• Welcome to Avian Avenue! To view our forum with less advertisments please register with us.
    Memberships are free and it will just take a moment. Click here
  • This forum is for advice about initial treatment given to your injured/sick bird until a qualified avian veterinarian is available.
    THIS IS NOT MEANT TO REPLACE VET CARE

Urgent CA EDTA Treatment

jmfleish

Cruising the avenue
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/19/09
Messages
13,328
Location
Madison, WI
Real Name
Jen
I do not understand the Lupron shot for a male. Have you done any research on it? I've literally only heard it used on females for stopping egg laying. If you don't mind me asking, what area of the country are you located in? Maybe someone can suggest a vet to try. I can see if my vet has any suggestions but he's the one who said Reggie was just one of those nutty Cockatoos...can't say that he was wrong though!;)
 

Clueless

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avenue Concierge
Joined
11/3/12
Messages
24,162
What bowls does he get his food and water out of?

I think I heard a vet speak about that, something in the bowl leached out
 

Clueless

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avenue Concierge
Joined
11/3/12
Messages
24,162
Not brilliant at all. Should have read thread earlier. Hope it helps to get answers.
 

jmfleish

Cruising the avenue
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/19/09
Messages
13,328
Location
Madison, WI
Real Name
Jen
OMG! I never thought of the bowls! Great question!
 

Clueless

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avenue Concierge
Joined
11/3/12
Messages
24,162

Hankmacaw

Ripping up the road
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avian Angel
Avenue Concierge
Joined
10/18/09
Messages
1,000,001
Location
Arizona
Real Name
Mary Lynn Skinner
It was a vet at tasc in 2013 that I heard. I was thinking it was food or water in stainless bowls that weren't good quality.
My vet insists that I use all stainless and a Lixit bottle (still changed every day). Jasper is a compulsive soup maker if she has a water bowl.
 

Clueless

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avenue Concierge
Joined
11/3/12
Messages
24,162
Yeah but you probably have quality ones. There are probably rotten ones out there too that masquerade as stainless.
 

Hankmacaw

Ripping up the road
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avian Angel
Avenue Concierge
Joined
10/18/09
Messages
1,000,001
Location
Arizona
Real Name
Mary Lynn Skinner
I do not understand the Lupron shot for a male.
Another bit of useless information that I had lurking deeply buried between my two brain cells.
Hormonal Behavior in Companion Parrots
"Drugs for hormonal feather picking: If all these changes fail then drug therapy may be warranted. Drug therapy is most effective in females but has also be tried in males. Lupron (leuprorelin acetate) has an inhibitory effect on the pituitary that should reduce the hormones FSH and LH. This drug has been used in birds forchronic egg laying, hormonal aggression and feather picking. Again, this is not a perfect drug and certainly not for all situations."
 

melissasparrots

Rollerblading along the road
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
1/9/11
Messages
4,085
Location
Iowa
If its going to be several days before the results come back and if they come back high, you might ask your vet if the lab noted any hemolysis. Basically this is where the red blood cells rupture. Sometimes due to sitting around for a little too long during transport or over a weekend. So any zinc inside the cells goes into the serum and can give an artificially high zinc level. Ariel's highest zinc level was a draw done in the evening on a friday and didn't go out to the lab until the next monday. Plus a couple days beyond that before the sample was run due to transport and workload at the lab. So again, I would not rule out that maybe he doesn't have zinc problems. I'm not a vet, so maybe he does. However, its a pretty typical pattern for a plucking bird to stop plucking when on meds. Any kind of meds. Especially those that make them feel even more crummy than the did before. Ariel plucked less when she was on chelation thearapy. She also plucked less when just on Baytril as a shot in the dark treatment. This from a bird that never had zinc poisoning to start with.

So, in light of all that, I can see why possibly the vet thinks its time to give his body a break from the Ca EDTA and try other things. Although, if the Lupron helps, I would seriously have to wonder if its just because it threw his hormones all out of whack compared to normal, left him feeling a little different than normal and diminished plucking. I know this isn't the most helpful post for you. I understand what your going through and it sucks.

Another off beat thought, you might want to ask your vet about children's benedryl. Supposedly, if it works on the bird, it can be a sign that the problem is an allergy. However, its also debatable if birds even have a similar immune response with allergies. Ariel almost certainly has allergies. However, Benedryl did sedate her initially enough to reduce plucking. Then I think her body adapted to it and she started plucking again. It could also give you an idea of how this bird responds to taking medication. If you see the same response from him when given a completely unrelated drug by the same means(oral via syringe or injection) then it ups the chances that his symptoms have nothing to do with chelation at all and more to do with just being given a drug. I'm just throwing out alternate explanations here. All things to run by your vet before trying anything.

Hope I didn't just frustrate you more. As usual for anything plucking related, check for changes in climate and air quality. Before I discovered Noni juice for Ariel, she plucked through the spring, summer and fall but was far more frantic about it on days that either I cleaned and kicked up a bunch of dust, or the A/c was running a lot and blowing stuff around. She was also worse on bath days.

Possibly try some holistic type anti-inflammatory stuff. Easy things you can do at home. Like adding a drop or two of good quality flaxseed oil to his diet. Possibly good foods that have anti-inflammatory properties and if its bird safe and can fit into an overall healthy diet, try to increase those things.
 

tiger1962

Meeting neighbors
Joined
2/28/12
Messages
30
Location
U.S.A.
I live in the North East part of the USA.......His food and water bowls are the ones that came with his cage. I have not tested the bowls but they appear to be stainless steel bowls. They're not ceramic or plastic or colorful. Is there a safe way for me to test his bowls that I won't scald myself or whatnot? I would try that. But the bowls in his cage look like the same bowls most everyone has in their Kings Cage...no rust on his cage or bars. I got rid of all the toys that have chains and metal a while ago and he only drinks bottled water. His cage is near the window where the sun rises in the morning so he gets natural sunlight and a view of trees and bushes in the back of the house (no traffic going by or startling noises or movements). It could not be a more "zen like" and un-threatening type environment if I tried. He's also got a TV on while I'm at work.

If a parrot has neurological damage from a previous condition, would it be constant, or on and off ? When his symptoms creep up, he will eat more, jibber jabber talk more, but I try not to rush to the cage to comfort him because his vet said that might make him do it more to get my attention. He's had two Borna Virus tests - both negative.
 

Clueless

Joyriding the Neighborhood
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Avenue Concierge
Joined
11/3/12
Messages
24,162
I think the Dr I saw was Karen Becker from near Chicago Illinois. Google her and call her office, maybe they could tell you. Explain a friend heard her talk at TASC and you are trying to search every avenue to help your Bird
 

tiger1962

Meeting neighbors
Joined
2/28/12
Messages
30
Location
U.S.A.
Interesting to mention...when he twitches and plucks - the areas he pulls from changes. It initially started just on his legs only. When his symptoms returned, the areas became his back (spine), the area around his vent / base of tail feathers, then he went back to his legs, then under his wings....now it's his back/spine again. Not sure if that means anything or not.
 

Monica

Cruising the avenue
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
5/18/10
Messages
11,269
Location
Hell, NV
Real Name
Monica
Please understand that the vets don't know everything, and it may require multiple tests before anything can be figured out.... if anything can at all. They are only human, after all. I do understand your frustration. Sometimes, all that's required is a fresh set of eyes - or several.

I hope you are able to find out the cause to his irritation.
 

murphys girl

Meeting neighbors
Joined
4/8/15
Messages
50
Real Name
cathy
Well here we go again ! Sheesh!! Every time I think he's getting better, his symptoms return. Came home last night to find a cage floor full of feathers and him twitching again. (he was FINE in the morning).....He's been off the CA EDTA for roughly a month and his symptoms were at times gone or very slight. I want to bang my head against the wall. The hopeful thing was that it WAS about a month with little to no symptoms. Perhaps the zinc is not gone yet ? But I do NOT think this is hormonal.... I'm waiting on results from this last zinc test which would be the 5th zinc test. Ughhhhh....I want to scream. :arghh:
Anything new on the zinc? I've been g hi join n through the same thing, same symptoms. Thanks
 
Top