Pictures When to recognise splayed legs

[Sienna]

Hi all!

I have started breeding budgies (just one set of birds) and have an experienced male and a young female. She has being doing a good job and their crops are both very full, and the babies are healthy. They have feathers and both have eyes open. The older one is 17 days old, younger one is about 10 days old. Male is still looking after her. She has started to leave the nest but usually goes back in when I enter the aviary.

(You can see mum doesn't do a fantastic job of cleaning out the box. The box she chose is the only one I can't get into, so I haven't been able to help.)

Only thing is both have their legs splayed out under them. There is a dip in the bottom of the box but they haven't settled themselves in it. Additionally, the mother got rid of all of the bedding. I have uploaded the images - at what age should I be concerned about their legs being splayed? I am aware of the treatment of splayed legs, but struggled to find when needs to be treated (I was thinking it might be something they stop doing when they get a bit bigger as well (like they get more strength so sit up properly))

 

[Birdbabe]

Bump!

 

[iamwhoiam]

I read somewhere that the issue should be dealt with early at about 2-3 weeks of age and if possible before 3 weeks. You may want to contact a vet and have him/her check the budgies.

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

Parrot parents do not clean the interior of the nest box. The parents will not defecate in the nest box and wait until they leave it to poop, but they don't clean out the babies' excrement. At the end of raising the babies, they often abandon the nest site and find a new one for the next clutch of eggs. Mother nature cleans the nests by use of insects and such and often the sites are clean enough for new use the following year. They did a study of this in Ecuador.

If both the babies honestly have splayed legs, you should not allow them to breed again. Poor babies. Have fun with the babies.

 

[expressmailtome]

Do you have anything in the box for the babies to get traction with, such as wood shavings?

 

[SandraK]

Parrot parents do not clean the interior of the nest box. The parents will not defecate in the nest box and wait until they leave it to poop, but they don't clean out the babies' excrement. At the end of raising the babies, they often abandon the nest site and find a new one for the next clutch of eggs. Mother nature cleans the nests by use of insects and such and often the sites are clean enough for new use the following year. They did a study of this in Ecuador.

If both the babies honestly have splayed legs, you should not allow them to breed again. Poor babies. Have fun with the babies.

If somebirdy is going to nest and I provide a nestbox I usually add some type of coconut or sisal material to the bottom of the box. I've noticed, however, that the gccs (for instance) will toss any type of bedding and I don't mean in a cleaning way. They'll pitch it before they've even laid eggs. I don't want to jinx anything but over the past 11 years there hasn't been a splay legged chick hatched though I adopted an adult splay legged adult Quaker.

 

[karen256]

Poor babies. But they are young enough to fully recover if you make leg braces for them. But you will most likely have to pull and handfeed them. The parents won't like seeing the braces on them and may try to remove them and accidentally hurt the babies in the process. It would be best to take them to a vet so they can help you with their legs, but you can't find a vet who can help with splayed legs, there are some sites with instructions on making the leg braces/supports to pull their legs into the correct position.
Again, you'll probably need to handfeed the babies, so you'll need formula, a makeshift brooder, heating pad, ect. If the parents are tame and used to coming out, you can let them out to visit the babies and help feed them, but leaving them in the nestbox unsupervised with the leg braces on is not a good idea.
If handfeeding is definitely not an option, you can try sneaking some bedding in - or anything bird-safe that offers good traction. And take the babies out a few times a day for a few minutes for 'physical therapy', moving their legs around gently and trying to help them rest with their legs under them as they should be. As soon as they are weaned, you can then try the leg bracers - but results won't be as good as if you started the leg braces earlier.

Splayed Leg Prevention And Treatment - Cute Little Birdies Aviary

 

[finchly]

I recently made a leg brace from a pipe cleaner. If you do it while they’re young it doesn’t take long to correct.

At the same time I placed a layer of Carefresh in the nest, although wood shavings are fine too.

I hope you can resolve the problem, as birds with splayed legs need a lot of tlc!

 

[SandraK]

I've seen foam used as a brace for a chick's legs.

 

[finchly]

I like the idea of foam, also a sponge would be good.

 

[Sienna]

So, update!

There's not much in the way of avian vets in my area, closest being almost 2 hours away. However, there is a bird shop and the owner has years and years experience with birds, and is currently hand rearing 25 (budgie) chicks. She advised me on taking the babies from the nest (as mum likes to pick off the splint). The older one is doing great, leg is still splayed but not too badly. If I hold him in a cupped hand the leg can go under and he tries to stand (3 weeks 2 days). The younger one has a bit more trouble (2 weeks 2 days), but at two weeks enough rehab should help her. They are also now on liquid calcium. Hand rearing might also give them a better chance when they're older. I was also advised to leave the splint on overnight, as one has lost all the feathers on her belly (younger one).

The mother will be allowed to breed again, but watched closely. She is a first time mother so I'm putting it down to her sitting on them too much. I'm putting 'pool rubber' (note: from Australia, no idea if it's the same thing elsewhere, but it's basically very grippy, non-toxic rubber) at the bottom to make sure they don't slide their legs out under them.

 

[Begone]

There's not much in the way of avian vets in my area, closest being almost 2 hours away.

The mother will be allowed to breed again,

Consider that, and that you have two defect babies at the moment you made wrong decision.
You only breed if you can give your birds what they need and you only breed with healthy parents.

 

[karen256]

Sounds like you are doing the best you can.. if you don't have experience handfeeding, though, you should take the babies to the pet store owner who is experienced in handfeeding budgies. They're just so small and feed aggressively, they aren't the easiest to handfeed.
Splayed legs are a common problem in budgies (luckily relatively easy to correct), and it's because in the wild they constantly reuse nest sites. So they have a strong instinct to clean the nest out before using it - and that means tossing out bedding. It means you need to be extra careful with them so the babies don't develop splay leg. One option is to buy a piece of soft balsa wood (like what they sell in craft stores) and wedge it into the bottom of the box. Then they can move into a nice clean box free of loose debris and then can chew on the balsa in there to create their own bedding, which is basically what they'd do in the wild. The rubber sounds like a good idea, but the mother will probably try to chew and shred up anything in the nestbox, and could possibly ingest some rubber.
Some people will also simply wait until all the eggs are laid, then gradually sneak a little bedding into the box. Usually by that point, the parents are past the stage where they want to throw loose bedding out.

 

[Irishj9]

I made a leg brace for Thumper, when he developed splayed legs in the nestbox. A simple weak rubber band was sufficient to draw his legs together under him, with some pads so that the band didnt irritate his skin.

He recovered fully. But then I had pulled him from the nestbox and he was living in an incubator, so no parental interference with the leg band

 

[Anfsurfer]

I’m seriously speechless. Your comment about the parents not keeping the nest box tidy just blew me away. As someone else has said, the parents don’t “tidy” the box. The babies poop in their place when they’re young, and the parents keep arranging new nesting materials over it. The materials and the poop form a plaster like base around the babies for them to get traction and be able to stand. Your babies are lying splayed leg in their own wet feces, and you’re already talking about breeding again. It’s your responsibility to make sure the parents have a constant supply of nesting material to keep the babies from lying in their own poop.
This group is called “Breeders Boulevard” and I often get angry when people get ganged up on for talking about breeding. But in cases like this, you have no business breeding birds.
Sorry, but that’s my opinion.