Urgent Recovering GCC

[Alisha]

Hi, my first post here. I have a 1 and 1 /2 yr old gcc that is recovering from a trauma. He had his little head smashed in the top of our bathroom door by my 7 yr old. Accident obviously. He has been to the vet several times, blood work, gram stains, stool cultures and x rays. My questions now are:
1. It's been 2 months since the accident, he is still polyuric and has polydipsia. Vet says she isn't concerned and it might be the "new normal". Is polyuria really ever considered "normal"?
2. He had follow up blood work last week, one month after his first workup, his lipids and hemoglobin were really high, like fatty liver high and he gained 30 grams in two weeks...just constantly wanting to eat. I was allowing it because he had been on soft food for so long. He's currently on a diet now and we are working on getting weoght back to the mid 70s 80s. Any advice? He is only getting 6 grams of pellet a day and the rest of just veggies.
3. His left eye was damaged, he is able to open and close it now and it isn't as swollen but I'm not sure he'll be able to fully see out of it again. Anyone have any experience in that?
4. Obviously I am still concerned for him and his overall health ans quality of life. All the rest of his blood work was good according to the vet, gram stain and stool culture normal. (I don't fully agree seeing as he still has extreme polyuria). I know this will take time to see full recovery and two months isn't long given the injuries and trauma. He is flying around and being more himself day by day but maybe his intense need for food and water is from a small brain injury we don't know about? Like a switch turned off?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I'm feeling really alone and overwhelmed with guilt..
Thanks!

 

[sunnysmom]

Welcome to the forum. Sorry to hear your bird was injured. I will tag some people.

@webchirp ? @Mizzely ?

 

[webchirp]

I’m so sorry. I’m not certain about the different outcomes but being a severe brain injury, you may have to wait a year or more for things to re-wire themselves if that makes sense. Many hugs. And give him and yourself time to overcome this. You could get a second opinion as well.

 

[Pixiebeak]

30 grams? What was previous and current weight,? I'd be concerned if possible free fluid in abdomen. Or eggs?

Can you share a poop pic?

I'm not sure , as in don't know enough if there is a link with head injury and polyuria.

But I've seen polyuria with liver inflammation and kidney infection, and some of thst was with my avain Chlamydia outbreak in my flock in which nearly all has polyuria.

Sorry to hear of head injury, but do glad survived and thst you are working with an avian veterinarian.

As above, definitely takes time to fully recover from injuries.

 

[Alisha]

30 grams? What was previous and current weight,? I'd be concerned if possible free fluid in abdomen. Or eggs?

Can you share a poop pic?

I'm not sure , as in don't know enough if there is a link with head injury and polyuria.

But I've seen polyuria with liver inflammation and kidney infection, and some of thst was with my avain Chlamydia outbreak in my flock in which nearly all has polyuria.

Sorry to hear of head injury, but do glad survived and thst you are working with an avian veterinarian.

As above, definitely takes time to fully recover from injuries.

No egg, he is a boy for sure. His poop varies throughout the day of having some wormy poo in it to being mainly watery pee. I'll post some pics of what I took to the vet. It was his morning poo. How would they check for fluid in abdomen??
His normal weight was between. 75-80 grams. When he was at his worst he struggled to maintain 60 grams. Once he started feeling better and regained some beak strength all he wanted to do was eat. So now he is sitting at 90-95 grams after a week of dieting.
I know it'll take time and hopefully I'll start seeing some weight drop. He's come such a long way in a short time, it'd just hard for me to see it bc I want him fully well. He also has just gotten lazy and wants cuddles all day ha.

 

[Pixiebeak]

I don't normally like to evaluate first morning poop, because it always weird and they hold it overnight. But that saying that poop , both poops look like a sick bird poop. The urates are stringy and definitely to much liquid.

@Mizzely has a poop pic example. And someplace I have a poop example of pigeons but excellent in showing different conditions associated with different poop. Have to look for it later I've got my father coming over to do projects with.

You guys are so cute together!

Excellent thst you've had blood work and culture. It's frustrating and happens a lot , thst things aren't always clear even after tests...so frustrating!

An x ray would show fluid retention...but x rdts come with risks and it's best to discuss with vet risk verse reward and decide if needed.

 

[Pixiebeak]

I'll even go out on a limb, because of black feather edges, very green poop, fatty liver history, rapid weight flux, stringy urates.. probably chronic bacteria liver infection, and because avain Chlamydia is possible azithromycin and doxycycline would be good choices to try and see if improving..if then 45 days of docxy needed if Chlamydia is suspect vs other bacteria.

Sometimes in chronic infection the WBC doesn't show high...sbd and if I remember head injury affects WBC ( not sure about if sbd how )


Found poop article, warning graphic! Internal organ post desty pics . Just go look through poop pics and association with diseases a d condition

Dropping Interpretation

For fanciers, often the first indication that a problem is present in their birds is a change in their droppings. All birds, including pigeons, are able to mask health problems quite well. In the...

www.auspigeonco.com.au

 

[Mizzely]

I would definitely be concerned with the rapid weight gain, though the fact that it has been going down again with a diet fairly quickly is encouraging.

After 2 months of appointments and tests with no answers, I would want a second opinion. The worst that happens is you learn nothing new...which can be disappointing in some ways, but encouraging that your current vet is on the right track.

Poop pics as requested!

 

[Alisha]

I'll even go out on a limb, because of black feather edges, very green poop, fatty liver history, rapid weight flux, stringy urates.. probably chronic bacteria liver infection, and because avain Chlamydia is possible azithromycin and doxycycline would be good choices to try and see if improving..if then 45 days of docxy needed if Chlamydia is suspect vs other bacteria.

Sometimes in chronic infection the WBC doesn't show high...sbd and if I remember head injury affects WBC ( not sure about if sbd how )


Found poop article, warning graphic! Internal organ post desty pics . Just go look through poop pics and association with diseases a d condition

Dropping Interpretation

For fanciers, often the first indication that a problem is present in their birds is a change in their droppings. All birds, including pigeons, are able to mask health problems quite well. In the...

www.auspigeonco.com.au

I appreciate the through reply! He was on 10 days of baytril bc I thought he could have been getting an ear infection before the last blood work. Vet seems to think of it were anything bacterial that should have cleared it up. I may try to get a second opinion based off what I know now. I feel like this vet is convinced I'm just overly concerned. I feel like something is wrong with my baby, that could have stemmed from the accident but has evolved into something else. I'm trying to be his advocate

 

[Alisha]

I would definitely be concerned with the rapid weight gain, though the fact that it has been going down again with a diet fairly quickly is encouraging.

After 2 months of appointments and tests with no answers, I would want a second opinion. The worst that happens is you learn nothing new...which can be disappointing in some ways, but encouraging that your current vet is on the right track.

Poop pics as requested!

View attachment 434586 View attachment 434587

I am going to give it two weeks then schedule a second opinion. He's been through so much already. I want to see how it goes. Obviously if it gets worse I'd go sooner

 

[Pixiebeak]

Baytril is pretty harsh on birds. It's not my favorite antibiotic to be used in birds. It is a broad spectrum but it doesn't cover everything. As an example it's worthless against avain Chlamydia. I talk about avain Chlamydia a lot because I had to treat 7 birds for it in a flock outbreak. It was stressful and hard work to save them. ..

 

[Alisha]

Baytril is pretty harsh on birds. It's not my favorite antibiotic to be used in birds. It is a broad spectrum but it doesn't cover everything. As an example it's worthless against avain Chlamydia. I talk about avain Chlamydia a lot because I had to treat 7 birds for it in a flock outbreak. It was stressful and hard work to save them. ..

I have a black capped conure as well. If it were something contagious I think he'd be showing symptoms as well?

 

[Pixiebeak]

To clarify I'm not saying your guy has AC , just useing it as my go to example
But as an example, not all birds show symptoms, some are exposed and recover on their own never showing symptoms, some become chronic carrier and intermittent shedders, some can have it hide in their body then years later when stressed have a clinical case showing symptoms. It's a complex weird infection. But yes if any bird in home has all birds in home should be treated concurrently regardless of symptoms.
Broad spectrum antibiotic can still not cover every type of bacteria infection is what I'm trying to say

But I do worry your guy has some kind of bacterial infection, but with 10 days if baytril it's possible it's a fungal infection. Many birds can develop secondary yeast overgrowth after a few days in baytril.

We aren't here to replace your avain veterinarian. And I can't know really what's going on . Just csn share my experience

And trusting you guts is good. I agree I think something is going on.

 

[Alisha]

I am going to give it two weeks then schedule a second opinion. He's been through so much already. I want to see how it goes. Obviously if it gets worse I'd go sooner

Second opinion scheduled for today. Hopefully they have some answers!!

 

[Alisha]

Well, she seemed just as baffled as I am.. she did look into his mouth and saw too much mucus and inflammation of his names. Wants to schedule a celioscope..closest place is university of Tennessee..idk what to do or how to make him feel better.. they put him back on metacam for pain and inflammation...

 

[Mizzely]

That's so hard

 

[Alisha]

So, vet did digital x rays. Showed enlarged liver. Going to treat for AC...doxycycline for 45 days. Hoping my other bird isn't already affected. Will separate them and disinfect cages really well.. I'm scared.

 

[Pixiebeak]

It's ok! If it is AC then it's kinda good news because you have something that is treatable!!! It will take st least ten days to start showing improvement ( tho often you see improvement sooner!) If responding, then it's best practices to treat all the birds in the home at same time even if no symptoms.
My 7 all fully recovered!! Tho did take a second round of medicine. All happy and healthy now tho!

And a lot of cleaning, no vacuuming because that csn spread it around. Change AC filter weekly use one rated for bacteria and virus. It's a little expensive to do this but I found it worthwhile to do until treatment eas over and then a little longer as has relapse. Use dilute bleach to clean stuff thi no right around birds. You can take stuff out clean it rinse and dry and no bleach smell put it back . Toss all soft toys and perches, if can't be washed . Dint replace them till a few weeks after recovery with no relapse. Clean hard perches daily. Take cage papers to outside trash daily.

 

[Mizzely]

Answers you can work with Better than not knowing and not being able to do anything about it!