Urgent Birds Sick for Months, Can't Figure Out What It Is (Have Been To Vet)

[Azellia]

Update on my one bird.

Took him to the emergency vet a few days ago-I wanted to make sure his leg lameness wasn't caused by a fracture or break.

Vet said he can't curl his toes, but he can move the leg, and he still has feeling in both the toes and leg. Doesn't appear to be in pain.

No fractures, no breaks. Nothing internal pressing on the nerves in that area. Interestingly, he has some bruising on the upper portion of one leg... but it's the leg that's still working. ??? His leg started off as having flaccid paralysis (the toes were stuck open and totally limp), but yesterday, his toes clenched up. Not sure if that's just the muscles naturally flexing into a more comfortable position, or a sign he's getting some movement back.

This could be a sprain that caused some nerve damage, in which case he may recover in a few days or weeks depending on the severity. Or it could be neurological, and there's no telling whether he'll regain movement or not. OR it could be infection... shortly after returning from the vet, he chewed one of his toenails clean off (took him back after this happened, he should be okay), and he's been improving all around since then. So was something up with that one particular toe?

The good news is that he's still able to get around pretty well despite his lame leg. A bit wobbly upon landing but stabilizes himself on perches very quickly. No falls so far.

Also in brighter news, got his leg band off, which was bothering him. And he started on Celebrex, has had two doses so far.

Overall, he's been doing better since he started the doxy for the pseudomonas infection. Wing tremors are steadily going away. Haven't seen any for a few days. He's more active and vocal. Eating good, drinking good, weight is stable. Vet said that besides the leg issue, he looks awesome.

So I suppose the plan of action for now is to just continue medicating and see where that takes us. Pseudomonas treatment will take 3 weeks total since it's a stubborn bacteria. Celebrex should start kicking in pretty soon. Hopefully we can finally kick the pseudomonas... and if little dude could at least regain some movement in his toes, that
would be good.

 

[Pixiebeak]

We did consider ASM for a while! But they've been through 5 rounds of Ivermectin and 5 of SCATT. I feel like that should realistically be enough to obliterate any mites. It's still a possibility, I just think it's a low likelihood now.

If the Flucanazole eases the rest of their sneezes and coughing then this is probably just pseudomonas. Otherwise, I don't know.

It is difficult to eliminate air sac mites for good , didn't they do well post treatment for that fir a while?

Yeast , sure , your birds Been on a lot of different meds.

Also AGY is a real possibility and that also might never be eliminated completely. Amphotericin B is the only treatment for that .

You need to go through communicable diseases, and AGY and read up , something is affecting your whole flock , while some of your individuals are able to manage it a little better they all have symptoms . I do not at all believe it is an environmental toxin or issue

 

[Pixiebeak]

While it is not mentioned here as a symptom,my board certified in both avian medicine and zoo medicine frequently sees sneezing in budgies as a symptom of AGY, maybe because regurge Doesn't come out of mouth but irritates , I will ask her at some point. She has also mentioned the frustration in testing to confirm

Avian gastric yeast (macrorhabdosis) in cockatiel, budgerigar and grey parrot: a focus on the clinical signs, molecular detection and phylogenetic evaluation

Macrorhabdus ornithogaster is a microorganism that causes nonspecific and general clinical symptoms and to this day, diagnosis and also treatment have been yet hard. The present study was conducted to survey the prevalence of macrorhabdosis and to characterize ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

.

 

[Azellia]

They're still on SCATT right now, this dose wears off in a few days. If their sneezing gets worse again once it wears off, it's something to look at again.

They did do better on anti-parastitics initially-but they were on a cocktail of other drugs at the same time when we first started them on Ivermectin/SCATT, including Baytril, which the pseudomonas is susceptible to. It's been less effective since they've been off the rest of that cocktail.

We did consider AGY & tested for it for my sickest bird. Test came back negative, but I know AGY can be tricky to diagnose. Their symptoms just don't match up very well with the typical AGY symptoms-they're are all respiratory and neurological, not really any persistant GI stuff. Not to say it's not a possibility-I can bring it up again to their vet.

I've been paranoid about asper from the beginning. I just don't know how we would test for asper for them. No vet will do a titer because they're too small, and their X-rays, blood work, cultures, etc. all consistently come back clear. I will say they seem to show more improvement on antibiotics than they do antifungals, though that doesn't mean a ton.

I'm going to be honest, after thinking about it at the vet, I'm a little curious about avian chlamydia again-their symptoms match up pretty well. They're doing well on doxy-sneezing already almost totally gone, and they still have a while to go on it for the pseudomonas. They've been on it a few times, but never long enough to clear AC. Chlamydia can occasionally cause neuro signs... including tremors and leg paralysis/paresis... as well as respiratory issues. Their urine has been coming back green lately despite X-rays and blood work showing normal liver/kidney health. If their symptoms don't totally cease once the pseudomonas treatment concludes, I was thinking about asking the vet if we should extend it a little longer.

Still, with AC I would expect at least something to look odd on the bloodwork or X-rays. It's odd that those just consistently show them as healthy.

 

[Azellia]

Oh, interesting, I didn't know about AGY causing sneezing!

 

[Pixiebeak]

I'm not finding sneezing listed , it could be I remember my conversation wrong with my vet , I will find st out some points and share .
On AC I think my Budgies ended up needing a Hugh dose and longer treatment time than the rest of my parrots ..

Avian Gastric Yeast?

I have a single budgie. He's around five, maybe six months old. I got him really young, from a chain pet store. A while ago, I can't remember exactly, he started vomiting. I heard it around 12 at night, and thought he was just messing around in his seed dish. The next morning, I uncovered him...

forums.avianavenue.com

Well darn didn't easily find Budgies dose

Table:Doxycycline Dosages for Avian Chlamydiosis-Merck Veterinary Manual

www.merckvetmanual.com

Bacterial Diseases of Pet Birds - Exotic and Laboratory Animals - Merck Veterinary Manual

Learn about the veterinary topic of Bacterial Diseases of Pet Birds. Find specific details on this topic and related topics from the Merck Vet Manual.

www.merckvetmanual.com

 

[Azellia]

The fact the doxy alone is doing a really good job, and that they've had symptom reduction on Baytril in the past, does make me think potential AC.

They have a week and a half left on the doxy for pseudomonas; if their symptoms clear up with that + the Fluconazole for the yeast, then it could just be that, and my one bird has clinical ABV.

But pseudomonas is a rare infection in birds that aren't already immunocompromised in some way (ABV causes immunosuppression, but I don't know if all 4 birds have it). So wouldn't surprise me if it's just a secondary infection.

If symptoms persist after the pseudomonas treatment period is over, AC is high on my suspect list and it may be worth continuing treatment for at least another 3 weeks.

They were tested for AC in the past (and were negative), but that test was a fecal swab which is notoriously unreliable for diagnosing this condition. And it's possible the previous short doxy doses they were on + the occasional Baytril doses have helped control it to an extent and keep it chronic.

 

[Pixiebeak]

Ok,my memory failed me , my veterinarian has not seen associated sneezing with gastric yeast as a primary symptom. Has seen with secondary or concurrent infection

 

[Pixiebeak]

Oh, interesting, I didn't know about AGY causing sneezing!

My bad , not seen as a primary symptom