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Over preening after flock addition

haleybethg

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Guys, I’m at a loss and honestly, I’m just so sad about this right now so I’m looking for a little emotional support as well as advice.

Gilly is 7 months old and has been with us for four months. I am her chosen person, though she socializes well with anyone she meets. She absolutely adores me & I feel the same in return. We are probably (guesstimating here) about ¾ of the way through her first molt and all of her feathers had come in beautifully! Not a single stress bar or black spot or abnormal bronzing. I have been really, really, striving to get her in good feather. She came to me from Petco in pretty good feather, considering the source, but I wanted to make sure she was so well loved and fed that we got rid of all the bars and spots…and we did! I was so super proud of us as a team!

And now we are here & in some way I feel like I have let her down and it breaks my heart into a hundred pieces…

We adopted Sam our Blue Crowned Conure (who hates me by the way) and I noticed within a few days Gilly’s feathers were looking kind of ratty. At first I didn’t think much of it, assuming they were feathers that hadn’t molted yet, but I kept noticing it and thinking it just doesn’t look right. Then finally last night I looked her over and said no, I KNOW you molted all of these feathers already, something isn’t right. I pulled up a comparison photo from 5 days before we brought Sam home (ironically, I had taken this photo to show the rescue how well she was feathered) and the change is absolutely there, something is happening to her feathers. Photo attached is now on top and before on bottom.

I talked to a friend about it, thinking maybe we have FDB or fatty liver issues and she suggested over preening, much like her GCC did when she had two GCCs in the house instead of one. She said Gilly is probably stressed from bringing Sam into our home. Bingo, that’s gotta be it. Both birds were checked by the vet and had clean bills of health. I did just take the fruity Zupreem pellets from Gilly, but she switched without issue within just a couple of days to TOPs and Harrison’s and since that swap she’s actually eating REALLY well. I was actually praising her good eating just last night because she ate more chop than Sam and Gilly used to not even touch chop!! (I always had to cook, puree and send up some prayers!)

So for a full picture of Gilly’s lifestyle she gets TOPs and/or Harrison’s Pepper pellets with chop twice a day, morning and evening. Chop usually consists of 3 leafy greens, 3 red/orange/yellow veggies, a fruit or two, and various grains (brown rice, quinoa, barley, oatmeal, pasta) and 15 bean soup blend plus I throw in some ground or whole flax seed and chia seed, plus an herb or spice. She usually gets no more than 4 cockatiel sized nutriberries per day (if that). She gets a smidge of coconut oil about once a week; sometimes I cook her a bit of egg in CO. And she gets small portions of “human food” occasionally. She particularly loves Raisin Bran flakes…I know, I know, but the fid likes what she likes!

My husband and I both work outside the home 8 hours a day, so she and Sam are alone from 8-5, but she has a cage full of toys and I have a UVA/UVB bird lamp on a timer for her (I think I have it set to 2-3 hours right now.) She comes out of her cage just as soon as I get home and spends about 3-4 hours out with me before it’s bedtime for everyone. She gets a solid 10 hours of sleep most nights, sometimes she gets more like 11-12 if we go to bed early. On the weekends she gets almost an entire day out and about with us. Gilly and Sam both have cages in our living room. They are on opposite walls (north and south walls basically). They are not right in front of each other, but about 12 feet diagonally across. Gilly did move walls when we got the new cage, and she is closer to windows now (maybe I need to try moving her or lowering the blinds some?)

Last night I cried to my husband. Not only was I feeling defeated and angry with Sam because he “hates” me, (which made me feel bad because I felt that way), but then I figured out his “intrusion” was causing Gilly stress. I felt so bad for putting her through this (probably putting way more human emotion into it than there actually is) & I was so upset because we worked so hard on her feathers! Today I woke up and took a few deep breaths, said feathers are just feathers, but we have to get Gilly back to feeling safe and secure so the over preening doesn’t escalate to full blown plucking and mutilation.

So we know she’s healthy, we know she’s well fed, we know she gets good quality time out of her cage every day.

Where do we go from here?

Is this something she just has to adjust to? My friend suggested moving Sam out of the room for a while or half covering Gilly’s cage with a blanket so she can “get away” from him and feel secure so I did that today, plus I put in a few new toys and preening toy for her.

Sorry this post is so long, but I wanted to be thorough and honestly it was pretty cathartic for me too! Gotta get this head space clear so I can push forward for my fids!
 

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Calpurnia

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Sounds like the transition has been rough on you both. You have my sympathies and I'm sorry the whole ordeal has made you feel so helpless and frustrated. If it's any consolation, it sounds like you're fids have a pretty fantastic, pampered life and that you are a very caring and attentive bird mom. :)

Having introduced all of my birds one at a time I can say that there often is a significant transition period in which all parties may be unfortunately stressed. Considering three of my birds still only tolerate each other at best, the first few weeks were filled with frequent aggressive displays and jealous bickering, until they learned to just leave each other in peace.

In your case, Gilly just went from being the only bird in the house, to sharing not only her space but the attention of her human flock. She may be feeling jealousy over this or she may feel threatened by Sam. In either case the only real remedy is time for both to adjust. Have the two even been near each other and shown any aggression? And how have you been working on introducing the two?

In the meantime, I do think your idea of partially covering Gilly's cage might help. In addition, extra preening/foraging toys could help keep her mind off of her over preening. Finally, as difficult as it may be, try to not beat yourself up too much about her feather progress, and try to keep as positive an attitude as possible. Birds are pretty sensitive to our emotions and will respond accordingly if we are feeling particularly frustrated or stressed. Poor Sam probably doesn't "hate" you quite as much as you believe (I'm guessing he also just needs time to adjust to his new home!) but your beliefs can quickly become a self-fulfilling prophecy if you are constantly interacting with him with a negative mindset. I know how bad it can feel to have a bird that couldn't care less for you, especially when you put in SO much time and effort into keeping them happy/healthy. What helped for me in the end was learning to cherish the small victories, and keeping a small collection of notes documenting our progress.

Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Good luck, and hang in there!
 

haleybethg

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Sam, Sam, Sam…what can I say about Sam!

Sam has “one person syndrome” and the object of his affection is my husband (of all people!) So my husband is going through the normal “new bird relationship” stuff with him: building trust, some nipping, but mostly compliant and content. I was told that Sam was able to overcome his one person syndrome at his last house (he was put in the rescue because his primary caretaker, the wife, was in end of life hospice care.) I was able to see videos on Facebook of Sam interacting with his NON-preferred person (the husband) and you would’ve never guessed they had issues, so I know it’s possible and will just take lots (LOTS!) of time and patience.

Sam is also flighted though, which makes training and relationship building difficult because he leaves and avoids me. I do all of the things they tell you to do to help a bird with “O.P.S” like always opening his cage door, bringing him his favorite treats, bringing the food and bath pan, but basically I’m just his slave at the moment lol. My “value” to him isn’t very valued yet! After last night, even before the feather discovery with Gilly, I decided Sam and I were going to take a few days “off” and away from each other. I will still open the door and bring the treats and food, but I won’t try to interact with him any further than that. I think we BOTH need a little time to calm down and regroup and adjust our attitudes. He’s only been with us a little over a week, which I know is WAY TOO SOON to expect anything, but I was not expecting him to be SO turned off by me and so difficult to interact with (Gilly came to us clipped so he’s our first flighted parrot.) It’s been a lot more overwhelming than I expected…baby steps…baby steps…

Sam and Gilly have not interacted together. I’m actually scared to do it because he’s so much bigger and still so unsettled. Gilly did run up my husbands arm once when Sam was sitting on his shoulder. Sam lunged for her to get back. I intercepted Gilly and anticipated taking the bite for her (thankfully he didn’t bite, whew!) but that’s the extent of their interaction so far. I was worried that SHE would be the jealous and territorial one, but she seems to want to meet him. Whenever he’s on her playtop she will scurry up the side of the cage to see him or if she sees him on my husbands shoulder she will try to get closer (never appears to be an aggressive “chase down.”) Otherwise they ignore each other and do their own thing. Maybe I need to try to work on letting her get to know him… And since Sam won’t interact with me, she’s actually been getting MORE attention and affection from me, but she MAY be missing her bird dad, since he’s been consumed with Sam…Hmm….
 

Calpurnia

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Yep, sounds like a pretty complicated situation! :shocked4:

I can imagine that Sam's O.P.S is being exacerbated by all of the moving around and significant life changes. I think you are going about it in the right way though, by giving him the necessary time/space.

You never know, but maybe Gilly is also getting a little frustrated because she wants to meet Sam and interact with him while the two are out. I think some controlled, formal introductions could never hurt.

Keep up your spirits! Things should only get better with time! I hope to hear of a happy update soon enough!
 

haleybethg

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I've come across products Avicalm and Featherific. Are these safe? I wonder if one or both would help.

Sam has been with us 3 weeks now and Gilly is steadily over preening (basically ripping, I can hear when she does it) the tips of her feathers.

I'm very scared she will advance to plucking. :(
 

Monica

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They might help, or they might not. It doesn't solve the root of the problem, but could help ease their behavior.



Is there any possible way to change things back to *before* Sam arrived? Set the livingroom back up the way that Gilly liked it? And put Sam in another room?




As far as Sam, if you ever see him looking to make an escape path away from you, then stop and back up a step. Once he calms down, walk away or just move a little distance away. Doing this behavior and repeating it until you can get closer to Sam may help him.


Have you seen these two posts by Hillary Hankey? They might help you with Sam. :)

Working with Fearful Parrots: A Study in Videos | Learning Parrots

Parrot Behavior Myths: Building Trust | Learning Parrots
 

JLcribber

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Where do we go from here?

Is this something she just has to adjust to? My friend suggested moving Sam out of the room for a while or half covering Gilly’s cage with a blanket so she can “get away” from him and feel secure so I did that today, plus I put in a few new toys and preening toy for her.

You've got to stop the flow of emotions, especially around the birds. I know easier said than done. Not just for Gilly's sake but for Sam's too. You would appear "unbalanced" so to speak and not someone worth befriending yet

Its been my experience when dealing with aggressive birds that the "energy" you present along with the body language that creates is what is speaking to that bird. You must be confident and unafraid. This is more of a case of earning respect than trying to make friends. You need to meet eye to eye (again so to speak) and never show intimidation. They will come to terms with it................. Eventually. :)

Moving him for a while may help. There are no rules. It's all trial and error.

Something else to consider. Being Gilly's favourite means no sharing. Avoid creating jealousy by interaction with Sam. That's probably not a problem since he hates you. Being aggressive with you (to Gilly) is also stressful.

 

haleybethg

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After spending more time around her this weekend, she does seem to be adjusting to him, but he was also mostly in another room (in the man cave with my husband!) so we may try moving him into that room away from her. She is playing with one of the toys I bought her quite a bit (it's a Christmas toy, I think I better stock up!) I have been encouraging her to play with toys, step up/step down training, and target training her when she's out of her cage in order to keep her from obsessively preening herself. I get that she does it during the day when she's alone with him, but if I'm home and she's out she shouldn't be doing it (ideally), so I can definitely tell where it's becoming a "habit" now, more so than the stress.

She's such a velcro bird that she will often just lounge in my hand while I pet her or just watch TV. If she starts preening her feathers too hard or too much, I set her down. It's about 50/50 on whether she continues to preen or "snaps out of it" and wants to come back to join me. I figure putting her down when she does the "bad behavior" can't adversely affect her, so I'm giving it a try, as well as SUPER PRAISING her good behaviors (playing with toys, foraging, training, etc.)


Sam and I have definitely changed tunes. We now have what I like to call a "professional relationship." I bring the goods, I let him out of the cage, I target train, but I mostly leave him alone as far as any bonding attempts go. Target training him has been a huge help because I can get him into his cage by myself with a favorite treat (peanut, almond, or apple) which is a HUGE relief for me. I figure I will just keep this relationship going for a few months, and then maybe we can try to get more personal. The other day I came home early from work and beat my husband home, and Sam was actually a lot better towards me! I lifted my arm to ask him to step up and he looked at it and then just backed away (to which I also backed away), but normally he lunges at me for such an act, so we are making progress and it would seem to be better when my hubby isn't home. So....slow slow slow baby steps!

As far as the emotions go, I've definitely had to "remove myself" from some of it. I've had to not feel SO bad for my Gilly's feathers and stop feeling so upset when Sam rejected me. Gilly is still my heart, but I've switched gears to focus on helping her, rather than wallowing in sadness and pity for her and myself. I'm so looking forward to her being a flighted birdie, I think she will really like that, but darn if the molt didn't include new flight feathers this go around. Grr!
 

Chihuahua

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Blue crowns from my experience and what i have heard from other owners are very cautious birds. They are pretty high strung and it takes them a while to warm up. I spent months sitting by gabby's cage and handling orion while essentially ignoring gabby or talking to him a little while on the computer. he gradually grew more comfortable and would inch closer every day checking me out. he saw over time that I was not a threat and now is bonded to me. he is very particular about where he is touched and is still nippy, but it's just his way of communication instead of sound and he has never drawn blood on me. he likes to sit on my shoulder and be talked to.

Orion bonded to my mom and it actually works becase he and gabby can get attention at the same time without bickering lol
 

Monica

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Just be careful that you aren't discouraging Gilly from preening in a healthy manner! :)


Hope things continue to improve! I just wonder though if Sam was quarantined or kept away from Gilly for several weeks if that might have reduced her stress? Then again, hearing him could have still caused stress.
 

haleybethg

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I only discourage her preening when she's too overzealous. I can literally hear her tearing through her feather and I wind up with pieces on my hand. She also really likes to gnaw her shoulders the most, so if she just keeps on and keeps on with the shoulders, down she goes.

If she's full body preening and going for the preen gland, both are things I've noticed she will NOT do if she's doing it to be destructive, especially the gland, then I don't bother her.


I wish I could ask her what exactly stressed her out. I think just from observation it was the calls, he can be heard very clearly outside the house, so I imagine going from an otherwise quiet household during the day to dealing with THAT...sometimes if he really gets on one, he drives me to the absolute brink of sanity. Luckily, he's only done that a couple of times, otherwise it's just typically timed parrot calls.
 

Monica

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Link didn't work, but that's great news! :tup:
 

haleybethg

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I feel like this is the best place to update.

1. Last night Sam left my husbands shoulder and flew to me! First time ever! :omg: (I had the box of Cheez-It's...his guilty pleasure lol!)

2. Gilly's feathers are still very fragile. I find myself covered in bits when she preens. I think the jagged edges cause her to preen them a bit more aggressively. HOWEVER she has restarted her baby molt finally, which tells me that her stress levels have died back down. I'm hoping she will finish out her full baby molt before spring and hopefully she will be kind to her new fully-adult feathers.

Also, Sam and Gilly met face to face on a play stand. That didn't go so well... It was a hostile situation and Gilly was removed from the situation with only a itty bitty minor scratch in the top layer of her beak (whew!!) After a week it buffed itself out. Maybe down the line when Sam is more settled they can be a bit more friendly, but for now we aren't letting them get too close again. I was truly terrified something bad would happen. You don't fully realize the size difference until they're showing off in a pseudo beak-fencing match.
 

Calpurnia

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Great progress! And that's such good news for Gilly! Though you may not have birdie best friends anytime soon hopefully your returning peace of mind will be worth it. :)
 
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