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Akira - day six

Imogena

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So, some of you already know that I have two African Greys now. Two years old TAG - Edgar, and four months old CAG - Akira. They are both amazing. Akira came to me last sunday morning, so she lives with me less than a week.
The interesting thing was that Edgar showed no signs of aggresion towards Akira when she came. He was curious. He wanted to watch her. She was and still is a little wary of him.
She, which is quite obvious, was a little wary of me as well. Till yesterday. Yesterday something clicked. I don't know what, why, but suddenly Akira started to respond to trainig. Before she was responding but very hesitantly. She would step up on my hand, but before she did it, she would give it a lot of thought. From yesterday she steps up with the same certainty as Edgar does. She does targeting like a pro, and she flies to me when I call her. I'm amazed, really, how quickly it went.
Edgar became a super polite bird. I mean, he always is more or less polite, and quite gentle with his beak now, after long training of controlling the beak. But during this week he was an epitome of politeness. I ask Edgar, please step up, Edgar steps up immediately. I ask come, Edgar flies to me without any though. I ask touch (for targeting), he does. I think, he was a little nervous and decided that following known set of rules will keep him safe. Yesterday and today he is more himself. Still very nice bird, but not so polite. It was becoming a little scarry to tell you the truth. I thing he is getting used to new situation now so he presents his old normal self.
The very funny thing is that Akira loves peanuts. Edgar doesn't. But now I offer to him the same foods as I give to Akira, even though I know that most probably he will throw it away. So I offered a peanut in the shell. She obviously took it and was happy. Edgar also took it. She peeled off the shell and ate the nuts. Edgar peeled off the shell and threw away the nuts. And this is the way they are having peanuts now. Every day.
Another funny thing happened today, during Akira's training session. Edgar was training first, then he went to his cage and it was Akira's turn. We were training "step up". After each step up, I asked Akira to sit on the chair, which she did. So "step up", "sit", "step up", "sit". And suddenly Edgar started repeating from his cage: "sit". He waited when Akira stepped up and when it was time to sit he gave the command with me.
I train with Edgar two kinds of training now. First one is the basic (step up, come, and targeting), so Akira can watch it. And I think it works. Every day Akira watches how Edgar is doing step up and targeting, how i praize him and reward him and I thing it makes easier for Akira to get the concept. The second kind of training with Edgar is his usual training session if he wants it. I don't know if it is possible or not, but I think Edgar wants to show off in front of Akira, because he is looking if she watches.
They of course live in separate cages and most probably it will stay this way. I didn't take them outsite together, still too early, I think, so they go out separately.
The only problem I have now is that Edgar loves landing on Akira's cage. Akira on the other side... well... she doesn't love it at all. She goes all puffy and gets angry at Edgar. It is the same the other way around. Akira lands on Edgar's cage and he gets angry. I put thick blankets on the tops of both cages and for Akira it is enough but Edgar tries to look through the side bars. So I'm watching Edgar like a hawk to prevent disaster.
I think if I let them out together the problem with cages would solve itself. If Edgar lands on Akira's cage when they both are out, Akira would explain to him why he should't do it. I don't believe they would fight. But for now I don't feel comfortable with letting them out together just yet.
If any of you has any advice how should I procede, please, oh please share it with me. I will be very grateful.
 

Shezbug

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Clueless

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With my two amazons. It was similar.

I'd offer food to one, he'd decline. I'd turn to face the other and when I turned back, the first one would take it.

They're truly like kids.
 

Imogena

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Exactly like Kids. Edgar now is deeply offended with me because I would't let him walk on Akira's cage. Doesn't matter Akira wants to murder him for touching her territory. He wants it I forbid it so I'm the bad one. Ehhhh life.
 

Snowghost

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It is not recommended to offer peanuts on a daily basis. They can cause Aflatoxin., damage to the liver. Peanuts can get fugal growth and cause Asperillus. I have researched it and I find pros and cons of feeding peanuts. I believe Hawk lost a parrot to Asperillus. I fed my White Front Amazon human grade peanuts for 25 years, two a day. I never had in issue. I believe Greys are more susceptible to healthy problems from peanuts.

My Amazon lived with a Cockatiel and two Love Birds, she never landed on the Love Birds cages, but she would torment the Tiel. She didn't like her on top of her cage, the cage is their home.

I don't have enough experience to offer any advice. I would keep doing what you're doing, let them out at separate times. I don't know if they will become buddies or not. Clueless had two Amazons.
 

Imogena

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It is not recommended to offer peanuts on a daily basis. They can cause Aflatoxin., damage to the liver. Peanuts can get fugal growth and cause Asperillus. I have researched it and I find pros and cons of feeding peanuts. I believe Hawk lost a parrot to Asperillus. I fed my White Front Amazon human grade peanuts for 25 years, two a day. I never had in issue. I believe Greys are more susceptible to healthy problems from peanuts.
Thank you very much for this information. I will stop peanuts. Is it ok to offer them from time to time or os it better not to offer them at all?
 

Snowghost

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I give one to Paco on occasion, I feed him Higgins Safflower Gold, it has no sunflower seeds in it, (another no, no I found out) it does have peanuts in it, but I don't feed them to Paco, I feed the squirrels human grade peanuts and he gets one of them. I know we are to feed our parrots a healthy diet. My White Front Amazon was wild caught. She came to me on a seed diet, with sunflower seeds. She wouldn't eat fruits and veggies, and her treat was 2 peanuts a day. I had to help her cross the rainbow bridge, she was with me for 25 years. I still beat myself up for my lack of getting her on a better diet. I don't even like posting this on here, but maybe it will ease some of my anxiety over this. The vet reassured me that Bugsy was a happy bird and I took great care of her. He said we don't know how old she was, she could have been 30 or older. I am going to reach out to two other CAG owners and see if they feed their birds any peanuts at all. Like I said I have read many sites on the pro's and con's of feeding peanuts. I'm not an expert. Your thoughts on this @BertAllen and @Hawk12237, not sure if Hawk will reply I tried to search for him, and his profile is not available. Both have a wealth of experience with Greys.
 

Snowghost

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@Imogena, you are more then welcome. I have only had Paco for a year and 2 months. We have worked hard to get where we are. I do envy people that have young birds and are tame. My Amazon was neglected and during the 25 years she was my best buddy. If I had not gotten Paco, I know that he would not have survived in the environment he was currently living in. He has gained weight, will step up with no biting and he is mr chatter. I love him to pieces. Greys are an amazing animal. I want to see more pics of Akira! Keep posting!
 

BertAllen

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I don't feed Tinker peanuts in the shell. But having said that I also do not remove peanuts that are not in a shell but are included in some foods.
Does that make any sense?
 

Snowghost

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Yes it does. I might try peanut pieces for training Paco. He was awesome the other day, stepped up on my arm without second thought and then he walked over and sat my friends arm and was a perfect gentleman. He is visiting the floor more, so I feel that he is getting more comfortable. Its time to step up my game and start teaching him things. I think it will bring us closer too.
 

Imogena

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@Imogena, you are more then welcome. I have only had Paco for a year and 2 months. We have worked hard to get where we are. I do envy people that have young birds and are tame. My Amazon was neglected and during the 25 years she was my best buddy. If I had not gotten Paco, I know that he would not have survived in the environment he was currently living in. He has gained weight, will step up with no biting and he is mr chatter. I love him to pieces. Greys are an amazing animal. I want to see more pics of Akira! Keep posting!
You saved his life. I'm sure you and Paco will get to first an understanding and then to love. I really admire you. It is not that hard to rise already tamed young bird. But it is a real challenge to get an older bird to cooperate. Especially a bird with harsh history. Please be proud of yourself. I am proud of you. You have done a lot of progress with Paco.
 

Imogena

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I don't feed Tinker peanuts in the shell. But having said that I also do not remove peanuts that are not in a shell but are included in some foods.
Does that make any sense?
It does. You can see how the peanut looks like and know whether it is a good one or a bad one.
 

Imogena

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Yes it does. I might try peanut pieces for training Paco. He was awesome the other day, stepped up on my arm without second thought and then he walked over and sat my friends arm and was a perfect gentleman. He is visiting the floor more, so I feel that he is getting more comfortable. Its time to step up my game and start teaching him things. I think it will bring us closer too.
Paco is trusting you more and more.
I strongly believe in training. Edgar loves it Akira likes it already. I think they treat it as a playing. Plus rewards and praizes as a bonus. It really helps to build a relationship. I use sunflower seeds and home baked cakes for Edgar. They are quite healthy but I use them as a very special reward. Akira doesn't like my cakes but she likes sunflower. I give them half of the seed each time.
 

Snowghost

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I searched all over this county to find salt less sunflower seeds and finally found some. They were not in the shell. Paco will not touch them, so now they are fed to the wild birds. I really don't know where to begin training with Paco, I'm open for suggestions. I can't use any type of stick, he is afraid of it. I can't get him to even play with a new toy no matter how long it is near his cage.

I know he can learn. When I first brought him home, I cleaned his cage, trying to get him into my Amazon's old one was quit a feat. The first thing to go was the water bottle. This woman had a water bottle hanging outside of his cage that he used to drink from, it was disgusting, filled with dark brown water.

I replaced that and his old white ceramic seed bowl with stainless steel ones. He makes this cute chirp every time he drinks his water. Of course I had to replace it with a lock in type bowl since the little stinker figure out how to throw the bowl. Its interesting that he does not toss his treat bowl. Seed bowl had to be changed to a locking bowl as well.

Since he was never cleaned on a regular basis, getting my hands inside his cage was a challenge, and I had to break him of the habit of slamming my head with his beak, (I posted that problem here)

Long story short, (I know to late for that now) I taught him to scootch over when I reached my hand in to get the bowls. First I gave him a treat, avi cake or small cracker (can't bite with a mouth full) Much surprise we worked up to "scootch over" without a treat.

My question, what else can I teach him?

He will only eat his morning and afternoon meals from my hand, it is warm broccoli with carrots, peas, string beans. Once in a while he will eat sweet potato, cauliflower rice, or oat meal.

It would be hard to use these warm veggies as a reward. @Imogena how do you make your cakes?
 

Imogena

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I used the wrong name. I make cookies not cakes. I mix flour some olive Oil an egg and a little bit of honey. I cannot give you exact recepee because I do it by feeling. The mixture shuld be quite soft but hard enough not to stick to your hand. If it sticks to your hand add more flour. Then I bake it for 12 minutes in 220 Celsjus degrees. They should be light brown.
 

Snowghost

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Greys are prone to atherosclerosis and its not recommended to feed them eggs. I did give Paco a hard boiled egg once a week, after I found out its not good for their arteries I stopped. Gosh I feel like I'm always pointing out bad things for the birds. I feel that knowledge is power.
 

Imogena

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Knowledge is the power. But it is one koegg in twenty cookies. And one cookie lasts at least few days because I give only crumbs and quite seldom. So I think it is ok. The cookies are round and have like 2.5 cm diameter
 

Snowghost

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Well I had to put my Amazon down due to crystals on her kidneys and severe gout. I know with her seed diet it didn't help her health. I am super cautious with Paco's diet cause of it. I intend on getting his blood word done and I will ask the vet. Again, everyone has different opinions on Peanuts, eggs and sunflower seeds. Some folks only feed a pellet diet.
 

Imogena

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Well I had to put my Amazon down due to crystals on her kidneys and severe gout. I know with her seed diet it didn't help her health. I am super cautious with Paco's diet cause of it. I intend on getting his blood word done and I will ask the vet. Again, everyone has different opinions on Peanuts, eggs and sunflower seeds. Some folks only feed a pellet diet.
In my opinion if the bird is generally healthy some not so healthy treats will not harm him/her. Of course if they are given in moderate amount. I know of course that if bird lives on sunflower seeds it will destroy bird's health. But sunflower given from time to time as a treat, or even daily as a treat during the training (half of the seed for African Grey is not that much) will not harm him.
 
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