in his life if it didn't work out, it's not that after a week here we have to make a decision or commit to adopting him. The issue is that I am a freak and like to know if a bird (or other animal) is going to be mine or not, sooner rather than later. I do not feel any pressure at all to have to make a decision, except that I want to decide, because that is who I am. I don't know if this makes sense or not.....

 

[BraveheartDogs]

Hey Vicky,
I think it's definately a legitimate concern. However, with your expertise and background in animal behavior and training, who else to better deal with obstacles (if they show up), than you?

Wow, thank you so much. That made me feel good and I guess that is why I am not feeling too concerned. My conern is more that I am not too concerned but feeling like I should be Again, if that makes any sense at all

 

[Love My Zons]

I think that he likes where he is. You are giving him attention and fun things. I say feel postitive that it IS going to work out and you will be just fine.

If you think he's big, come on over and I will show you Kazoo!

 

[BraveheartDogs]

I have had my mealy since May and she is still in the honeymoon period. I honestly think she's not going to change at all.
Same with Ollie, the ekkie. I've only had him for 2 short weeks, but I can't imagine him biting or changing in any way in a bad day. Each day he becomes more and more bonded to me.
I do ask more and more with each day. Asking him to be comfortable with more things....opening his wings, flipping him upside down, etc. I touch his beak often, and he knows I am not afraid. His beak gets more and more gentle, and he has not bitten me and I don't expect he ever will.
I think it has a lot to do with being a loving owner, but also maintaining the alpha status. It's the same with dogs, isn't it? They are secure to know that you are the leader, and though they may vy for the alpha spot to test you , they are grateful and happy to be the follower.

Monica,

Yes, I do think that it is finding that sweet spot where you are still respectful but asking for a bit more all the time.

I am not a pack theory trainer, so social status and hierarchy are not things I consider in dog training. I think that both dogs and birds are just trying to make the world work for them and they keep doing what they have found works, if that makes sense. And, I do think that being a good owner and just providing them with guidance and rules and the things they need to be happy must mean a lot to them, at least I hope so