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Giving up on Booker

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Archiesmom

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BF, you are exactly right. She told everyone in her barn that he was "crazy and dangerous" and that he "could never be trusted". She had everyone in the barn afraid of my beautiful baby! And when we went to pick him up, she said "I couldn't fix your horse, I'm sorry, he's worthless, I can give you the number to someone who can humanely destroy him for you." Almost like we had given her a broken horse and asked her to fix him. I assure you, this was NOT the case. Booker was sent to her after having preliminary groundwork done by a previous trainer. She was to break him to saddle and harness, and get him comfortable with different environments (riding outdoors and indoors, riding in the rain, etc. etc.) so that he would be well-rounded. And most of all, SHE WAS TO GET HIM READY TO SHOW. He was not broken until she came back from his place, but anyone who saw him there in the barn would tell us our horse was insane and crazy, and that Erin did "what she had to do" to get the results that we were "demanding" from her.

Drugging a horse to ride isn't really frowned upon, actually :( Lots of trainers do it to the youngsters when they first put leather on them, to help them adjust to it without hurting themselves. I personally don't condone it, but it certainly wouldn't hold up in court. Also, while Dan will say that Booker doesn't need to be lead around in chains, unfortunately there are horses that DO need to be led around in chains, so this also wouldn't hold up. The judge would have to know the character of our horse prior to being sent there, which would be how we (the people who paid all of this money) described it to be. My lawyer said if he had broken bones, bruises, etc. we could go to court, but not on anything else.

The bright side to all of this is that we've been in the morgan community for quite some time and are quite well networked. I assure you, everyone that matters knows of the treatment of Booker, and whenever we are asked to recommend a trainer, we tell them to STEER CLEAR of her barn. That's about all we can do :( She's a terrible trainer, her own shortcomings will end her career. I just hope its for good and she doesn't resurface in some other breed or something.
 

BraveheartDogs

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This has got to be one of the hardest days I've ever had to face.
We pulled Booker from training on July 31st, and have let him spend some time to settle down and discuss what his future plans would be. My mom has been avoiding the subject, and I've been so busy that I haven't really noticed it until today.

As some of you may know, Booker is my morgan gelding. We have several horses out on my parents farm, and I used to show horses competitively. I retired from the ring at 18 after a successful 10 year stint as a Jr. Exhibitor, but have been planning my return to the show ring with amateur status. 7 years ago, my mare Lexy gave birth to our first foal, Booker (Rush River Candide). Little did I know how fitting that name would become :( My optimistic little colt took 5 years to grow up, and he got BIG! HUGE! Beautiful. He is the embodiment of a morgan hunter, and his size and elegance alone far dwarfs the competition (and while I may be slightly biased as I love him so much, I'm not too far exaggerating this fact). When we sent Booker off for training, I had high hopes. I was sure that within the year, me and my precious baby horse would be making our debut in the show ring, and I was assured of our ringing success. He was full of potential and was so sweet-natured and willing to please that I was only counting down the months until I got the "ok" to ride him myself. But things didn't go according to plan, and all I can say was the woman who we sent him to (with the intention of helping boost her barn, as she was a new and upcoming trainer), did evil to my horse. That he suffered abuse at her hands was blatantly obvious. But the mental abuse she has inflicted on my horse has become even more apparent in recent months.

My mother has confirmed that Booker will not be returning to training. He is officially "ruined" as a show horse, too many phobias and fears have been developed from this woman's brutal mishandling of my poor, sweet baby. Despite having someone work with him for six months to help "unwind" him, as when we got him back he was freaked out by even a fly landing on him, he has returned to being a happy horse at home, but will never have the mental capacity to adapt to the stress of a horse show life. He has "meltdowns", and while these things are easy to handle at home, she has decided that they are the ending to his never-started professional career. I am devestated. After seven years of anxiously waiting for Booker to be ready to go to the ring with me, today I have been informed this dream will never be realized. And words cannot express the anger I have towards the woman who ruined him.

My parents have sunk quite a bit of money into Booker, as they know of our special bond and wanted so much for us to have our time together in the ring. And I am SO grateful for my parents that despite his quirks and faults, they aren't looking to sell him off to someone else, or simply have him destroyed. No, Booker is going to be one very expensive trail horse for us, and we shall continue to love him as we always have, and he will have a forever home on our farm, forever my mount, forever my soulmate in the form of an equine.

Its a sad day today.
I am so sorry about Booker, but I want to say that you are a loving, humane, responsible, ethical and compassionate owner to allow him to NOT be forced to do something he can't do. A huge part of my career is dealing with people who want to force their dogs to be something they aren't (usually a show dog). They want a championship so badly that they disregard the dogs well being by exposing them to something that frightens them. It isn't fair and it isn't ethical. You have 100% done right by Booker. You should be proud to be able to have him as your companion and you should be proud of doing that for him:hug8:
 

Ranyart

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I agree with Vicki - so many animals are forced into activities that just do not agree with their personality. When I got Jed, my original intention was search and rescue dog. I could have trained him to go through the motions but I saw right away that wasn't 'who he was' at heart. He is a therapy dog through and through and the opportunities and experiences I've been privileged to share with him through pet therapy is something I would have missed entirely if I had just focused on what I wanted rather than who he is (I hope that makes sense). Anyway, once again, good for you and your family giving Booker a home for life to be whoever he will end up being. Definitely spread the (bad) word about this trainer though - her methods are positively archaic - yuck. Give Mr. Booker a pet-therapy hug from me and Jed.
 

Bokkapooh

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our horse is ruined.
I understand how you feel. I want to just:shake::rant::explode:

But you really should not consider your horse as "ruined". That sort of mind set will not help your beloved horse to get better. I know horses and parrots are not the same, but when I have taken in abused parrots, thinking they are ruined is far from my mind(wanting to deck the person who did it to them.. well that is another story:evilgrin:). They are still workable! Yes it can take weeks, months and YEARS to get them to the point of "normal-ness" (and yet they may never be the same animal as when they did not go through the abuse and neglect) but I am always someone to believe in the animal. Believe in your horse. Love him, touch him, and let him feel your spirit energy.

I personally wouldnt ride him for a LONG time, until he is not easily spooked or cowering. I would use him as a pasture horse with minimal riding, just to giving him the time he needs to let the evil that was done to him, be gone from him.

I would file a police report about how she treated your horse. You DO have a witness that claimed she dragged your horse, and that IS abuse and you can file a report on her. Help get her OUT of the horse and animal business! File a report with the police and humane society, and let her be investigated. Even if nothing doesnt happen to her :)() they will have a report on her, so if something like this does happen again, they would probably do something about it.

From your posts, I can tell you love your horse so very very much. I know you will able to work with him.:hug8:
 
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Bokkapooh

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BF, you are exactly right. She told everyone in her barn that he was "crazy and dangerous" and that he "could never be trusted". She had everyone in the barn afraid of my beautiful baby! And when we went to pick him up, she said "I couldn't fix your horse, I'm sorry, he's worthless, I can give you the number to someone who can humanely destroy him for you." Almost like we had given her a broken horse and asked her to fix him. I assure you, this was NOT the case. Booker was sent to her after having preliminary groundwork done by a previous trainer. She was to break him to saddle and harness, and get him comfortable with different environments (riding outdoors and indoors, riding in the rain, etc. etc.) so that he would be well-rounded. And most of all, SHE WAS TO GET HIM READY TO SHOW. He was not broken until she came back from his place, but anyone who saw him there in the barn would tell us our horse was insane and crazy, and that Erin did "what she had to do" to get the results that we were "demanding" from her.


I have a thought.

Has Booker ever been train PRIOR to going to this women?

Can you get in contact with the previous trainer, and have him write a report (make sure to get his/her full name, address and phone number) about how Booker was not " crazy and dangerous".

So when you file a report with the police and humane society and contact your lawyer, you have GREAT evidence. That before he went to that womens barn, he was NOT a terrified, cowering horse, and was NOT crazy and dangerous! And after he came from her barn, he was a cowering, scared and frightened horse.

Even if he was not trained by someone else, do you have anyone who witnessed his health and behavior before going to this women? And use that report (if you have multiple trainers who saw him or eye witnesses who saw his behavior prior to the barn life with this women) and give it to police, humane society, and your lawyer.

That alone is a lot of evidence.
 

itzmered

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I wish you the best of luck with Booker, please dont think of him as a ruined horse. He is destiny lies in your hands and I am sure it doesnt matter to him if he is a show horse or just gets to live his life happily being a saddle horse on lazy afternoon trail rides. :hug8:
 

Archiesmom

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Mercedez-
He was with another trainer, yes. But it was when he was a 2 year old, and he had stayed out at our place for another couple years to grow up. He was just so gangly and awkward, it took him a long time to fill in and look like a horse, so we just kept him home.
 

Thugluvgrl187

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That is horrible. Poor Booker. :hug8::hug8::hug8::hug8:to you.
 

AkCrimson

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I'm really sorry you are having to go through this. But it warms my heart to hear that he will continue to have a good home with you!! Bless you for loving him regardless...too many nasty stories these days. At least he has a good home!!
 

BamaBirdMom

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Your horse isn't ruined. It's really unfortunate that he was left in the hands of a 'trainer' who uses force to achieve what is necessary for the show ring, however, if this horse was really as gentle as you say he was before he went to this trainer, there is no reason that he can't return to that mental and emotional state. Have you ever heard of Parelli Natural Horsemanship, or any other true 'natural' horsemanship way of training? It's about the RELATIONSHIP with the horse. It does not focus on riding, or making the horse do what you want, it focuses on learning to speak 'horse' and how to be a good leader to your horse. I think it's terrible that people only place value on a horse that can win in the ring. The true relationship lies with you and your horse; everything else, showing included, is secondary. If you truly love this horse, it wouldn't matter if all he ever is or could be is a backyard pet. And before you think I don't know what I'm talking about, I have owned horses for years, I have raised and trained foals to become successful show horses, and I have also taken a terrified, right-brained horse who had no real potential and formed a relationship to the point that I could do anything with her. And none of what I did with and to the horses came from anything that was force. There was no fear. There was relief that I could speak 'horse', and so there was trust that I was a worthy leader.
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allison

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This is just awful! :(
This lady has issues and should not be allowed near another horse.
 

looniebirds

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I am not a horse person but it would seem to me, if the only way a person can get any animal to do what they want them to is by fear and breaking their spirit, why that is not really training nor is it showing that the person really has accomplished anything as a trainer. That is not a trainer, that is a bully and an animal hating control freak. The animal obeys out of fear, not respect. She should be banned from contact with any animal is my opinion. I could say a lot more, but this sickens and angers me. I am so sorry. A little kindness goes a long way, and he might come around now that he is away from that evil woman. She will get hers in the end.
 

waterfaller1

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So very sad, I am so sorry.:( I hope you can make the breakthrough back into his kind spirit. Anyone who treats animals this way, should not be around animals period.
 

hotfoot jackson

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Allison is right this woman has issues, I wonder what she does to the horses to do that to their spirit.....maybe the ASPCA should be asked to look into her methods?
 

Archiesmom

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Janet, I'm feeling a little attacked by your message, so allow me to defend some of the things I said in my initial post.

First, I don't think that my horse is "ruined" as in he won't accomplish anything. On the contrary, as I stated before, I love Booker very much and have been with him since he was 20 minutes old. Literally. He got up, nursed, and when he laid down, I was in the stall and he came over to me, laid down, and put his neck and head in my lap and fell asleep. At 16.2 HH and full grown, he still lays down in his stall and waits for me to come in, so that he can put his head in my lap and fall asleep with me petting him. The bond I have with this horse can only be described as that of finding your soulmate in the form of an equine. It's very, very special.
We have had Booker with a "horse whisperer" of sorts for six months. It was someone who really spent a lot of time to communicate with Booker and help him understand his surroundings and feel safe. Might not have been the Parelli techniques, but it was natural horsemanship, and he responded to it. Dan also did not focus strictly on "riding" Booker. We had bigger obstacles to overcome, such as being led on a leadline and following next to the person. He was terrified of having someone on either side of him. And NOTHING could touch him without setting him off. Even a fly landing on his side would send him into a fit. Riding was a hopeful possibility, but NOT a goal.

And most certainly, I do not place a value on my horse by what he can win in the ring. While I am sad to see that his career in the ring has been ended due to his mishandling, as he was so naturally talented and such show horse material it wasn't even funny, I would give up every class I've ever won, check, trophy, ribbon and all, if it meant that my horse was going to be calm, happy and being exactly what he wanted to be for the rest of his life. Booker WANTED to be a show horse. When he was in training as a two year old, he was in his absolute element, he loved going into the ring, he loved the crowds, he was a horse that thrived in the environment but we felt was just a little bit too young and needed to figure out what being a horse was before we took him back. To see that he won't be going back is very hard for me, as I witnessed him flourish with his first taste of it. I may lament that we won't ever get to compete together, but I am happy to let Booker do what it is he wants to do. And right now, to take him back in the ring or even campaign him to get back there within the next couple of years could be disastrous to all of the work that Dan has put in to restore Booker to his former self. And it's not like horse training can just "flip a switch" and Booker can go back to being normal. There is no quick fix solution, and there is NO guarantee that once a horse has experienced trauma that he will ever be able to return to his former self. They are intricate, emotionally complex animals such as ourselves and to say that there is a one-solution quick fix guarantee that I can have my old horse back is to debase what makes them so wonderful in the first place. So my interpretation of "ruined" has everything to do with his career as a show horse, and nothing to do with him as a horse.

I feel fortunate that Dan has been able to work with Booker to a point where I can ride him, even if its just on the trails at an ambling walk so that he can take in his surroundings and process what is going on. He is so careful now about everything, he even stops to observe where he is going to put his foot next before doing so, as though he's afraid the ground is going to fall right out from under him. But each day, he gets better and better. Every once in a while, I see my carefree colt that got his name because he used to book around the pastures without heed or care, tail up over his back, snorting and thinking he's just the coolest kid around. And, maybe one day, he'll be that horse once again.

Your horse isn't ruined. It's really unfortunate that he was left in the hands of a 'trainer' who uses force to achieve what is necessary for the show ring, however, if this horse was really as gentle as you say he was before he went to this trainer, there is no reason that he can't return to that mental and emotional state. Have you ever heard of Parelli Natural Horsemanship, or any other true 'natural' horsemanship way of training? It's about the RELATIONSHIP with the horse. It does not focus on riding, or making the horse do what you want, it focuses on learning to speak 'horse' and how to be a good leader to your horse. I think it's terrible that people only place value on a horse that can win in the ring. The true relationship lies with you and your horse; everything else, showing included, is secondary. If you truly love this horse, it wouldn't matter if all he ever is or could be is a backyard pet. And before you think I don't know what I'm talking about, I have owned horses for years, I have raised and trained foals to become successful show horses, and I have also taken a terrified, right-brained horse who had no real potential and formed a relationship to the point that I could do anything with her. And none of what I did with and to the horses came from anything that was force. There was no fear. There was relief that I could speak 'horse', and so there was trust that I was a worthy leader.
Parelli Horse Training | Natural Horse Training | Parelli | Parelli
check it out. It really works.
 

waterfaller1

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Beautiful post Natalie. Sending lots of good energy your way that Booker can work though this.
Big hugs:hug8:
 

BamaBirdMom

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Natalie, my post was not meant to attack at all. I'm sorry you took it that way. What I got from your first post in this thread is that you were upset that a trainer ruined your horse for the show ring. You spent an entire paragraph talking about your high hopes for the ring, and 'ruined' was the word you used.
I did not say that 'you' only placed value on what he could do in the ring. I said 'people'. And you didn't mention that he has been with a natural horsemanship trainer; you only focused on the 'tragic' and negative part of what happened. I've been in the horse world all my life, and some of the things that are done to ready a horse for the ring make me sick to my stomach. I would rather have only trail horses for the rest of my life, or just show at the little local shows for fun. I hope your Booker is able to return to his former state, but if you can have a relationship with him that has no fear in it and just enjoy being with him then I would say that you have been successful. I hope that you have been working with the natural horsemanship trainer as well...it does a person a world of good, too:)
 
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