A biter: WWYD?

[TheBirds]

So the opportunity has come up to potentially take on a young male Meyers. However! It sounds like he has bitten his current owner quite hard in the past, and now she's afraid of him. Understandably so! While I can read the body language of my current birds just fine (mostly because they see hands and want to GTFO there, lol), I wonder if I'm prepared to risk taking in a known biter.

Because our current four birds are so timid, this next (last) bird I really wanted to add to our household was something that wouldn't bat an eye at being handled. This Meyers lives a 3 hr roundtrip away, and I've been offered the opportunity to go meet him before making any kind of decision which is very good of his current owner. How much of this behaviour can be attributed to him as a bird vs. his environment or perhaps an unfortunate misunderstanding once-upon-a-time that has precipitated all of this? Could this just be hormones (he's 2) and something that will likely pass?

My concern is we get this bird and it's another case of "Oh, we can't handle this one either" and my husband divorces me (not actually) because I won't quit acquiring birds in pursuit of something that I can pick up safely! I'm not looking for a Velcro bird that sits on me all the time by any means, but something I can handle without much worry.

What are everyone's thoughts? What would you do and why?

 

[Dartman]

You have to decide if you're willing to put the time and effort it will take to bring a angry used bird around. He'll probably get some bites in too before he realizes you're actually safe, trustworthy, and a friend, then maybe he'll come around right away if you're lucky and he just wasn't happy with who he was with.
It took Lurch 5 years to mostly decide I was a trustworthy friend but he did get there and all the bites were worth it to see him truly happy around me.
I just stepped back and took the long term approach and didn't push him or I better be fast at first. He was a Maxi Pionus so bigger and worse bites.

 

[TheBirds]

I've asked as many questions as I can think of (e.g. cage set-up, under what circumstances the bites happened and where he actually bit her) and I'm still undecided. I could probably work with him and am not opposed to bringing in the help of a behavioural specialist, but is it too much?

Sounds like he really chomped on her the worst when he was on her person (shoulder/back of neck) which isn't something I really seek out in a parrot anyway (tbh it would make me nervous, I guess I have trust issues!). So perhaps right there, we've eliminated half the problem...?

 

[Dartman]

I got bit in the neck a lot by Lurch at first so he lost shoulder privileges till we came to a understanding with each other. I started being able to read him better, got to know his triggers, and he learned biting didn't get him what he wanted.
I took a few chances as he started to trust me and I learned what he was trying to ask for, he learned if he waited and didn't lash out I would let him do what he wanted so we both won. He didn't know how ask nicely so biting was the typical parrots solution.

 

[TikiMyn]

I think you could difineltely work with him, but it may not be easy. No shoulders is a good start, but some birds get angry when you deny them something, so I would really start training with positive reinforcement on basic behaviors. I would focus on short positive interactions and go from what the bird tells you it is comfortable with.

I am not aware what the story with your other birds is, but have your tried training them? Often even the flightiest birds can learn to accept millet, fly to you to eat etc.

 

[Emma&pico]

It’s so hard to know or tell you I would go look at him but don’t come home with him just because you feel sorry for him if your heart not in it or have bouts after meeting him

I had a biter (attacker probably more better ) but with my hubby or any male for that matter she was like butter and would actually tolerate other females but me nope I don’t know what I did if anything
She now in avariy with other birds but the owner (male) says he can do in and she straight on his shoulder

I think sometimes like us they just don’t like certain things or certain people
So as @Dartman said you may get him and he will be lovely straight away or he may take time to settle and you both work out a relationship or he maybe always a biter and it’s whether you can cope with those chances

I would ask if she owned other parrots before ? And go see him keep us updated please

 

[sunnysmom]

What other kinds of birds do you have? I think any bird can be worked with but it really depends on the amount of time you have and set up. I have a goffin and cockatiels. He is never allowed out with them. I don't think he would hurt them on purpose but his energy level is super high and he gets wound up easily. He got rehomed for biting previously. He did bite my boyfriend pretty badly more than once. It took a lot of effort on my part to manage the situation. He does great now. And no longer bites but it was rough going for awhile. I think it's worth the time and effort because if the biting isn't addressed birds get rehomed again and again but it's not something that's for everyone. Although in this case if shoulders are the problem, no shoulders is an easy fix.

 

[Clueless]

I'm always amazed at folks that allow birds on shoulders. Then again, we had NO bird experience when we adopted the amazons. Secret tore hunks out of my hand very early in our relationship and frankly, I decided immediately that type of "knife" (beak) had no business near my head.

For what it's worth, we were told Secret was a good tame bird and MC was mean. MC only bit me twice in all the years we had him and it was more like a warning bite at that.

Each bird has its own personality. It takes TIME for that personality to surface so there WILL be a honeymoon period ---- beware of that.

 

[TheBirds]

Thanks everyone for weighing in, it's been really helpful to read about your personal experiences and thoughts. Our current birds, if I haven't said this already (?), were all rehomes as well. They were bought off of Kijiji and all were misrepresented. All three are very fearful of hands. None of them will even come to take millet from the side of the cage! If I try and move my hands near the Linnies at all, they panic and rush off to the far end. The Rosella is a little braver, but still won't take anything from me even if I slowly bring it up to the bars of the cage. Handling any of them is out of the question, they all fly into a panic. And the Linnies don't even know how to play with toys, they just sit there next to each other all day long .. just, looking. They're even afraid of millet. It's very sad. I'm working with them every day, trying to approach with tasty treats, but it's going to be a long road because they won't even come close enough to begin building trust.

This bird's current owner (we're talking about the Meyers again) has certainly done her best, he's in a lovely cage with a big play gym and is on a diet other than seeds. She's spent time training him a variety of different tricks. She does have other birds that she has no problems with (also Linnies, funnily enough). And it sounds like he has a lot of positive qualities too, which I don't want the biting to totally overshadow. And I agree @sunnysmom - if the problem is due to being on shoulders (or on the body), that IS an easy fix.

If I'm not allowing him on my person, and I use something to protect my hands/finger (not a glove, but something less obtrusive), what are the other risks, if any? Worst case, he's a hands-off bird in that I can only handle him with protection (tea towel over my hand or ???) and best case, we work through this and I can eventually trust him to not bite. Theoretically any handling will be quite limited anyway, to moving him to and from his cage (not in, as he's cage aggressive). Agree, disagree?

Sorry, just thinking this through out "loud"! I've decided to go and see him for myself tomorrow, so stay tuned as I hope to have additional information.

 

[Emma&pico]

Thanks everyone for weighing in, it's been really helpful to read about your personal experiences and thoughts. Our current birds, if I haven't said this already (?), were all rehomes as well. They were bought off of Kijiji and all were misrepresented. All three are very fearful of hands. None of them will even come to take millet from the side of the cage! If I try and move my hands near the Linnies at all, they panic and rush off to the far end. The Rosella is a little braver, but still won't take anything from me even if I slowly bring it up to the bars of the cage. Handling any of them is out of the question, they all fly into a panic. And the Linnies don't even know how to play with toys, they just sit there next to each other all day long .. just, looking. They're even afraid of millet. It's very sad. I'm working with them every day, trying to approach with tasty treats, but it's going to be a long road because they won't even come close enough to begin building trust.

This bird's current owner (we're talking about the Meyers again) has certainly done her best, he's in a lovely cage with a big play gym and is on a diet other than seeds. She's spent time training him a variety of different tricks. She does have other birds that she has no problems with (also Linnies, funnily enough). And it sounds like he has a lot of positive qualities too, which I don't want the biting to totally overshadow. And I agree @sunnysmom - if the problem is due to being on shoulders (or on the body), that IS an easy fix.

If I'm not allowing him on my person, and I use something to protect my hands/finger (not a glove, but something less obtrusive), what are the other risks, if any? Worst case, he's a hands-off bird in that I can only handle him with protection (tea towel over my hand or ???) and best case, we work through this and I can eventually trust him to not bite. Theoretically any handling will be quite limited anyway, to moving him to and from his cage (not in, as he's cage aggressive). Agree, disagree?

Sorry, just thinking this through out "loud"! I've decided to go and see him for myself tomorrow, so stay tuned as I hope to have additional information.

So glad your doing to see him keep us updated

 

[sunnysmom]

Thanks everyone for weighing in, it's been really helpful to read about your personal experiences and thoughts. Our current birds, if I haven't said this already (?), were all rehomes as well. They were bought off of Kijiji and all were misrepresented. All three are very fearful of hands. None of them will even come to take millet from the side of the cage! If I try and move my hands near the Linnies at all, they panic and rush off to the far end. The Rosella is a little braver, but still won't take anything from me even if I slowly bring it up to the bars of the cage. Handling any of them is out of the question, they all fly into a panic. And the Linnies don't even know how to play with toys, they just sit there next to each other all day long .. just, looking. They're even afraid of millet. It's very sad. I'm working with them every day, trying to approach with tasty treats, but it's going to be a long road because they won't even come close enough to begin building trust.

This bird's current owner (we're talking about the Meyers again) has certainly done her best, he's in a lovely cage with a big play gym and is on a diet other than seeds. She's spent time training him a variety of different tricks. She does have other birds that she has no problems with (also Linnies, funnily enough). And it sounds like he has a lot of positive qualities too, which I don't want the biting to totally overshadow. And I agree @sunnysmom - if the problem is due to being on shoulders (or on the body), that IS an easy fix.

If I'm not allowing him on my person, and I use something to protect my hands/finger (not a glove, but something less obtrusive), what are the other risks, if any? Worst case, he's a hands-off bird in that I can only handle him with protection (tea towel over my hand or ???) and best case, we work through this and I can eventually trust him to not bite. Theoretically any handling will be quite limited anyway, to moving him to and from his cage (not in, as he's cage aggressive). Agree, disagree?

Sorry, just thinking this through out "loud"! I've decided to go and see him for myself tomorrow, so stay tuned as I hope to have additional information.

You can teach him to step up on a perch. Target training is great for any bird. Can use it to teach him to go into a carrier etc. A lot can be done if actually having him on hands is an issue.

 

[Aestatis]

Props to you for considering it! While Meyer's aren't the biggest parrots... that beak...

Sounds like you got the right idea of banning the shoulder. I'm not sure if a towel will make him trust hands more, but if you need to grab him for whatever reason then there's no shame in it. I agree that if the purpose is to move him around then getting him to go on a perch would be the best. Plus, he probably gets better grip than on a towel and you don't have to worry about how much you might feel him through that towel if he goes for you.

One thing you might want to consider is that if this bird will satisfy the goals you have. You are looking for a bird that can "be handled by anyone", but is a bird that bites hard really one that fits that criteria? And, since the drive is so long it can be tempting to "make it work" so you don't feel you drove all that way for nothing. Not saying you shouldn't get this bird, or that you wouldn't be able to walk away - just something to consider. If nothing else, you might find the experience working with him so rewarding that it wouldn't be a disappointment if he wasn't that handleable.

 

[TheBirds]

Thanks everyone for the input, I was able to feel like I was going into this with some degree of thought instead of letting my heart rule. I did go and see him today (it ended up being a 4 hour roundtrip, made worse by the fact that I got turned around on the highway system on the way home and ended up heading back the way I came, in rush hour traffic no less!).

His owner was lovely, and had him out on a play gym ready to meet me. I'd brought along some millet thinking if his beak is busy, I should be good! Nope, he bit me while I was handing him the millet In retrospect, he didn't bite to draw blood (there wasn't a mark left behind). But for a first impression, it just left me feeling disappointed and a bit exasperated! As I said to his current owner, I don't think I'd be the right home for him because I'm not sure how I could do anything differently than you. And she ultimately decided to keep him.

One thing you might want to consider is that if this bird will satisfy the goals you have. You are looking for a bird that can "be handled by anyone", but is a bird that bites hard really one that fits that criteria? And, since the drive is so long it can be tempting to "make it work" so you don't feel you drove all that way for nothing. Not saying you shouldn't get this bird, or that you wouldn't be able to walk away - just something to consider. If nothing else, you might find the experience working with him so rewarding that it wouldn't be a disappointment if he wasn't that handleable.

These are such great points. A) the goals .. and you're correct, I did NOT get the feeling that this Meyers would ever be able to safely be handed by just anyone. At the end of the day, I'm looking for a chill bird. We have enough rehomes with issues under this roof already! And B) yes it would have been tempting to just say "okay" to not have had a wasted trip!

On the plus side, I was able to hit a ton of (okay, 3) parrot-centric stores on the way home that I might not otherwise trek out to. And at the third store, I found someone I couldn't leave behind:



... a much better fit for what I was hoping to find!

 

[Respect]

On the plus side, I was able to hit a ton of (okay, 3) parrot-centric stores on the way home that I might not otherwise trek out to. And at the third store, I found someone I couldn't leave behind:



... a much better fit for what I was hoping to find!

 

[Mizzely]

Sorry it didn't go the way you wanted! Sounds like it just wasn't the right fit.

My worst bites have been from a Meyers. And with the little birds, I know my Jardine's can't be out with them because he's pretty territorial about his area. I imagine Meyers could respond similarly.

 

[Aestatis]

On the plus side, I was able to hit a ton of (okay, 3) parrot-centric stores on the way home that I might not otherwise trek out to. And at the third store, I found someone I couldn't leave behind:



... a much better fit for what I was hoping to find!

How exciting! Can't wait to see all the details! Sounds like it all worked out for the best if the original owner decided to keep the Meyers and you found a friend along the way! In my book, you had a road trip day and a fun origin story for the new bird.

 

[Michael]

Sorry it didn't go the way you wanted! Sounds like it just wasn't the right fit.

My worst bites have been from a Meyers. And with the little birds, I know my Jardine's can't be out with them because he's pretty territorial about his area. I imagine Meyers could respond similarly.

I agree with this. My Meyer’s has taken large chunks out of my arm with scars only now starting to heal after 10 months. It’s been a very difficult road.

 

[TheBirds]

I agree with this. My Meyer’s has taken large chunks out of my arm with scars only now starting to heal after 10 months. It’s been a very difficult road.

I'm so sorry to hear this Whether it's true or not, I personally find this species just gives off more "wild" vibes vs. some other captive-bred/kept parrots.

 

[Michael]

I'm so sorry to hear this Whether it's true or not, I personally find this species just gives off more "wild" vibes vs. some other captive-bred/kept parrots.

Could be true—he gives me velociraptor vibes on the daily - the pinning orange eyes and unrestrained aggression and bravery. I’m in my own Jurassic Park adventure every day

 

[TheBirds]

Could be true—he gives me velociraptor vibes on the daily - the pinning orange eyes and unrestrained aggression and bravery. I’m in my own Jurassic Park adventure every day

I appreciate the sense of humour you're keeping about the situation; that visual definitely brought a smirk to my face