Hyacinth Help!

[Dawne]

Hi All

Apologies for the long post......

Background:

So I have a problem. My husband and I have a large(ish) flock. We have everything from a parrotlet to the grand daddy of them all - the Hyacinth. We are fairly experienced and very competent. Just over a year ago we brought in a rescue Hy named Carter. He is very plucked and a little neurotic. It was a fairly long road but Carter has bonded to me and loves me. I took a lot of bites and hurt feelings to get there. Carter dislikes my husband and will bite him. We have accepted this as he is an abused bird and we have little information about his background. All is fine with dear Carter.

Problem:

Less than a week ago we rehomed another hyacinth. Robi came from a loving home of 26 years (since he was a baby). He has not been abused and has no behavioral issues related to abuse. In the home he came from it was a middle aged female (like me) who was his primary person. Over the years she had children who she raised and they grew up and left home ect. She has reported that Robi was good with everyone in the family and particularly loved her son who has since passed away (he was a young adult at the time). Now Robi comes to live with us. He is settling in well. He loves my husband and allows my husband to handle him, love him, roll him on his back etc. My husband has taken bites because Robi is a bit of a spoiled child and does not like doing things that are not his idea. Being put back in his cage can be a bit of a fight. I should also share that Robi lived among other macaws and they basically had the run of the place. They lived in a garage and an outdoor aviary and were never actually caged. So there was a lack of structure and discipline. Now Robi comes to our aviary where birds are caged for their safety and everyone comes out for common play and one one time with us. Meals are structured an nutritious and its lights out at 7:30 pm every night with the day beginning at 6:00 am. We run a tight and clean ship!

The issue is Robi seem to hate me. I cannot handle him and I can rarely touch in and when I do get the chance it usually ends in a strike. He bites me, he lunges at the cage and it breaks my heart. This is counter intuitive because he loved his whole family and his primary owner was a middle aged female (like me).

What do I do? I have been told "just get in there, take the bites and get him to obey you". Im not sure that is the best way to win this guy's trust and affection. Does my husband need to step back an push me out front in all of the interactions with Robi, do I just go slow and speak sweetly to him. Please advise me as to how to win his heart. I know its early; should I just accept it as it is for now and in time he will come around. This has never been the case with Carter and my husband. The more in the background my husband is the less Carter wants to do with him.

Please, guide me.

Signed

Broken Hearted

 

[sunnysmom]

Less that a week? Just give him time. And definitely, don't take the bite and make him obey. It's always best to avoid the bite and dominance doesn't work with parrots. Trust and positive reinforcement. I don't really have macaw experience (although I think Hys are gorgeous.) But I think you just need to take it slow. Give him treats, spend quiet time with him, and let him adjust to his new home.

@Macawnutz ? @Hankmacaw ?

 

[Dawne]

Sunnysmom, thank you. And I know some of my questions may sound dumb and I know its less than a week. My fear is "I just don't want to miss the window of opportunity". I know its so early the game has hardly begun I just don't want make mistakes that cause me to lose him completely. I would be less concerned if he wasn't so easy going with my husband. We do not want Robi to end up like Carter; a one person bird. We want him to love and receive the benefit of both of us. Of the two of us I am the big bird lover, my husband enjoys the smaller birds more. Forcing and taking the bites definitely goes against my intuition - like who ever truly keeps something that is taken by force? the Hys are gorgeous and a one of a kind parrot for sure. Those beaks are very intimidating lol.

 

[sunnysmom]

Sunnysmom, thank you. And I know some of my questions may sound dumb and I know its less than a week. My fear is "I just don't want to miss the window of opportunity". I know its so early the game has hardly begun I just don't want make mistakes that cause me to lose him completely. I would be less concerned if he wasn't so easy going with my husband. We do not want Robi to end up like Carter; a one person bird. We want him to love and receive the benefit of both of us. Of the two of us I am the big bird lover, my husband enjoys the smaller birds more. Forcing and taking the bites definitely goes against my intuition - like who ever truly keeps something that is taken by force? the Hys are gorgeous and a one of a kind parrot for sure. Those beaks are very intimidating lol.

I think at this point the worst thing you can do is try to force him to do things. And just because he prefers your husband now doesn't mean it will always be like that. My 'too preferred my fiancé initially. Now, I'm the one that can do anything to Elvis and my fiancé gets the nips. I think in part because I just took things slow with Elvis. I'm sure others with macaw experience will have better advice but I don't think you're missing a window.

 

[Hankmacaw]

@Macawnutz Hopefully will be on soon. She has two Hyacinths.
A Hyacinth is just a macaw - bigger- but just another macaw. IMO you should never "just take" the bite. A successful bite is self perpetuating and will lead to more bites down the road. My advice is that you and your husband avoid every bite possible. You are aware that a Hyacinth bite can and will do an exceptional amount of damage.

You may have to start with the basics with Robi. It doesn't sound like he has had any house trainig. Start by just talking to him and giving him treats - first through the bars of his cage. Later you can open his cage to give him treats. Talk, talk, talk to him. Be silly for him. This may take quite a long time, but avoid the bites. If you need to move him before he is being a good boy,
use a T-stick.

Be patient.

 

[Macawnutz]

Makes no difference being a Hy, scarlet or even an amazon...

Birds take months to adjust to a new home and new people. Imagine everything you have known for years being taken from you and you now have a whole new family and home. He has every right to pick and choose his comforts. Birds change their minds like teenage girls but you have to measure your time in months and years not weeks and days.

Oh man, our male Hy did not really like me and he just loves my husband. I backed off and let my husband do most of the interactions. You know what he realized after sometime? That mom is WAY more fun and he picked the wrong person. Took him about two years to set his pride aside and play with me but we are fine now. Granted given the choice between the two of us I am the third wheel but that is life with birds.

If a bird bites you, you have already missed all the warnings that you should have seen telling you his mood. If they are threatening to bite that is their way of saying NO. When you tell someone NO would it be okay if they did it anyway? Respect his feelings, respect his warnings. If you don't respect his warnings he will quit giving them and just bite. My opinion is back off. Be the fun one in the background and he may come around.

 

[Mizzely]

Just think about this from his perspective.

The only family you've ever known is gone. You are in a new place with new rules, new birds, new smells. Your flock is gone.

He is feeling very vulnerable and uncertain. It will take time for him to regain confidence. What he needs from you is patience and time. The only window of opportunity you are missing here is to chance to show him you can be patient and kind. Don't rush him

 

[Sarah13]

A hy is no different than any other mac aside from phenotype and genotype.
The rules of operant conditioning still apply and work for them all.

2 way communication/respecting body language so the bird isn't to the point of needing to bite and positive associations are your key.
Trust is crucial and gained this way.

They cannot rationalize nor do they have the cognitive ability to conceptualize time like humans can so while showing compassion is very helpful and wonderful while working with an animal, anthropomorphicizing them isn't always applicable or helpful.
Everything to them is either instictive/reactionary, or conditioned/associative. Waiting a ton of time doing nothing is prefectly fine if you wish but you're merely biding time until you decide to work on the trust and relationship.

Even if not formally set up or intended, every interaction is a training session in that you are either increasing or decreasing the chances the bird wants to be around you and or accept handling/whatever things you need to do.


Finding a reinforcer that motivates the bird is very helpful as is studying its individual body language cues.
Hands free interactions like capturing, target training, and or tricks also get you both positively interacting together nearly bite risk free.
Trust can then build both ways as forcing/taking bites/aversives does not teach the bird anything and severely damages the relationship.
Good luck and have fun!

 

[Dawne]

All who have answered thus far - thank you very much. Sarah13 your words resonate with me most. Biding my time delaying the fixing of what is not right between us. I agree with all regarding "what must he be feeling and thinking after 26 years in the same home and time for this situation really needs to be measured in months and years". We have another Hy, Carter, and it was a bit of a rough road to start with him as well. He is a naked rescue who has faced God know what untold horrors. He is now my big blue baby. It took months and now just over a year later I cannot believe the distance we have come and where we will be even a year from now. And Macawnutz I am totally way more fun than my husband lol.

Thank you all again, any more wisdom and advise is appreciated.

 

[BrianB]

I've started working a few days a week at a local bird store. They currently have a Hy that's being boarded there. My approach to these guys is that they don't know me and they are in a strange environment. One of the birds that lives at the store, a Catalina, was a brat with me the first couple of days I was there. One of the guys said to just put my arm out and tell him to step up in a forceful voice. Now that I've been there a few weeks, our interactions are better and he's warming up to me. The boarders are a different story. They may have been coming there for years, and while they know the other employees, they don't know me. The Hy in the boarding area was on one of the hanging trees and when I came back through she was gone. She had gotten herself down, walked across the entire back of the store, opened an office door and was sitting on a chair. I told the guy who was back there and he said to just pick her up and put her back where she was. Are you kidding? She doesn't know me, and there was no way I was going to try to handle her. I'm a stranger to her. He isn't. I make it a point to stop and talk to her every time I pass by, just so she gets to know me. It's all about time and patience.

 

[AzKhaleesi]

@BrianB Tropic Zone???

 

[BrianB]

@BrianB Tropic Zone???

Yes.