• Welcome to Avian Avenue! To view our forum with less advertisments please register with us.
    Memberships are free and it will just take a moment. Click here

Full spectrum lighting.. not the usual questions

Status
Not open for further replies.

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,902
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
I have been researching this for the last few months. I have read and re read every post on AA for the last few years and also read and re read many articles about the subject. While MUCH of it is still over my head and I still have MUCH to learn I have a few questions and statistics I would like to post.

The reason I am researching this is because I wanted to change over all my home fixtures to full spectrum CFL's. Home fixtures meaning they will not be close enough to have benefits of UVB ( and I know there is debate on if there are benefits :D ) But I wanted them to at least visually benefit. I have been researching many of the AA recommended brands and thought I should share. Some of the companies I have emailed have not replied yet but as they do I will update this list.

Now most of us look for a Kelvin rating of 5000-5500 and a high CRI rating.


full spectrum lighting,full spectrum lights, full spectrum cfl's,full spectrum lighting for the home or office, lumichrome full spectrum lighting chromalux full spectrum light bulbs, energy efficient light bulbs, compact fluorescent bulbs, cfl"s 93CRI, 5000K UVA 3%, UVB .05%

Full Spectrum 15w light bulb by FeatherBrite 5500k, 91 CRI, UVA 4%, UVB .05%

Full Spectrum Light Bulbs | Fluorescent Bulbs | Incandescent Bulbs (bluemax 20watt spiral ratings but uv outputs for all bulbs and tubes) 5500k 93CRI, The purpose of Ultralux, Paralite and BlueMax products is to replicate natural sunlight at noontime without any UV emission. We use a patented blend 3-6 color phosphors to achieve a visible color spectrum that is very close to the noontime visible color spectrum. For there to be any UV emission special phosphors must be included within the phosphor blend. Although some UV exposure can have some positive effects, we at FSS believe one should receive this from sunlight and not from a simulated light source that is used at close proximity and for extended periods of time. We do not include any of these UV phosphors and our spectral chart shows that the produced wavelengths are 400-750nm. UV wavelengths are below the 350nm range and infrared wavelengths (heat) are above 750nm.

AvianSun 7100k,CRI 93, UVA 3% UVB 5%
Thank you for contacting us. The UVA is 30 % from the Avian sun bulb and the CRI is 93 and the color Temp (K) is 7100. Please let me know if you have any further questions.

Philips 209056 F32T8/TL950 Straight T8 Fluorescent Tube Light Bulb at eLightBulbs.com 5500K, 98CRI

Now I have seen many people recommend the phillips tubes. They have yet to respond to my emails but I have a feeling they will not have a decent UV output. I guess my first question is, without a decent UV output does it even benefit them visually? Other than I guess clarity of light. Would they not be seeing in their spectrum of light without the UV outputs?

The other recommended avian light, Avian sun 5.0 I was shocked at 7100K. I wondered why they did not list any statistics other than UVB. This would pretty much confirm what I have read that the avian sun light is nothing more than a repackaged reptile bulb. Reptile lights from what I have seen always have a high Kelvin rating.

Like I said, I have quite a lot to learn about lighting but what I learned about some of our common used bulbs I wanted to share. There is so much more to some of it thats it makes my head hurt at times. Again I will update the list as other companies reply, if anybody has statistics from bulbs please add them here.
 

Ditty

Sprinting down the street
Joined
1/25/13
Messages
313
Location
Massachusetts
Real Name
Diane
wow ummm I have no idea but geeze you did a lot of research. Will be interesting to find out more in this thread.
 

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,902
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
wow ummm I have no idea but geeze you did a lot of research. Will be interesting to find out more in this thread.
:rofl: The research I did before I could type this and not sound ignorant was worse. OMG, I had no idea. If Gerard pops on this thread I will bury my head in a hole. ( :D I wish I understood 1/4 of what he writes )
 

karen256

Rollerblading along the road
Avenue Veteran
Mayor of the Avenue
Joined
3/12/12
Messages
2,556
Location
WI
I've always heard that the UV wavelengths that birds see visually travel through glass just fine - it's just the UV used in vit D production that doesn't make it through, but birds, like people, usually get enough from the diet.
Anyway, as to color temperature, if you will be using the bulbs in household lights, try one daylight bulb out to see if you can tolerate it before getting more bulbs.
Most household fluorescent bulbs sold are around 2800k - warm light. When you get to 5500-6000k daylight bulbs, the light appears very cold and blue, people have compared it to autopsy room light - probably not lighting you want for the whole house.
 

sodakat

Rollerblading along the road
Joined
3/11/11
Messages
3,297
Location
South Dakota
Real Name
Kathy
If you want to make yourself even more nuts, read some of the info about lighting for people with psoriasis. (My dear now deceased step dad, Steve, used to pronounce this sorryasses, which I of course hear in my head whenever I see that word, causing me to giggle.)

A different type of lamp is used to treat vitamin D deficiency and psoriasis. They are quite expensive (400 range).

Here is an article from the National Institute of Health regarding using lamps for Vit D therapy Treatment of vitamin D deficiency with UV light in patients with malabsorption syndromes: a case series and a link to the type of sun lamp used The VITAMIN D LAMP model D/UV-F, by KBD/Sperti. This FDA approved Vitamin D Lamp naturally boosts Vitamin D levels in your body with short exposure periods.

This type of therapy works on skin, not eyes. For birds that would be face and feet, but I wonder if cataracts would be a concern for birds with this type of useage. That can happen to people, I believe. In the referenced study the subjects sat with their lower backs facing the portable lamps.
 

sodakat

Rollerblading along the road
Joined
3/11/11
Messages
3,297
Location
South Dakota
Real Name
Kathy
I've always heard that the UV wavelengths that birds see visually travel through glass just fine - it's just the UV used in vit D production that doesn't make it through, but birds, like people, usually get enough from the diet.
Anyway, as to color temperature, if you will be using the bulbs in household lights, try one daylight bulb out to see if you can tolerate it before getting more bulbs.
Most household fluorescent bulbs sold are around 2800k - warm light. When you get to 5500-6000k daylight bulbs, the light appears very cold and blue, people have compared it to autopsy room light - probably not lighting you want for the whole house.
I am concerned my birds don't receive enough vitamin D from their diets because Eclectus cannot tolerate much enriched foods. Limited pellets means limited manmade Vit D.

Regarding the bulbs being uncomfortable due to their color. I've not found that to be the case. I bought some CF Full spectrum bulbs and have them in my kitchen light over the island as well as a lamp in another area and they are nice, IMO. Here is the brand I use: http://www.healthlighting.com/shopp...iscat=6&frompage=Online_Store&page_num=1&=SID
 
Last edited:

Ziggymon

Biking along the boulevard
Avenue Veteran
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
7/2/10
Messages
5,796
Real Name
Heidrun, or Mouse
I too like the full spectrum light for myself - all my reading/work lights are full spectrum.

To further complicate matters, Dr. W mentioned to me that fluorescent fixtures have a very rapid flicker effect that's not discernable to human eyes but is discernable to parrot eyes. He says that multiple bulbs will minimize the effect, because they will flicker on different cycles, but there's also something that can be added to the fixtue (I think it may be a special kind of ballast) that gets rid of it. It's something that I still need to research.

Thank you for this thread, Sarah, and for sharing the fruits of your research.
 

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,902
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
Thanks everyone for your reply's. I thought for a moment I might not have many comments being that is sometimes a difficult topic.

I am concerned my birds don't receive enough vitamin D from their diets because Eclectus cannot tolerate much enriched foods. Limited pellets means limited manmade Vit D.

Regarding the bulbs being uncomfortable due to their color. I've not found that to be the case. I bought some CF Full spectrum bulbs and have them in my kitchen light over the island as well as a lamp in another area and they are nice, IMO. Here is the brand I use: Full spectrum and natural lighting products from HealthLighting.com
As of yet I do not have any in my home so I will buy a few to try out colors and such but this brings me back to my questions. Your Ecolume FSL, do you know the UV outputs on them? Yes they are 5500k and 96 CRI but ( forgive me Gerard ) if your concerned about the vitamin D your birds get would you not be researching a bulb that has the correct UV instead of just the correct color ratings? This is why I get confused about people using the phillips tubes. Did we forget about the big picture or am I missing the big picture?

Well, :D Your here. I'm scared your answer will have me back in collage but "without a decent UV output does it even benefit them visually? Other than I guess clarity of light. Would they not be seeing in their spectrum of light without the correct UV outputs?" Take it easy on me. :rofl: I can't re read your posts anymore, my head hurts. :p

To further complicate matters, Dr. W mentioned to me that fluorescent fixtures have a very rapid flicker effect that's not discernable to human eyes but is discernable to parrot eyes. He says that multiple bulbs will minimize the effect, because they will flicker on different cycles, but there's also something that can be added to the fixtue (I think it may be a special kind of ballast) that gets rid of it. It's something that I still need to research.

Thank you for this thread, Sarah, and for sharing the fruits of your research.
This I have read too. I have not yet gone to the store to test my findings but I believe all you need is an electronic ballast which I have heard is on most models now a days (not that when you got it home you would notice the flicker,just your bird would). The CFL's I'm told are self ballasted but as I said, I'm still learning. I have not done a ton of research yet with the tubes but I did contact phillips because so many people here use them.
 

sodakat

Rollerblading along the road
Joined
3/11/11
Messages
3,297
Location
South Dakota
Real Name
Kathy
I don't understand that percentage reading of the UVB rays. Aren't we trying to get between 200 and 300? What does .05 percent mean?
 

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,902
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
This is where my head started hurting. :confused: I have this that did not help much.

http://www.harrisonsbirdfoods.com/examiners/AE29.pdf

Provision of ultraviolet light for captive grey parrots

In the wild state psittacine birds are normally exposed to two ultraviolet wavelengths from the sun’s radiation known as UVA (315-400nm) and UVB (290-315nm). Both forms of ultraviolet radiation are vital for normal parrot behaviour and body function. When keeping a parrot in captivity the provision of both UVA and UVB radiation should be considered to recreate natural conditions.

Function of UVA in Psittacine birds

UVA is important for normal vision in birds, allowing them to visualise UV-reflective plumage. The colour vision of birds is based on absorption peaks in the green, blue red and ultraviolet regions of the spectrum. Studies in budgerigars have demonstrated that in the presence of ultraviolet light, vision may play an important role in mate and food selection in birds by revealing UV reflective plumage. This has been shown to improve mating behaviour in budgerigars thereby improving breeding results. It has been shown that 72% of parrots have UV reflective plumage so it might be expected than UVA radiation has an important role to play in breeding activities and normal behaviour in this group of birds.

Function of UVB in Psittacine birds

Birds can obtain vitamin D from their diet or by endogenous synthesis due to the action of UVB radiation on vitamin D precursors secreted onto the featherless areas of the skin. The vitamin D is formed by number of complex biochemical reactions in the bird involving the liver and kidney. Once sufficient D3 has been formed by the action of UVB radiation additional solar radiation transforms the provitamin D3 to two biologically inactive compounds. This explains why hypervitaminosis D has never been reported from excessive exposure to UVB light. This contrasts with hypervitaminosis D from excess dietary vitamin D, which is reported in parrots especially in macaws. It has been demonstrated that chickens require 30 minutes artificial UVB radiation when fed a vitamin D3 deficient diet to produce enough vitamin D to prevent disorders of calcium metabolism.
Provision of UVB and UVA radiation

Exposure to direct unfiltered sunlight is the optimal way to provide UVB and UVA radiation. It should be taken into account that in northern latitudes the amount of ultraviolet radiation received by the birds would be reduced compared with their equatorial homes. The ultraviolet light required for endogenous vitamin D3 synthesis can also be supplied using artificial lamps manufactured to provide both UVB and UVA radiation. These are commercially available, specifically designed for birds and known as full spectrum lights. The UVB radiation exposure of an individual animal depends on basking behaviour, distance from the light and the presence of UVB filters between the bird and lamp. Frequently the greatest impediment to vitamin D3 synthesis in parrots is the barrier to UVB provided by buildings. Even light transmitting materials such as glass and most plastics do not transmit light in wavelengths below 334nm. It is a common misconception of parrots’ owners that by placing the birds in a window they are providing UVB radiation. The windows will simply filter all the usable UVB from the sun’s rays. The amount of UVB produced by the artificial lamps decays over a period of time so the lamps should be replaced regularly (at least every 6 months practically). The conversion of previtamin D3 to vitamin D3 in the skin is also known to be temperature dependent and the provision of heat may be useful in colder climates. The UVB output of most lamps is described in terms of a percentage of UVB production rather than irradiance and the author recommends a bulb that produces 2.4% UVB.
 

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,902
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
I'll add this here.

I am emailing to find out about your F32T8/TL950 Fluorescent tubes.
I see that they are 5000k and 98 CRI. Could you tell me the UVA and UVB outputs on them if any?

Dear Customer,

Thank you for contacting Philips Lighting Customer Care.
I apologize for the delay in our response, I have checked with our Product Manager and have received the following response:
Lamp Type UV-FDA1 (W/cm^2) UV-FDA2 (W/cm^2) UV-FDA3 (W/cm^2)
F32T8/TL950 3.79E-06 7.13E-07 1.46E-08

Translation..... No UV outputs
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top