Considering TAG - Decisionmaking criteria I should consider?

[Tazlima]

So in a few days, I'm going to meet a TAG to see if we hit it off, and I wanted to know how to keep sentiment out of the decision. I feel bad for this bird. It seems to be in a physically decent environment... not great, but comfortable enough, but the current owners seem to view it less not as a member of the family, or even a pet, really, but a piece of furniture that requires more work than they expected when they acquired it a few months ago.

They don't refer to it by name (and didn't provide one, even when asked), and when I asked the gender, they way they phrased the answer made me think they've just been calling the poor thing "it" all this time.

So of course, I want to bring the little birdy home and give it all the love and attention, but that doesn't mean she'll even like us (see... is it so hard to just pick a pronoun? It's not like I can't change it later if birdy turns out to be male), and in that case, maybe it's better to pass and let the bird pick someone it likes better.

The thing is... a bird is SUCH a long-term commitment that it's not a decision to take lightly, and I feel like this meeting will be a one-time thing, take it or leave it.

Boyfriend was like, "we could get it, and if things don't work out, we can always re-home," but I just can't think that way. If I take on this responsibility, it's for life - barring extreme exceptions (e.g. if I developed severe health problems that made it impossible to continue caring for the bird).

Sorry for rambling; I've got a lot on my mind. I've wanted an African Grey for a good twenty years, and my little Quaker is now at a point, behaviorally and emotionally, where I think he'll benefit from having another bird in the house. (Even if they don't get along and have to be kept separate forever, he needs someone to bird at, yanno?) Someone to chatter back and forth with. Someone to observe playing to help him learn new ways of interacting with toys. Someone to compete with in training sessions. Hopefully a buddy, but at worst, a neighbor who knows what it's like to be a bird in a human world.

I'm ready for a second bird. I wasn't even going to respond to the ad, but after seeing it, I couldn't get the little TAG out of my mind and finally, two days later and at boyfriend's urging (SHOCK! He HATED Gus at first - bitey little booger that he was back then, but has grown to love him so much that he's perfectly open to the idea of a second bird - I knew he'd warmed up to Gus over time, but had no idea his feelings had changed so utterly), and decided to reach out for more information.

...but it needs to be the right bird. How can I tell, with what will probably be a single meeting with a decision to be made at the end, whether this is the right choice for my household? Let's say she's aggressive to everybody, the current owners and myself? How do I know if that aggression is just general unhappiness... or if it's personal and the bird hates me and will never want anything to do with me? For all I know, I might resemble someone bad from her past. The unusual cage setup also makes me suspect she's been exposed to waaaaay too much light (I wouldn't be surprised to hear she was exposed to light 24 hours a day) and is likely hormonal as all getout, which will affect her behavior.

I always hear stories about birds that hated everyone else and took a surprise sudden liking to one particular individual, who took it home and they lived happily ever after. But what about birds who DON'T hit it off right away like that? What if I'm NOT that person? Is it better to just pass and hope she and I both find a better fit, or take birdy home and hope she comes around with enough TLC?

Are there criteria I'm not even considering? From the picture, she doesn't appear to pluck, and she's on a decent diet, so I'm not expecting surprise health problems.

Aaaargh. Am I just overthinking this? But then... it's a big decision. It SHOULD be overthought.

 

[Kodigirl210]

You are overthinking it and while it is an extremely large commitment the truth is either you will or won’t. You will know it probably as soon as you lay eyes on them. (They, them = gender neutral)

Things to look for physically would be any sign of illness. The Grey should have clear eyes, clear cere and nostrils. The wings should be folded comfortably against the body - so neither dropping or raised unevenly. Each foot should have 4-toes that should be flexible and not lumpy or overly dry. The beak may have chipping and flaking but it shouldn’t be offset. Also observe the Grey with its mouth closed. Most people who don’t care about a bird won’t notice if the beak has gotten to long so the Grey cannot properly close its mouth or grind it’s food. That would contribute to low food intake and physical symptoms from not eating enough.

Temperament is really hard to judge. The Grey maybe so excited to come out of their cage that they jump on you just as something representing freedom and then be hell-o-wheels cage protective when you get them home.

Definitely look for overtly aggressive signs: gaping beak, hissing, growling, wing bats, eye pinning and fluffing. I feel that on Greys it is particularly noticeable because when they are angry or scared their entire chest vibrates and the feathers ripple back and forth at super speed as opposed to I’m fluffed up because I’m cold or uncertain.

As long as I’ve been around birds I have heard the girl birds like boys and boy like girls fairy tale and that’s all it is. So if the Grey chooses to be nice to the bf, they may genuinely like him. I have 3-girl birds and they are the loves of my life next to my daughter and we’ve never had an issue. So conversely if the TAG reacts violently to you and not the bf or vice versa it could truly represent how they will bond in their new environment. It may also only be that way at the current house and change once you get them home.

So now that you’ve read some of that rambling, make you can understand when I say you will either take the bird or you won’t and you will know the minute you lay eyes on the TAG. I know I did with Sif and I had a choice between her and another baby. And in spite of all the health problems and everything else, we are tightly bonded and I wouldn’t trade for anything.

I hope you find what you are looking for. Remember though that you have to look in order to find.

 

[Lady Jane]

Boyfriend was like, "we could get it, and if things don't work out, we can always re-home

Well your male friend is not on board with a statement like this.

I had a Timneh grey for several years. She was a joy for sure. I developed rather crippling osteoarthritis and osteoporosis and could no longer take care of my birds needs. That is why I have little birds now. You have state many questions and some doubts. You are a young person whos life may change and the bird will no longer have a home. Re homing a bird is a major issue for them. It is good if you can see the world through the eyes of a parrot. They like and do best with stability and routines. Can you honestly say to yourself that you can provide these?

 

[Tazlima]

Well your male friend is not on board with a statement like this.

Lol, it does sound bad doesn't it? He sincerely meant it to be helpful... he's just not experienced enough with birds to realize why it was a problematic thing to say. (Like someone telling a woman who's just had a miscarriage that "they can always have another." Well-intentioned, but tone-deaf and just the worst thing you could say).

No worries. I set him straight. I asked him to imagine how Gus would feel if, after living with us for so long, we up and sent him away tomorrow. He was like, "Oh, man, that would be terrible! It took him months to get really comfortable with us, and he's part of the family! It would break his heart!"

"Exactly! Which is why I would never take in a bird with that thought in the back of my head. It would just be cruel. If we're that unsure about the bird, better not to take it at all and hope it finds a better match."

He saw my point and apologized.

Basically, the pets in the house are my domain. Boyfriend loves them, and snuggles and plays with them. He helps with the feeding and chores, but I'm the one who handles training and diet and medical care, simply because I'm the one with experience (the last time he had a pet of his very own was a beloved cat he had as a teenager... I was a vet tech for 7 years). He's actually learned a TON since we've lived together, he's always willing to listen and learn, and he's a big 'ol softy when it comes to cute little critters.

I had a Timneh grey for several years. She was a joy for sure. I developed rather crippling osteoarthritis and osteoporosis and could no longer take care of my birds needs. That is why I have little birds now. You have state many questions and some doubts. You are a young person whos life may change and the bird will no longer have a home. Re homing a bird is a major issue for them. It is good if you can see the world through the eyes of a parrot. They like and do best with stability and routines. Can you honestly say to yourself that you can provide these?

Lol, yep. Stability isn't a problem.

I'm guess my post must have come across as young-sounding because I'm less sure of myself when it comes to birds (and also really excited to finally be actively looking for a bird I've wanted forever), but I'm middle-aged and have owned my home for 10 years. I'm a dab hand at "routine."

 

[Lady Jane]

I did think you were in your twenties. Thanks for clarifications.

 

[Sweet Louise]

They may be able to tell you about the birds aggressiveness/friendliness but that will only be an indicator. Birds react and respond differently. My CAG is a fm and she loves loves loves my very feminine friend. She loves me too. She seems to be hesitant around males.They can become one person birds but the more socialization the more likely they will accept others. Again, every thing varies by bird and their behavior can change in a different environment and over time. I find Louise pretty responsive to a behavior plan, you do this, this happens-consistently. She went through a phase where she had had had to be on me and in everything I touched (computer, food, mail...). I rewarded independent play and put her back in her apartment (cage) when she flew on to me without permission. I was more interested in a couple of different types of birds but am glad I ended up with a CAG. Perfect size. Not particularly loud. Intelligent. Pretty calm. Relational. Not bitey- and when she does it is more of warning and not a bite and twist. Good at communication/fairly easy to read. She will do the grey sneak-bend her head for scratches then bite. She can be cage protective-but even then there are some fairly easy solutions. Varies by bird, she has only drawn blood 3 times (and it was predictable, she didn't want a hand near her) and even rarely nips--again, she is easy to read. It is very much like having a toddler. Needs constant supervision when out--from other pets and all the things she loves to explore and shred. Hard to know if the bird will like you, hate you at first, or for a lifetime. The behavior may change over time with training and development of trust. I have thought about another bird and personally wouldn't care if it didn't like me as long as it had a good life and was otherwise happy. I can't get a second bird for a couple of reasons....There is good info on the "good bad and ugly about African Grays" article hereon AA. I hope it works out for you and the bird. If you want a bird, the right one is out there, many needing homes.

 

[Kodigirl210]

Any updates? Did you go to meet the TAG?

 

[Mockinbirdiva]

One important thing to consider is the dust produced by Grays is harmful to other birds. If you do a look using the search bar above you'll find posts where members have lost birds from long term exposure to Gray dust. Just a thought to give you insight on how you will house two different species in your home.

 

[Tazlima]

I has a TAG! And she's wonderful!

My concerns about the circumstances (and all the possible associated behavioral issues) turned out to be unfounded. Basically the previous owner was being close-lipped as a way to vet ME - seeing what questions I asked, etc- and I misconstrued that minimum of information as a minimum of caring. She was actually a charming woman who very clearly cares greatly about animals, and Boo (the grey) is a well-adjusted sweetheart.

I spent all yesterday scrubbing and sterilizing and getting everything set up to follow the quarantine protocol and help her settle in.

She's obviously nervous right now, all her movements are slow and cautious. I know that will change, but right now, I feel like I'm splitting my time between Tigger and Eeyore, lol. She's even flighted, which I'm really happy about!

Next challenge, getting her clean. She was getting squirt bottle mistings a couple times a month, which IMO isn't nearly enough, and the previous owner said Boo hated the whole process (even if she sprayed the water in the air and let it fall down onto her), so I'll be experimenting with bringing her into the bathroom for showers/steam baths, and offering pans of water to see if she's more of a bath gal.

Boyfriend is in awe of her.

 

[Tazlima]

One important thing to consider is the dust produced by Grays is harmful to other birds. If you do a look using the search bar above you'll find posts where members have lost birds from long term exposure to Gray dust. Just a thought to give you insight on how you will house two different species in your home.

Ooh! Thanks for bringing this up! I knew the dust would mean extra cleaning, but I don't want Gus to be harmed, and I honestly hadn't considered that aspect.

My plans right now mostly involve frequent, daily or every-other-day, bathing and lots and lots of sweeping and dusting. My house is laid out in such a way that the front and back door are on opposite sides of the living room (where eventually both birds will be situated), so when I clean, I regularly close the cage doors, open both doors, and turn on the fans to air everything out (on windy days, you can get a strong breeze blowing right through the place).

Is regular airing out in a room that well-ventilated sufficient to clear out the powder down particles in the air, do you think? I've considered getting an air filter in the past, but it's my understanding that letting the outside air come through in that way tends to negate what a filter would do, since every time you open the doors, it lets in a whole new batch of pollen and stuff from outside (nobody in the house has allergies that would be bothered by those items, so it was a non-issue for us).

If I DO get an air filter, would it be better to position it by the grey, to suck up a maximum of dust as it's produced? Or by the quaker, to ensure the cleanest possible air in his personal space? (Once quarantine is over, my current plan would place their cages about 12 feet apart. Is that too close together, do you think?).

 

[Kodigirl210]

Yes get an air purifier and under absolutely no circumstances sweep or dust! Vacuum with a vacuum that has a HEPA filter and wet mop. You don’t want to throw more dust in the air when you clean as that defeats the purpose lol.

Put the air purifier closer to the Grey as she’s producing it. Also looking into get a humidifier. Keep the air most will cut down on floating particles plus it keeps everyone’s skin, nose and lungs from drying out.

I’m so happy you found your girl. Put up pics soon

 

[BertAllen]

When Tinker flies around he stirs up more dust than any wind would blowing trough from the front windows to the back ones in my place. I have central air system that picks up probably 90% as we are not dusting anymore than normal.

 

[Tazlima]

We'll definitely be getting an air purifier.

Report on Boo's first full day home: She's clearly anxious and upset. She's mostly sitting on her cage, doesn't want to step up or move around very much, but she's willing to accept comforting from us, which I'm really glad of. I'll offer my arm for a step-up, and she responds with lowering her head to request scratches, so I pet her a bit and then back off again. She'll come around. She's stepped up for me three times so far, which is more than I expected.

I managed to coax her into taking a shower. She actually took to it better than I expected - I would have been content for her to sit on her stand in the bathroom and just get some steam, but she actually wanted to come into the water! So she got a good soaking and should be feeling lovely and clean now. (She was a bit grungy, had a layer of down compressed against her skin at the base of her feathers. It was weird - when you scratched her, you couldn't really feel the skin at all... just this thin layer of softness. After the shower it was gone).

She didn't eat much yesterday - turned her nose up at her morning salad and barely touched her evening pellets. Practically all she ate were the bits of cheese we offered as treats. So I went all-out this morning and scrambled some eggs to go with her breakfast. That did the trick. She was chowing down when I left for work.

I think she's going to need some flying lessons, too. She has all her feathers, but I've only seen her fly once, when she was startled, and it was less "flying" and more "breaking a fall."

In other news: Apparently we're now officially the "bird people." Boyfriend came home and was like, "my coworker has... I forget, either a cockatoo or a cockatiel... that he got for his kids and they're not really interested. He asked if we'd be willing to take it. He'll give it to us for free, with the cage and toys and everything. I told him we'd have to think about it."

I was like, "Ummm... is it a cockatoo or a cockatiel? Those are VERY different birds. A cockatiel is a maybe, but we'd have to wait, at a minimum, until Boo's quarantine is over and she's really settled in. Cockatoos, though, are huge, and even the aerodrome (our nickname for the high-ceilinged main room where Gus does most of his flying) isn't big enough for it to exercise properly. We just don't have space for a bird that size.

Boyfriend's pretty sure it's a cockatiel... and I'm pretty sure we're going to end up with a third bird, lol.

 

[Kodigirl210]

Just be absolutely sure. A ‘Too is definitely way different than a ‘’Tiel & a Too you couldn’t pay me enough to take one on a permanent basis. Maybe as a foster but fed not a forever home. My 2-babies are demanding enough as it is. Sif (CAG) has been a huge birdie-but today and last night Pippin (GCC) just kept screaming at me cuz I wasn’t getting to bed fast enough to suit her. Luckily the 3rd bird is my daughter’s so I can just pass Isen off lol.

It sounds like Boo is doing well. Happy that she found a home that didn’t involve a rescue/shelter first. I think a lot of times that’s too traumatizing for a lot of the bigger birds tho I’m sure the littles don’t like it much either. You save who can and pray for the rest.


Ps where are the pics!?!

 

[Tazlima]

Lol, agreed! I love the larger birds, but there's no way I could properly house one in my little home.

Pics will be coming. I'm so busy running back and forth making sure everybody's happy and clean and fed and adjusting to the new rhythm of care that I haven't had a free moment to think about snapping pictures, but I should have some free time this weekend to have a little photo shoot.