Hahns Macaws and biting

[ortegah]

So we've had Jellybean for almost 3 months now. He's still very aggressive with hands, but I think he's starting to come around a little. Anyhow he's done wonderfully with stick training and I keep a small wooden perch stick in every room so I can move him when I need to

Anyhow, I really want to help him get over the fear of hands. He will sit with me and climb down onto my leg and nibble on my finger to see if I will react and so I just don't say anything. He lets me pet him and says "AWW Jellybean!" but after a few seconds will turn and try to bite me. I want to start working with him more so he can trust me and I can in turn trust him more.

Any suggestions?

 

[itzmered]

Jasper does not like scritches at all. No touching of the head or he gives me a warning hiss. If I insist then he will nip at me

 

[JLcribber]

More time.......... It's not how fast you want it to happen. It's how fast he wants it to happen. Some birds just don't like hands so you must be prepared for him to maybe never like them. Interact with your face and eyes. They usually aren't afraid of our heads. They see our heads as the real us. Use your forehead and bow your head. They can't get a bite there and it's just like touching them with your hands.

1 full year is not an un reasonable time frame to establish true relationship.

 

[ortegah]

He likes it though. But then he jumps at me as if he's scared that I'm going to hurt him. It's not just that though. I cannot get him to step up without biting and grinding into my finger bone. He attacks fingers regardless of the situation which is why we use the stick. I honestly think he is afraid of them from a previous experience(before we got him). I know hahns are nippy to begin with so I'm sure that doesn't help either. My gut feeling though is that he has fear and trust issues with hands. I'm hoping I can get some specific ideas on how to train him with some stuff, perhaps some trick training that might help earn his trust.

 

[ortegah]

More time.......... It's not how fast you want it to happen. It's how fast he wants it to happen. Some birds just don't like hands so you must be prepared for him to maybe never like them. Interact with your face and eyes. They usually aren't afraid of our heads. They see our heads as the real us. Use your forehead and bow your head. They can't get a bite there and it's just like touching them with your hands.

1 full year is not an un reasonable time frame to establish true relationship.

Oh I fully expect at least a year or more. I know even when I raised Dakota from 14 weeks on that it took 2 years to get a real good relationship with her and she had no rehoming issues that this bird has. He typically isn't aggressive with me at all, unless my hands get near him any faster than a snails pace. He's a super bird and we all love him dearly. I hope that some day he can fully trust me

 

[Birdasaurus]

Quite honestly, I think it may be in the Hahn's nature to be that way. They are bossy and want their way, and in Honu's case, he LOVES to roughhouse. Nipping at my hands is his way of saying, Let's play! It took me awhile to realize that with him, and I don't know if this is the same kind of nip as Jellybean is giving, but it's just a thought!

 

[ortegah]

He lunges and then grinds his beak back and forth into your finger. Definitely not a game. He may have only been here for 3 months but I definitely know his body language. He makes no bones about telling you how he feels. He gets easily startled and bites out of fear. And I know hahns are already like this so I accept that he'll always be nippy, but I was kinda hoping someone had some specific advice on how to work with his fears.

 

[JLcribber]

but I was kinda hoping someone had some specific advice on how to work with his fears.

I'll repeat. More time. 3 months is the length of the honeymoon for many birds and just the "start" of a budding relationship.

Always be calm and slow moving using "your" body language to project non aggression. Act 100% trustworthy at all times and in time he will realize and accept that. There are no shortcuts my dear.

 

[ortegah]

I wasn't looking for shortcuts, just training methods/ideas

 

[Merlie]

I have a Hahn's that was a rehome. Same issues as you're describing.

He had a fear of my hands for a long time, and still, can get very aggressive if I move too fast.

I was lucky as he's food motivated, so that really helped. Pretending to eat a favorite treat of his in front of him would "lure" him close to me, then, bit by bit and over time, in order to get the treat he had to step up to a training perch, or my arm. He seems to do a lot better if he steps up to my arm, instead of to a finger/hand. Besides, he can do a lot less damage to my arm than he can to my fingers.

I was also lucky as he loves being out of his cage. I know many may not agree with my tactics, but .. from the beginning, in order to come out he had to step up .. not necessarily to my arm, but at least to a training perch.

Each time he stepped up the the training perch, he got a treat. When he didn't want to step up, and lunged or tried to bite, I quietly walked away. When he did step up to the perch, it was much easier to get him to step up to my arm/hand from there without fuss.

He loves attention, loves scritches <to a point, gotta watch him cause he'll decided he's over rather quick and give a good nip when he's done with you>.

He's now progressed to flying to me for attention, when he wants it of course. He's been flighted for a long time, but is really a horrible flyer .. although, that's getting better as well.

He's to the point where he will step up to my arm from inside the cage about 99% of the time without pause <usually he's about ready to jump out at me .. lol>. He's about 90% when it comes to stepping up from other places, like his playtop, playstand, back of my chair .. etc. He's bossy . he's a Hahn's .. lol .. and wants to do things on HIS terms.

Usually when he's being a butthead about stepping up, all I have to do is eat an almond in front of him .. that pretty much does the trick <he's an almond junkie>. I don't think he'll ever be 100% comfortable with hands, esp. hands moving too fast, but he's come a very long way from the scared little bird he once was.

Just seeing him have the confidence to fly across to someplace he wants to go is a wonderful thing.

So, I guess I'm recommending treats .. lol .. if your guy is food motivated, starting with a training stick, using your arm more than your hand, and of course lots and lots of time.

Oh .. btw .. I've had him for just over a year now.

JMHO

 

[Holiday]

Heather, I agree with both you and Andrea: It's partly fear from past experience and partly his nature. Even my Max, who may be the sweetest Hahn's in the world, will sometimes draw back from a scritch and nip. I've learned to keep the scritching sessions very brief. There's something about scritches that sets the little fellas off after a few seconds. He doesn't mind when I preen him if he's got lots of pins, but even then I have to be careful. I'd say that natural inclination plus some abuse has made Jellybean the way he is. I think it can be best overcome by clicker training. Gradually approaching him with the hand, click, or vocalize the bridge, then treat. Get closer every day until you're scritching for a few seconds, then treat. He needs to associate hands with good things, and Hahn's are very trainable.

 

[ortegah]

Thanks so much guys! I do have a clicker for my dogs at home so I'll try to start working with him today! I really appreciate the suggestions


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