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Caiques and their Hormones. Completely different bird 4 years later?

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DidiBird

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I don't even know where to start...

I feel like I've just dodged a bullet. I didn't end up getting the BHC I mentioned in an earlier thread. Although I would have loved it with all my heart, it was admittedly a premature decision to make on such a whim.

The more I read on Caiques, the more I am beginning to see that they seem like positively playful little bundles of hyperactive fun and joy... for only the first 2-4 years of their life. Then puberty hits.

They are given the nickname the "Clowns of the Parrot World", presumably for their premature years, and the "Dr. Jekylls and Mr. Hides of the Parrot World" most likely referring to the puberty phase where they encompass many different and unpredictable personalities.

While hormonal changes are something to be found in all bird species, from what I'm reading it seems like caiques are more likely to experience a more severe change in personality. This change seems to become ingrained in them no matter how much you try to "work" with them to behave better. Instead, I'm finding people "adapting" to their bird's new personality (like wearing long sleeves when ever handling the bird) instead of hearing about successes in behavior modification training.

I also am finding more and more cases of Caiques being extremely aggressive towards other people in the household, whether they live there or are visitors. I've read many stories of Caiques not staying put on their play gym or cage top, and seeking out to attack another person or animal. I want my guests to be able to enjoy my bird as much as I get to.

I plan on not only having multiple birds, but a cat and dog, and eventually children! Human ones! I don't want to have a bird attack my infant, and I don't want to have to decrease its out-of-cage time for the new babies in the house. That's not fair.

The more I see it, the more I find that I am setting myself up for a disaster. I don't want to be in a position where I even have to go near considering rehoming my darling bird, no matter how undarling he might be.

But all the good things about them define my idea of a dream bird...

I know no bird is perfect, but with the number of warning signs out there for this particular species, it seems a well mannered mature caique is a lot to hope for.

In preparation of getting my Caique, I have been putting a heavy amount of research into clicker training and trick training. With that I plan on doing my best to stimulate my bird mentally, and teach him through positive reinforcement that playing nicely means more play and treats, and playing too rough or screaming will result in absence of my attention, play, and treats. I can only hope that he exercises the same concepts with other people who want to play with him.

Ive read "Those Crazy Caiques" by Judith A Woods, and "Good Bird" by Barbara Heidenreich. I have "The Parrot Problem Solver" on its way in the mail, and am looking at "Clicker Training for Birds" by Melinda Johnson and "Bird School" by Ann Castro as my next book purchases.

I plan on conditioning him that treats mean he is doing something right, and losing my attention means doing something wrong. I plan on teaching him a variety of tricks that are fun for both him and I (puzzles, acrobatics, etc). I plan on exercising my caique like crazy (even looking into the Aviator harness for flight training and exercise), socializing him with other people and birds, and just exposing him to as much as possible. I am going to provide him with as many things as I can to keep him occupied when I can't be giving him all my attention. I plan on providing him with a healthy variety of meals as caiques are eating machines.

But how much does a structured upbringing change who they are going to be once they mature?

Am I wrong in thinking that they eventually turn into violent, territorial demons?

Is the change just a phase? How long does it last? How frequently does it reoccur?

I've read numerous people talking about how they go through their two or so weeks where they are horrible, but is that on top of a general shift towards being more aggressive all the time?

I haven't completely changed my mind about getting a Caique, I've just taken many steps back and am looking at this new addition into my life as one big picture (as everyone considering getting a bird should, I'm almost ashamed of having jumped into this so quickly as I should know better).

Sorry I've been so pesky about the topic of Caiques lately, Avian Avenue. I appreciate your help and support.
 

beakybirdie

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Well, a caique is a very weird bird. They do not have an off switch and there is no distracting one from their goal. They are pig headed and strong willed and honestly, most of the time they don't care what you want :)

This is not to say that they can't be nice birds, because for a good portion of Jellybean's life she was a nice bird. During the hormonal times, I stayed the heck out of her way and just let her be. One thing that is beyond fantastic about a caique is they will show you how they feel! You can tell when a caique is enraged or when they are happy. An angry bird will flash their red eyes and hunch over and you can see the evil bird posture coming a mile away. If they hate something they REALLY REALLY REALLY hate it. If they love something they REALLY REALLY REALLY love it. There is no middle ground with this species.

They don't all become terrible demons, I wouldn't have ever called Jellybean a demon. She was just what she was, a weird little caique who loved life and loved me. She had her days where she didn't want to be messed with and I usually left her be on those days. It is safe to say that the bird you bring home as a baby is not the bird you will live with for years and years. When they hit puberty they change personality wise and behavior wise. It's not that you can't deal with it.

Jellybean would come down off her cage to attack the broom, it was her mortal enemy. She would also come down from her cage to chase one particular male friend of mine, for some reason she didn't like him but the most she would do is do her little posturing on the floor beside his feet and make like she was going to attack.

I got Jellybean from a friend who couldn't keep her anymore (personally I think my friend couldn't deal with the crazy bird) and she was already in her teen years. If I had to get another caique I would definitely get an adult bird. Why? I feel that an adult bird you can see what you are getting. Yes I know how cute baby birds are but when your baby caique matures into the nutcase adult and starts biting you for no apparent reason (btw there is ALWAYS a reason for a bite, usually it's because as the owner you are too stupid not to know the language of a caique :D), you tend to take it personally. If your adult bird bites you, you aren't remembering all the cute little things it used to do. I just find that an adult caique is way more predictable at being unpredictable, if that makes any sense?

To be honest, Jellybean lived and thrived off of unstructured days. She loved the new and the exciting; a new toy would bring piggy squeals of excitement. She enjoyed going to the park randomly in her travel cage. I never structured her day, because trying to force an activity on her wasn't going to work. She really was a bird I could leave the cage open and for a good portion of the day she'd just do whatever. She did have to have an hour every night of playtime with me but other than that her days where pretty much whatever we wanted to do. Jellybean did not scream but she had this very annoying contact call that was a half whistle and a half wailing alarm sound.

As for her aggression, she was highly aggressive and would take chunks of my skin if I had let her about two or three weeks out of the year. She would go down to the bottom of the cage and hop around in an aggressive manner and violently attack her jingly ball. She'd attack the bars as well, just a general foul mood. Some days I wouldn't even open the cage because she was one who would get down on the floor and attack feet. I didn't want to step on her or end up with toes missing so a few days I would just leave the cage closed. During the month leading up to those days and the month after she was a bit more aggressive but usually I could safely handle her if she was reading that she was OK with being handled. Other than that, on the off months she was usually OK but she had a weird sense of humor and loved faking me out just to get a bite in. She did give me the worst bite I have ever recieved from a bird though. Man did it hurt!

They are in general nice birds but you just kind of have to go with the punches, or bites as it were :D Believe me I miss that little biting terror of a bird!

Oh and sorry for the wall of text
:o:
 

Mystics Mom

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they are different birds..i have 3 2 blk heads(1 male..7yrs..1 female..8yrs...) and 1 white belly(Male...approx 7yrs)i adore them,i can and always have been able to do anything with them..but they have hot button and when they are in a moment you just back off,they get over it :cool:..i find them to be some of my favorite birds..they are always happy and so full of life..but if they decide they dont like you WATCH OUT!!!! not much you are going to do to change their mind,especially my WBC(Cosmo)
 

Bokkapooh

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They are just like any other sexually mature parrot. You may never get it to like more than one person, especially guests. I would never expect a companion parrot to take to strangers such as guests, coworkers, friends, etc. The behavior books will really help you, especially Parrot Problem Solver.
 

penny'smom

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I didn't quite get 2 years - I'm the one with long sleeves :o: It was this time last year that things changed. I thought I had done a lot of research and had a grasp on what I was doing, but getting Penny eventually made me feel unprepared in several ways. As soon as she stopped being a "baby" my inexperience must have shown. (We had parakeets since I was very little; she is my first animal as an adult.) I got the right cage, looked at nutrition, got all the toys, dedicated the time... I know I was certainly not perfect, but I don't think I was a bad parront. Why hate me? I'm the one who feeds and plays with her 90% of the time. Though there are days when I feel like somehow I messed up. We still play and interact (which is very fun, and she'll sit with me and preen in the evenings), but it gets me down that she'll still go into attack mode if she sees bare skin on my arms. Sometimes I see here eyeing my bare feet as we're moving to another room. More worrisome to me is, who else will deal with this if something happens and I can't take care of her? She only attacks me, but I really do worry that one day someone else will end up with a huge welt on their arm or bloody fingers. And if she gets frightened and flies, I have to first find a jacket to put on so I can pick her up.

I'm not trying to talk anyone out of a caique - they are wonderful birds. I love her dearly but had I known this would happen I might have made a different decision - for both our sakes.
 

DidiBird

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I'm the one with long sleeves :o: .

You're not the only one! I've read that multiple times by different people. I hope you didn't think I was referring to you specifically! :hug8:


Its so hard because its such a gamble. Every bird is an individual and it seems that no matter what their childhood is like, they can turn in any direction.

I'm having quite the hard time deciding. I'm not 100% sure I'm not getting a Caique, but I'm no where near 100% sure that I am. Its scary because I was 100% sure recently, and put a deposit on one. It was by pure chance in circumstance that I didn't end up bringing it home.

Thank you everyone, and keep it coming. I want to hear more about peoples' mature caiques.
 

kastelling

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Thinking back, I think most of the folks I know with aggressive birds only have one, as opposed to two...

Sent from my MB501 using Tapatalk
 

Cydney

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My family's male WBC is a little over 5 years now, we've had him since he was 8 months and knew him before that. He has been pretty typical of a caique, super playful as a youngster, aggressive with different species (Pois especially), and has slowly become more hormonal, but I wouldn't say he's been exceptionally aggressive or out of character for parrots in general. If he doesn't want to come out, we don't make him. If he starts posturing, we leave him alone. He isn't cage or food aggressive at all, but I can say that in the years we've had him, he has only ever seriously disliked three or four people (and he's met tons). Most other people he'll put on a show for.
 

HollyT

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Our little guy was already seven and turned 8 years old within the first year we had him. I'm not sure if we are just lucky or if this change has already happened or if it has yet to happen, but Ravi is really predictable and obvious about his moods or wants etc. I've learned how to work with him on his terms while still getting behaviors I want out of him. Of course we have our miscommunications but I've never been attacked. Well, I take that back one time he jumped on my head from the top of his cage, but it was the first time I was running the Dyson while he was out. It gets him all worked up and I wasn't paying attention. But no damage was done, thank goodness, and now I make sure he's caged before the vacuum gets used.

They are a lot of work though. Keeping him busy in and out of the cage is a constant challenge for me.
If someone was planning on having a full life with children and other pets I would suggest either no caique or two so they can keep each other company and play.

Interesting discussion though I'm liking the dialogue.
 

Kolkri

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Ok here is a question. How do you head off these problems? My Twitter is still being hand fed and now I'm scared again. lol I chickened out on the first one I was offered and starting to wonder..... Nope not going to jinx it by saying anything bad aloud.
 

KatherinesBirds

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I think this is just a yearly hormonal phase. Wait it out and work with your bird. After being bitten today and with what I have gone through I haven't thought about rehoming yet.
Katherine
:eek:
 

Ming-Ming

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Douglas is only 2 (or 3? I forget...) and he has his hormonal phases even now.
When he hits "that time of year" he is SUPER aggressive. He almost killed my Quaker from outside the cage, so during this time of year, I put plexiglass around her cage.. lol.

I've also seen him try to launch himself at my friend, who he just decided he didn't like! I've never seen him do that with ANYONE else before!

They are definitely finicky birds attitude wise! When Douglas wants something, he will scream and bite and growl until he gets it! Which makes me laugh... but I guess that can be intimidating for some people! When they don't like someone, it's hard to change their minds, and they will let the person know! Like stalking them, and launching themselves at them. But like someone said earlier, some birds just make that decision, Caiques just decided to act on it!

I know a lady with a Caique that is hormonal almost all year around (and she has two of them). I'll see if I can find the blog for you...
Here is the blog, and his name is Beeps.
Parrot Musings: Beeps
I posted it so you can see all the posts on him. Might give you an idea of how it is to live with a more-aggressive than usual Caique.

I hope the personality flicks won't turn you off! Douglas is really the sweetest bird, and I adore him. Even when he is a little monster, you usually just need to put them back into their cage, until they calm down and work their frustration off by attacking some toys! Hehe!
 

Saemma

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This is a very interesting thread. Thank you.:)
 

rockybird

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I have a male caique. For the first 3-4 yrs., he was literally the perfect pet. At about four yrs. of age, he became aggressive. He would bite and latch on, forcing me to shake my hand hard to get him off, spraying blood all over the place. If he was on my shoulder, he would go for my face. I sustained some nasty bites, even going to the ER once.

Like a previous poster, I believe that they always have a reason when they bite. For Zeek, it seems to have to do with me leaving the house, or not letting him out of the cage when home. He doesnt understand why he cant be with me all the time. I noticed the bites occured mostly on the weekends, when I was home a lot. Even though I let him out of the cage for most of the day, he would become enraged if I put him back in. I generally only put him back in the cage if I left the house. So, he learned to attack whatever he associated with me leaving the house...boots, car keys, beeper. He would even attack me, if I had him on my shoulder and stepped into the back foyer to the garage. For awhile he was jealous of the cell phone, and if I forgot and answered it while he was on my shoulder, he would start posturing and go for my face. He would go so far as to stalk me and run after me. I learned to recognize his behavior when he was angry...eye pinning, methodically walking back and forth while rubbing his beak on the counter or cage bars, feathers ruffled along his back. He literally looks crazed. He would also hold grudges, and would try to attack hours after the inciting event. Interestingly, he was never angry when I put him in the cage on weekdays to go do work, or in the cage at night to go to the gym. I am guessing because this was accepted routine.

For the last couple months, he has been back to his old self...affectionate, playful, etc. I think this is because I moved into a new house, and he is extra clingy with the new environment. I suspect he will go back to his old ways.

This bird is a handful and like nothing I could have imagined with a parrot. Every night, he lays on his back in my hand while I snuggle him before putting him in his night cage. This is our routine, and he will let out the most mournful whimpers while I cuddle him. He gets into EVERYTHING, yet he will stop if I say NO. I have been taking him on car rides and walks in the new neighborhood, which he loves. A caique never hides their emotions. He will burst into tune and rub his head against my cheek when happy. He LOVES routine. Especially the routine of making dinner. The head surfing gets out of hand and he DEMANDS it. My new neighbors must wonder about me, as sometimes he tries to head surf as I walk him. It must look like I'm fighting with my hair. He loudly squeals when he doesnt get his way. He knows how to pop lids off of things, crawl into a chip bag, open a candy bar wrapper, drink from the faucet, walk through the living room, down the hall and crawl into bed with me, etc. The other day, he got the shower drain off! He hates other birds, except for the green cheek, who he has known since a baby. Today the parakeet got out, and as I held him, Zeek made a mad Herculean jump off the counter onto me, intent on destroying it. These are very complicated animals. They are so intelligent and needy and require constant interactive attn. My green cheek is happy to snuggle with me while I work. The caique expects me to play with him, groom him, cuddle him. I had no idea what I was getting into with a caique. He is a wild animal, and I have to respect this. He is living in an environment that he wasnt evolved for. He should be out in the wild with his mate, protecting his babies from predators and doing WHATEVER he wanted. Not having a human tell him NO or having cage bars restrict him. I have finally come to the realization that he is what he is. Now, all I can do is accept him. I have had him for nine years now. He is so bonded to me that I think I am stuck with him forever, but he certainly doesnt make my life easy. Nonetheless, I cant help but love the bundle of fluff. I feel an obligation to protect him, no matter how hard he makes things.
 
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Ming-Ming

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Rockybird! I could not describe a caique better than that! :D

They really are a handful! When I study, I can let my Quaker out, but not douglas! He demands my 100% attention!!
 

carkam

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I also heard this about male Senegals. It does worry me as my Big Bird is Senegal and Meyer hybrid. I am hoping he will keep his stubborn, big attitude, sweet self, but if not, I will need to accept whatever personality he ends up with! I am somewhat scared, but there is nothing I can do at this point!:rolleyes:
 

DidiBird

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Wow, this is all information EVERYONE should hear before bringing a Caique home. Thank you all so very very much for sharing all your stories and providing me with information. I have made a complete 180 in my anxiousness to get a new bird, particularly a Caique. The idea of having one has not been rejected entirely, however i see now that i have a lot more planning and research to do. (Which, I mean...duh)It is also beautiful to hear of how much everyone loves their caique despite its aggressive tendancies. It shows how true your passions are for your birds, understanding that they are wild animals, and that they should not be judged or resented for their natural behaviors.You guys are great :) Again, thank you for sharing.
 

DidiBird

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I almost feel like this thread is Sticky-worthy. If I came across this thread earlier, I wouldnt have been so quick to place a deposit on one. Up to the mods, not sure what the sticky thread protocol is :p
 

Mystics Mom

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This is a very nice thread but i also want to add that they can also be wonderful birds...ive known all these birds except 1 since they were babies,they are all over 5yrs old 2 of them i havent spent any time with for about a yr(im Babysitting them)i love these birds,they are a hoot..i think you just have to realise also that the same play you did when they were young can mean different things when they are hormonal..anyways here is a web cam video of 5 adults

:eek:
 
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