screaming parrotlet

[Vera]

I have two parrotlets, living in a double cage with devider.
the man is a very quiet bird and the female is bird who loves attention and is noted (and loud)

Sometimes she walks around on the cage floor with puffed feathers, as if mad about something.
other times she sits on a perch and Ronnie climb down while screaming.

it is very anoying, they do this almost every night when we having dinner and/or are watching television.
maybe she responds to the sound of the television, but I think maybe it's a combination of the television, the fact that we have gone all day and the fact that we are eating. she wants attention and wants to be with us.

when we get home from work they both get a kiss and some quick attention and a extra snack, then we start cooking and have dinner, and then they are out of the cage for some time.
after dinner we take the devider out the cage so they can cuddle together.
when we take the devider out earlier, and she begins to sream, he will respond with (less louder sreaming) and they than chase each other around for some time.
when they are separated it does not respond to its behavior.

What can cause this and why? what can we do about it?
Here is a video, in this video she is not at here worst. usually she will sream like this constantly.
in the video she is wiping her beak at the cage bars, this is not something she normally does when showing this behavior. Most of the time it's just running around and screaming.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=369638450055625

 

[finchly]

I feel like she's being a normal parrotlet. A couple times a day they do this. Also they do it if they see something interesting.

My cockatiels screamed at or with the television-we had to move them away from it.

I'm going to tag someone who can help you. @Monica

 

[Monica]

You can try and teach her to play independently if it bothers you. Basically, give her foraging opportunities when you get home from work, and reward any behavior where she plays with toys or forage. This will probably interrupt your schedule for a little while, until she catches on that her playing and foraging is rewarded, especially when she's taught to do so for a longer period of time.


Otherwise, you could try figuring out ways to tire her out or keep her preoccupied in other ways (i.e. a bath?).

 

[Vera]

they always have foraging toys in the cage, gilled with their favorite pellets and/or some seeds.
they also have chewing toys and they can both play on their own and entertain themselves.
it is only in the evening when we are having dinner/watching tv, that she goes nuts about...?nothing i think?

 

[Monica]

So when she's playing with toys or foraging, even if it's for 1 second, go and reward. Reward that behavior constantly and frequently at first, then slowly reward for longer and longer periods of time. This can teach her to play independently more often.

Also, giving her new toys or foraging activities prior to commencing the evening activities. Something new and different to keep her busy with. Reward, reward, reward.


Rewarding can be physical attention, verbal attention or a treat.

 

[Vera]

maybe it is screaming for attention/out of cage time.
today we have tried the following thing:
when we got home from work we put the birds on our shoulder for maybe 5 minutes and talk to them and cuddle, then we put them on their playstand together, in the meantime we were making dinner. when dinner was ready we put them back in the cage (take the devider out) with some dry seeds.
they started eating immidiatly and she didn't scream at all..... after dinner they were taken out the cage again.

we will continue this routine for a couple days and see how it goes.

 

[finchly]

.
they started eating immidiatly and she didn't scream at all..... after dinner they were taken out the cage again.
we will continue this routine for a couple days and see how it goes.

Yay!

 

[metalstitcher]

Think that could be the answer they just want to be near their humans.

 

[Vera]

Well her behaviour continues. We don't know what to do about her behaviour. She screams when we are eating.we cannot always take her out of the cage when eating.would it help to cover the sied of the cage so that she can't see us eating?

We cannot place the huge cage anywhere else.last option is to put the birds back in 2 smaller cages at the other side of the room, the current cage per bird is 60x45x70cm.the smaller cages ar 45x38x60.

 

[Calpurnia]

I don't think you should cover her.... all that's doing is punishing her for an entirely natural behavior. Positive punishment is already an unpredictable way to modify a behavior. But add to that the fact she is not really doing anything wrong....

Birds are flock animals, and so if you are their flock they will often want to be doing what you're doing. This includes things like napping, playing, and eating. She is screaming because she feels "left out" and has probably learned before that screaming gets you to give her attention.

Now I know some people will not have this opinion but I think there are some ingrained behaviors of parrots that we should not try to eliminate, but instead just learn to work around them (to the benefit of both parties). Honestly, I would never expect my birds to just sit there nicely while I chow down in front of them. So we either eat in a "bird free" room OR plan their mealtimes around ours, so everyone can share in the eating time.

It sounds like you tried this already and it was working? Did you also try putting her high value treats into some sort of foraging activity so she has to spend time working for it?

Other than trying to avoid or include her during mealtimes I'm going to say that consistent reinforcement training is your best bet. Like others have outlined above, you want to try and reward desired behaviors.

 

[JLcribber]

She screams when we are eating.we cannot always take her out of the cage when eating

Why not?

This whole situation has to do with the house being quiet all day. Nothing to do but wait until you guys get home which is basically what most parrots do (toys or not). That is when all the action starts and so that is when the birds basically start their day. When you are home and the bird is locked up this is the behaviour you will see. That's not going to change.

 

[Vera]

Training desired behaviours.... How? How can i train her to be quiet during diner?
It worked to put them on the playstand during dinner,but they will not stay there. Sometimes we have people over for dinner and we cannot take them out.
Also i think she could/should learn to wait for us to give here the attention when we want to. I think birds can get used to a schedule, or am i wrong? Schedule:coming home from work, quick attention, cooking dinner, dinnertime (seed time for the birds) and then out of cage time with us.

I know she is happy to see us and we are happy to see the birds, but i think it would be possible to teach her to show her enthousiasm in a more positive way,but how?

 

[JLcribber]

Also i think she could/should learn to wait for us to give here the attention when we want to.

You have a lot to learn. Reality is it's the other way round.

Parrots have the patience of a mosquito (none). They don't bend to our will. All the bending and adapting falls on the humans.

Your environment is not working the way you've set it up. That has to change somewhat before anything else will.

 

[Calpurnia]

Training desired behaviours.... How? How can i train her to be quiet during diner?

Again, I don't think you can "train away" a bird's desire to be with it's flock during an important time like meal time. That simply goes against everything they have evolved to be. I think instead you need to learn how to work with this instinct to benefit both you and your bird. I also strongly agree with John that it is completely reasonable for her to want to spend time with you after being left alone all day. When I am home ALL DAY over the weekend my birds are happy to entertain themselves off to the side for a few hours. But when I come home after work it's basically non-stop birdie playtime and socialization until bedtime. If I'm cooking they are on a perch in the kitchen or playing with toys on the kitchen table. If I'm having dinner they get their before bedtime snack. Only AFTER bedtime do I get "my" time.

Is there a reason why she cannot have her main dinner (not just a light snack) at the same time you do? Or why she cannot be given a few foraging activities to occupy her time?

Also i think she could/should learn to wait for us to give here the attention when we want to. I think birds can get used to a schedule, or am i wrong? Schedule:coming home from work, quick attention, cooking dinner, dinnertime (seed time for the birds) and then out of cage time with us.

This is where you are going wrong. Like John has mentioned your "environment" is not conducive to a highly social animal like a parrot. You cannot "schedule" playtime and/or affection. These are animals that have evolved to be with their flock 24/7. TBH it sounds like you come home, give them a few minutes of attention, then go cook, eat, and watch TV for the rest of the night (definitely correct me if I'm wrong). Just because you let them out of their cages doesn't mean you are fulfilling their social needs. Especially if the female is more strongly bonded to people than the male, she cannot survive on "ambient attention" (like you just sitting in the same room) alone. Have you tried housing them together so that the female can get some more one-on-one socialization?

You act like it's an inconvenience that your bird is basically begging you to pay attention to it. And then when you end up getting frustrated you increase the chance of inadvertently reinforcing the behavior. Honestly, if you want an animal that is okay with prolonged isolation and being ignored most of the time, that is available for cuddling when YOU want it to happen, you should have gotten a very independent cat (or at least gotten a bonded p'let pair).

I'm sorry for being harsh I just think you need to wake up to the reality of parrot ownership. A bird can learn a schedule and can learn to express their desires in more enjoyable ways but to do so their BASIC needs need to be met first. It would be stupid to worry about putting a bandaid on a paper cut if your arm was broken. Right now, you are trying to fix a symptom (screaming) without addressing the real problem (a lack of quality socialization). You make think that all your bird needs is 1-2 hours of quality interactions a day but she is obviously telling you otherwise. You can't take the generic advice "a small bird should get 1-2 hours of socialization each day" or "a large bird needs 4-5 hours" at face value. Some birds are needier and some are more independent. If your female falls into the former category, it may mean you need to make a conscious effort to include her in more day-to-day activities. Showering, getting ready for work, dinner prep, TV time, etc.

 

[Heather F]

Well her behaviour continues. We don't know what to do about her behaviour. She screams when we are eating.we cannot always take her out of the cage when eating.would it help to cover the sied of the cage so that she can't see us eating?

We cannot place the huge cage anywhere else.last option is to put the birds back in 2 smaller cages at the other side of the room, the current cage per bird is 60x45x70cm.the smaller cages ar 45x38x60.

What do you mean by "the current cage per bird" size? Do you mean that is the size of the cage that two birds share? Or that the cage is twice that size and you divided the width in half to get the "size per bird"? 60cm by 45cm is about 18x24 inches (height is less relevant). Parrotlets are small but they are very active. If that's the size of a cage housing two birds then that might be part of the reason you are having problems.

 

[Tiel Feathers]

I'm sorry you little bird started this screaming behavior, but I think, like others have posted, your bird needs to be let out of the cage for a longer period of time when you get home. If I come home late, my birds get their needs met first. They always get to come out and have a snack and get some attention before bed. If dinners not ready, it means we eat late, after the birds go to bed, so I have time to meet their needs. If I'm not too late, and I have a meal made, the birds come out on the table with us while we eat. They actually come out while we eat for most of our meals every day. If I have people over for dinner, I usually give the birds their time before or after the meal, but it's only once in a great while, so no big deal. I think birds can get used to a schedule, but the schedule has to be a good one that gives the bird the time it needs.

 

[JLcribber]

Only AFTER bedtime do I get "my" time.

......and after taking the dog for a run.

 

[Vera]

Guys thanks for your honnest oppinions.
I really thought that it was possible to adjust the birds to our schedule.

What can be do to make things better for all of us? Would it help if i give them some attention before i leave for work ( during breakfast )? They are very sleepy in the morning so i mostly let them be.
We have a small table playtopfor them.maybe it would help to have a bigger playstand with foot so they havea lot of place to play and have their dinner when we are eating?problem is these playstands are all made for the larger birds.

The birds are in a cage with devider.the cage size (80x54x85 actually) are the cage size per bird.when we take the devider out the cage is 160cm wide.
They are sleeping together at night ,in the evening we take the devider out.this works well.
The female is very territorial and the male gets very stressed by her behaviour. They can be together for a couple of hours but living together all the time isn't working for them.we have tried this before.

Both birds were clipped. I am letting the feathers grow back so they can fly again. I think this can help them to (her) to let go off some extra energy and become more relaxed.

Any other advices?

 

[Calpurnia]

Thank you for being willing to change. I might try having her out a bit before work. It could help her neediness at the end of the day if it is not the first time she is hanging out with you that day. If you notice she is really sleepy and doesn't want to come out yet that's fine too. You'll just have to concentrate your effort on the after-work time. But like I said, don't feel like you have to sit there and give her one-on-one attention the entire time. My p'let will often eat breakfast in his cage, then come sit on my shoulder while I eat my own breakfast, pack up for work, change, primp, all that jazz. Half the time he is so sleepy he just sits burrowed up in my hair but that's fine, I know he appreciates being included in the "daily routine".

You could also try portioning your bird's diet into two halves, breakfast and dinner. Give her breakfast in the morning then leave that in the cage for the day. She will have something to graze on but may finish it early. By dinner time she will be hungry and ready to eat and less likely to gobble down her food in a minute then come looking to bother you. I'll admit, our birds are not out of their cages when we eat (unless we want little poopy feet in our spaghetti). But by dinner time they have finished most of their food for the day and so are happy to sit in their cages nearby and focus on their on their before-bed snacks.

You can also try making her work for her food so that it takes longer to eat. It can be as simple as putting her food or treats in a bowl full of toy parts, beads, and shredded paper.

At night I would try to make a point of spending that quality one-on-one time with the female as well as including her in more of your afterwork activities. If what you're cooking isn't super dangerous (like you have big boiling pots of water on the stove) let her come in and hang out with or around you. Julian is a great "garbage disposal" and has a lot of fun running around the kitchen table ripping up bell pepper cores or carrot tops while I'm prepping. Other times he is just in there on a perch, happy to watch what's going on around him. When I'm REALLY pooped after work sometimes we just lay on the couch and have an extra long scritch session. But I try to make an effort to regularly practice his tricks and commands as well. Teaching your own bird new behaviors can go a long way in increasing her physical and mental stimulation.

For example, you can begin teaching her flight recall and before you start dinner (so during your attention time right after you get home) have her do laps across the room. Especially if she is not a great flyer yet she is likely to get tuckered out pretty fast.

I really don't think you have to force yourself to go out of your way to give your bird more of the time she needs. I think you just have to get into the right mind-set. Don't think about attention as an activity to be scheduled. Just try to think of creative ways that you can better integrate your birds into your daily life. Even something as mundane as folding laundry can be made into a game or socialization time! Eventually she will get used to the more frequent and reliable socialization and be okay if you have to lock her up for a while. But it may take time. If the screaming has been going on for a while or was (unknowingly) strongly reinforced it may take a few weeks or more before you start seeing changes. But I know you guys can figure this out.

 

[LaSelva]

Now I know some people will not have this opinion...

...for many, the line is blurred between "learning" (and learned behaviors) and behavior as a whole - which has a huge biological component. The latter we would call "hard wired," or genetically encoded.

Honestly, if you want an animal that is okay with prolonged isolation and being ignored most of the time, that is available for cuddling when YOU want it to happen, you should have gotten a very independent cat (or at least gotten a bonded p'let pair).

This is the heart of what lies behind the majority of issues we see in this behavior section of the forum. In the back of their minds, people know it, even though they're asking for advice on how to change their bird. I get to the point of pondering this....we don't consider our husbands to be "pets," we don't consider our wives to be "pets," we don't consider our children to be "pets." But because an industry tells us they are, we expect an animal (with pre-determined genetic drives, behavioral responses to varying events, conditions, found only within it's natural environment) to view itself and it's place in our home as that of simply a pet, with the diminished life that goes with that. And there is no reason for us to feel that way, only that we have the power to place it in captivity (and speak for it). For example, an orca is no more than an entertainer, to be penned up at night when it's not needed to jump through hoops for spectators.

I don't think you should cover her.... all that's doing is punishing her for an entirely natural behavior.

I don't believe this to be punishing (or that the bird sees it that way) simply because of the biology of a bird's social attachment needs (see "Gifts of the Crow" on Amazon). Think of switches, emotions can be turned on and off. Hormones (mesotocin and vasotocin) motivate the seeking of companionship and play (these are social rewards). When alone and isolated the bird experiences fear and panic as well as raised stress levels, and this elicits screaming/contact calling. This is genetically encoded. Think of how birds will overcome a fear just to try to get to us. But when companionship is found, endorphins are released, replacing emotional distress with comfort and pleasure. Birds as social creatures are highly motivated to alleviate the stress of isolation and their social partnerships (with us) become encoded....(beware of scientific part)....in linkages among neurons of different brain regions that are sensitive to the motivation to seek a partner and the rewards of that relationship.

The "behaviorists" are simply wrong....we don't reinforce social attachment in birds, it is an inevitable course of nature.

Most experience that the desire of parrots to be with us seems to increase exponentially each time we spend time with them. How many of us have given a parrot in a store 5 min. of attention only to have it not allow us to leave? So I don't believe in the contrary, that they can "learn" that they're only going to get 1/2 an hour, and hour, two hours, each day. They will always want more and more not only because the biological desire to have a bond is so strong but also because that bond is neurologically enforced and strengthened.


Proper photoperiod is, of course, necessary for the well being of a bird. But, if a bird has to be covered for a short while so that it can calm down and a person/family can clear their heads, that's not causing any harm to the bird, especially if the only alternative is for the bird to remain in a state of panic (stereotypies being a manifestation of social deprivation). I think that we, as humans, view this as punishment because it would be if it was done to us. So again, the most current research on the neuroscience of emotions (emotions are what truly drive behavior) tells us that the key to captive animal welfare is in minimizing negative emotions.

A bird can learn ...to express their desires in more enjoyable ways

Depends on what the bird wants. Along the lines of my above response, biologically, expecting this is very much like expecting a person to call 911 while remaining calm. Nobody sounds like a polite English butler when they're panicking. I'm sure there are shades of grey and many different household circumstances but I think that the biology of what is happening inside the bird should be understood first and foremost so the we dont run the risk of teaching people, or promoting as common, the practice of fighting biology.