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Fish Question

taxidermynerd

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So I have a little fish question.

In a 10 gallon I have 2 glofish tetras (parent and child) and 4 pygmy cory cats. I'm thinking of moving them into my 40g breeder, which is stocked with a pearl gourami, mystery snails, platys, and upside-down catfish. I currently have no aggression problems in either tank.

I'm wondering how the glofish would be with the other fish in the 40? I don't want there to be aggression issues. There's ample hiding space, and I can add more if need be. My 2 filters are running about 660 gph altogether, so no worries on that front. Also wondering if the pygmy cories would get scared or lost in a tank that big? They're very tiny fish.

Before anyone mentions it, I don't have the ability to get another tank (like a 20g/30g), so that's out of the question. I can either move them to the 40 or leave them in the 10. I just think they would appreciate the extra space.

Any help would be appreciated!
 

Rain Bow

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We've has tetras in w/ upside down cats & platys. We never had any issues w/ aggression as long as there were schools. I know the tetras can get aggressive if they don't have enough room. Our tank back then was a 50 gal tall. I'd give them plenty of room to hide if need be. I'd love to see your tanks if you are comfortable to share. Maybe its just a matter of some extra plants or backing plants. My hubby & I were a team on all the tanks & I am the one posting.

I can say that w/ only 2 tet's (Unless one is a real pip) I think you may even be able to get a couple more depending on how many fish you have overall in the 40. They do better in slightly smaller groups & are more into one another in a school. The snails will be ok, I've had a bunch since I was very young (like Jr. High).

The only thing I'm not sure about are the pygmi corys. Cory cats do pretty bad here in my area because our water is very hard mineral latten. We got all different types of cats until our "Mom & Pop" fish store told us about the minerals & cats continuously having to be replaced due to WNYs especially hard water. We stopped trying from there. If you listed a species & I didn't comment on it, I missed it. Let me know & I'll keep an eye on this thread.
 

Beasley

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I think they’ll do great in the 40! Personally I would add more tetras. I’ve never had less than 10 tetras together, they’re schooling fish and not at all aggressive in my experience. I also always kept a school of Corys in my tanks and they are the sweetest little fish! They’ve never been aggressive to any other fish I had… Guppies on the other hand are an absolute nightmare, nasty little buggers!
 

taxidermynerd

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We've has tetras in w/ upside down cats & platys. We never had any issues w/ aggression as long as there were schools. I know the tetras can get aggressive if they don't have enough room. Our tank back then was a 50 gal tall. I'd give them plenty of room to hide if need be. I'd love to see your tanks if you are comfortable to share. Maybe its just a matter of some extra plants or backing plants. My hubby & I were a team on all the tanks & I am the one posting.

I can say that w/ only 2 tet's (Unless one is a real pip) I think you may even be able to get a couple more depending on how many fish you have overall in the 40. They do better in slightly smaller groups & are more into one another in a school. The snails will be ok, I've had a bunch since I was very young (like Jr. High).

The only thing I'm not sure about are the pygmi corys. Cory cats do pretty bad here in my area because our water is very hard mineral latten. We got all different types of cats until our "Mom & Pop" fish store told us about the minerals & cats continuously having to be replaced due to WNYs especially hard water. We stopped trying from there. If you listed a species & I didn't comment on it, I missed it. Let me know & I'll keep an eye on this thread.
Thanks! I will try and get some good shots soon, they aren't anything that spectacular but the fish seem to like it. I also have a pearl gourami in there, but he's a big sweetie and has never had an issue with anyone. I had tiger barbs and cherry barbs for a while, so I'm somewhat used to semi-aggressive fish.

I think it should probably be okay since the tank has established territories and stuff- there's an established community dynamic, so I think they'll figure out a spot to fit in. I can get more hides easily. All the fish tanks get water from the same tap, so the only difference should be environmental factors in the tanks. I think I might try to move them tomorrow, acclimate them and stuff.

I used to have a school of 6 peppered corys in my 40, then I got another 6 from petsmart in within 24hours they were all dead. I think they picked up something from the shared filters at petsmart, that's the first and last time I got fish there. They were cool dudes, I miss them a lot.

One day I hope to get a bristlenose pleco, I had a pleco (when I first got into fish, before I knew better), and I gave him up when I learned I wouldn't be able to provide what he would need. I miss him, I'd love to have a pleco (albeit a smaller one) again.
 

Monica

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At least more tetras and corys honestly.... both are schooling fish, do better in groups, especially corys. That said, I've struggled keeping them as well. Pygmy corys are kind of weird fish, when it comes to corys... but that's what makes them so endearing.


@Rain Bow Are you sure on the water hardness? I would have thought that the water is *TOO* soft, rather than being too hard. Everyone I have spoken with from there has had soft water and needed to add minerals to it.
 

taxidermynerd

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At least more tetras and corys honestly.... both are schooling fish, do better in groups, especially corys. That said, I've struggled keeping them as well. Pygmy corys are kind of weird fish, when it comes to corys... but that's what makes them so endearing.


@Rain Bow Are you sure on the water hardness? I would have thought that the water is *TOO* soft, rather than being too hard. Everyone I have spoken with from there has had soft water and needed to add minerals to it.
I'm not looking to get more fish, I had the right amounts at the start and over time they've died off. The pygmy cories and tetras, after these guys pass on I'm not planning on getting more. I just thought they might like some company, some more space to swim.
 

Shezbug

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Are they similar sizes? I am not very knowledgeable about fish keeping but I have had not too many problems with them when I have kept them. I’m not familiar with the fish you’re referring to but I was always told if everything else is compatible and they’re not like fighting fish they can usually be kept together if they have ample space and get away zones. If they are close in size and other needs and behaviour I was always told that they should be fine unless they’re known as aggressive what I mean. That being said- most of my information has been from pet stores or other amateur fish keepers so I’m not sure how accurate that information is with fish that are not gold fish, danios, loaches and the more simple to care for type fish.
@ChromeScholar has a wicked fish pond set up and I think @hrafn also has fish, maybe they would know the answer to your question?

Edit: left a sentence out
 
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fashionfobie

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I understand that you don't want to buy more fish, but the schooling species will be healthiest and happiest with more friends.

You could find a community of fish keepers, Chicago area will definately have heaps, you could see if there is anyone who wants to expand their school and possibly arrange to sell/give your schooling fish to them. There is a pretty wide community of fish keepers around. I know I personally dont buy my fish from large chains. I get all my fish from within my fish network. Other fish keepers who have fish that spawn or from specialised breeders.

Also I imagine (haven't fact checked) but since Chicago will get water from the Great Lakes, I am betting you have more acidic water which is typically softer :) if you can't get a quality test kit you can look up all water table data on government sites.

Hope this gives you some ideas :) bigger is normally better with fish so it isnt a bad idea to upgrade.

Use some caution mixing so many different ecosystems together, fish from s.america and Asia. Generally it is a dream to keep the fish in a replica of their native habitat.
 

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@Monica

According to Google...

Culligan water softeners posts

"Poor-Quality, Hard Water
Buffalo's water
is considered hard, which means it has a high concentration of mineral elements. These dissolved minerals cause hard water, which is often responsible for: Stiff, scratchy, faded laundry."
 

finchly

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Hey @taxidermynerd ! Your fish collection is awesome. The only one I’d worry about is the gourami, but I like you had a pearl gourami years and years ago....it grew huge but it didn’t know it. Big nice fish that never bothered anyone, unlke most gouramis.

Tetras should be fine with all the others. Good choices.

And yes — schooling fish are happy with friends but yours have friends. Not a huge number but someone to pal around with. I think you are making strong choices in not over-burdening yourself at this time (I’m talking about Chirp and his health issues). I wouldn’t advise you to make more work for you and your dad right now. Best to keep things as they are. Your focus is in the right place. :hug2:
 

taxidermynerd

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I moved them to the 40! The tetras are making fast friends with the platys, and the pygmy corys are having a greaat time checking everything out. I ordered more hides, those will arrive Wednesday so I will have them if I need them.
 

Monica

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@Rain Bow based on the water report that @fashionfobie shared, I would say the water there is medium, at best.... I also found someone who lives in Buffalo and shared their water parameters. I can only say slightly harder than soft.


My water has a hardness of 3° out of tap. Buffalo is about 6-7° of hardness. My sister's water is 19° hardness. (I've spoken with people that have harder water than that!) I know that in some areas in New York, the water is even softer!


A lot of people believe that if your water is around 8-12° of hardness, that it's hard water. I guess that I find it difficult to say it's "hard water" when people have around 20° of hardness.



And sadly, I realize that when speaking about water hardness, most people wont have the slightest clue what I'm talking about... including well seasoned fish keepers. (at least, speaking in regards to these low numbers)


@fashionfobie I see on that water report that the pH is either barely above neutral or closer to 8 pH. My water is twice as soft as the water there and the pH usually around about 7.2-7.6 out of tap! I really wonder if anyone gets acid water from tap? I think most people usually have higher pH.

Will say though that acidic water and water softness don't necessarily go hand in hand. That is, you could have hard water that's acidic, or soft water that's alkaline. It really depends on how much carbonates/bi-carbonates, CO2, tannins, humic acids, fulvic acids and other things are in the water to effect the pH. I've realized that it is a common belief within the fish community that if you have low pH, the water is soft, if you have high pH then the water is hard... which really only points out how very little people know about their water parameters. I have shrimp and someone else to thank for learning all that... and not something I willingly went into! LOL



@taxidermynerd that's great! The first pygmy cory I got was one that the owner had a school of them from Florida and moved all the way to California with them. They, like your school, all slowly died off... until there was one left. And I took that one. I ended up finding more at another store in California (freaking expensive in Nevada!) and added them to the tank. Unfortunately, all have perished as the person who was taking care of the tank severely neglected it and lost nearly all the fish in the tank. I would love to get more at some point in time, but only when I can get a dedicated tank set up for them.
 

Love My Zons

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Tetras are fish that like to be in schools. You can do an odd # like 5 of each to be a mini school.

They will love a 40 gallon tank. As for water softening. tetras like slightly acidic water. You can add a peat moss bag to your filter. I know they do make water conditioners that will keep your ph at the required level. neutral to slightly acidic.

Neons are a great addition. Very docile. Very colorful.

My all time favorite Tetras are the Congo Tetra, not suitable for your setup, but they are beautiful. They were fine years ago in my 75 they even lived with large cichlids and even a small Oscar.

Post pics Girl!
 

fashionfobie

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Will say though that acidic water and water softness don't necessarily go hand in hand. That is, you could have hard water that's acidic, or soft water that's alkaline. It really depends on how much carbonates/bi-carbonates, CO2, tannins, humic acids, fulvic acids and other things are in the water to effect the pH. I've realized that it is a common belief within the fish community that if you have low pH, the water is soft, if you have high pH then the water is hard... which really only points out how very little people know about their water parameters. I have shrimp and someone else to thank for learning all that... and not something I willingly went into! LOL
Oh for sure! I did say typically, not always :) I had a lovely colony of Amano shrimp that lived to be nearly 6 years old. They are so cool! I could watch them munch on veg for ages.

I live in Queensland Australia so I am not on the US water table any longer. I went for my Master's at the State University of New York at Buffalo, a pretty decent architecture school :) I live on the Pacific coast we have hard water :)

I am a pretty big advocate of ecosystem themed tanks, especially for tropical fish. For a few reasons, but mainly I think adding complexity to such a delicate enclosed system is asking for problems. There are people who manage buffers, RO water and get by just fine. Though when you add that complexity, more can go wrong..or say you go on holiday and your friend needs to do a water change.. it is much easier for them to make an innocent yet fatal mistake.

I definitely made my mistakes with tanks over the past 20+ years. I learned a lot from more experienced fish keepers. They most constructive person I met was an older keeper. He would never mix continents, even with his plant choices. He had tetras living to amazing ages and farlowella acus that spawned in his tank. Farlowella acus are probably my favourite tropical fish. They are gorgeous to me, an ancient species and placid. He never added fuse to his tanks, he just tried to replicate the natural habitat and stuck to fish that thrived on his city water table.

Fish are fantastic! I don't have any tropicals at the moment, but I am thinking about setting up a pond for my goldies and using their current 475L for one, we shall see. No plans are in motion yet :)
 
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Monica

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Great to know someone who's more knowledgeable in the fish community! :)

I am by no means an experienced fish keeper, nor have I kept fish for years... however, the things I see fish people recommending makes me cringe!


Speaking of amanos.... we have a species that is becoming more common within the USA. I'm thinking they might be Australian Amanos (Caridina sp. typus) as compared to the "standard" Amanos (Caridina multidenta - named after Takashi Amano - RIP). I should have some DAS as well. (assuming I have the species correct)


I use RO water and GH minerals. My main tank runs acidic. I have another tank with brackish water. Rarely fed, water changes rarely ever done. (tank has been up and running maybe 2 years now? and less than a handful of water changes done on it) No water agitation or movement. And a saltwater algae tank. Algae lives in it.


Thankfully, I can leave them be for a week or longer and everything will be "okay". I do know someone who has several tanks and 'ponds'. They went away for a while and had their roommate take care of the tanks. Unfortunately, the tanks crashed and she lost many of the residents. Sadly, she believes it was due to lack of feeding. The truth is, the tanks had ammonia from being over-stocked. When she went away, the roommate might not have done water changes frequently enough (not that the owner was doing them frequently enough or large enough...) and/or overfed the tanks, which led to them crashing... She had some amanos that were 6+ years old, too... maybe 10+?
 

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@Monica It is fantastic that you rarely need to do water changes. My tropical tank was like that, I did a 10% change monthly. It was well planted and was a pretty great little system. My goldfish are totally different! I do a 80-90% change weekly. Goldfish are large fish and have high ammonia output, it also doesn't help that they rip up most plants--which break down into the bio load. It is not a balanced system like my tropicals were. I try and keep my goldfish in perfect water quality all the time, I know some people who let goldies deal with a bit more.. but they are my fish puppies! :p Brackish is really neat, in the brackish harbour near my house I have seen seagulls eating monos. It was sorta sad, such a gorgeous fish and the gull dropped bits of him on the dock :(

The most heartbreaking shrimp I ever kept was a bamboo (atyopsis moluccensis). He was such a cute shrimp! He sat on the filter, so cute! One day he left. He must have climbed out of my tank...probably looking for green pastures... my tank may have been too clean for him so to speak. I did pipette algae/ sea monkey around him.. :( Well I never found him.. I am like 90% certain my foster cat ate him when he was climbing somewhere.. but no idea. The tank had a lid, but clearly there are always some gaps near tubes and such.

I am not a big advocate of saltwater tanks. So many of those fish are just sentenced to death once they enter the pet trade. There are a lot of species that we simply don't know enough about in terms of diet, spawning and otherwise. I don't think people should keep fish that can't spawn in captivity. Just my opinion, many species do fine in captivity. So stick to the clown fish and leave the poor cow fish alone! --to any salt tank people :D Same goes for all the L-series plecos.

I feel a little bit bad that we hijacked Bee's thread. I just get carried away :p
 

Monica

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If you can set up an area either in tank, or as something like a HOB, and you can get your hands on a pothos plant, that might be one way to incorporate plants into your goldfish tank? Just the roots of the pothos would be in the water. But yes, they are pretty messy!

Amanos are known for walk-abouts in house... heard of them ending up 20+ feet away! Haven't really about filter feeders doing that...

I have no plants on having an actual saltwater tank and i can understanding! Although if we can figure out how to breed some of these species, it would help with those taken from the wild. The owner of the company (or, well, past owner now... but he still works there) has a saltwater tank with fish he got directly from the ocean. They appear to at least be well cared for, although one fish does appear too large for the tank. If I have anything saltwater, it's likely to be a shrimp. No plans on actually having saltwater fish.


@taxidermynerd You should share pictures of how the fish are doing in the tank!! :)
 

taxidermynerd

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By the time I shut the lights off for the night, the tetras were schooling with the platys. The corys are making themselves scarce, they have a ton of space to explore (especially since they are so tiny!)
 
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