Breeding Pluckers?

[cosmolove]

Hey everyone, first I wanted to start with I do NOT want to get into the debate about breeding versus not. I have no intentions of breeding. I just see breeders post in a facebook group again and I noticed something and was curious

I've noticed a lot of breeding birds being plucked. Does anyone have any ideas as to why this is? I know some birds just pluck and there is nothing you can do to stop it but it just seems really common to see bigger birds plucked when they're breeders.

 

[CrazyBirdChick]

I have no idea but my guess would be that they had no choice in their mate?

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

The two threads about plucking recently were the problem with a cock bird plucking the babies and trying to kick them out of the nest so he could breed his hen again. He simply wants more sex and the only way to get that is with an empty nest box. The only solution to this problem is to remove the abusive cock and allow the hen to feed the babies till them fledge (leave the box freely) when the cock is to then take care of them, following them on their fledgling flights and feeding them when they need it. If the youngest baby is at least five weeks old, one can turn them out of the nest box onto the grate and remove the nest box to foil the cock. This sometimes works, especially if the older chick finds the open door of the cage and takes his first flight and turns daddy abuser into daddy caregiver through instinct.

Otherwise, plucking can be in response to a pain like an injured bone, a skin condition like dryness, etc, or idiopathic which is fancy Latin for "I don't know". If you have questions about plucking and pluckers you could look up some of the old threads in the bird or birds you are interested in section. KNOCK ON WOOD, I have had only one plucker and this was a hen who I feel was forcibly raped and abused by her brother cock. She was afraid of cock birds in general and lived in a cage completely populated by hens for her entire 13 year life. My vet and I felt her plucking was related to her abuse by her brother. I have never let a brother/sister pair close to sexual maturity alone in a cage again; always at least one other bird, and usually a pair, with them.

 

[cosmolove]

I actually noticed this with the pair themselves. They would pluck themselves or each other. I never even thought about the babies but that makes sense what you're saying!

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

Sometimes the cock will pluck the crest and head of his mate if she is not properly attendant with preening his feathers to his liking. As a matter of fact, my 17 year old cockatiel, Mindy's, mate plucks her crest routinely until after ten years it no longer even sprouts. Mindy puts up with his plucking, but at times he is especially abusive will pluck his neck in retaliation of his actions on her. Yet, if I remove him from the cage or her presence due to him plucking the babies or her, she screams non-stop until I return him. Yes, Noel is a baby plucker; he will even abuse them physically if he can. I have never allowed him to father babies after he plucked his daughters four years ago. Wendoll and Joey are not pluckers, however, nor are his other two daughters, MJ and Azure.

 

[gonenow]

One of my cockatiels has plucked the other for a couple of years as I've had them since babies and they're four now. But it's not aggressively, the other bird will actually lower her head to be preened even though she knows what will probably happen. She'll even lower her head again after a feather has been pulled out for more. She never plucks back. Over the years I've managed to lessen how frequent it happens but interestingly when I got them as babies, they were in a bad state having been plucked by their parents, so the breeder said. So I wonder if that's where she learned it or whether it's a dominance thing as the plucker is definitely the boss of the two.

As to why it happens in breeding birds, I can't imagine most are that happy. The vast majority of breeding birds live in small cages and don't have much of a life, sadly a lot of breeders don't care about the birds as much as making a buck off of them. I know that's not the case for everyone but anytime I see birds advertised and there's pictures of their surroundings, it doesn't look good.

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

Not all breeders keep their birds in squalor and without toys, so do not paint all breeders with the same brush. Never pass judgement until you see what is real. Breeding birds often pluck due to boredom and not much else to do. Then there is the stress of the scary human perhaps manhandling them roughly, not waiting for a step up, etc....

That being said, do you know the sex of your bird? It could be a male plucking a hen or another cock. If they are both cocks, the plucking could be dominance. It could be learned behavior, but I would separate them and allow the other to regrow all their feathers. Frequently plucked feathers get follicles that won't produce feathers after a lot of abuse. Sit their cages side by side to avoid screaming.

 

[JLcribber]

Well if you look at it realistically it's not much different from a puppy mill or any other kind of breeding operation. Those birds are not there to be entertained or enriched or live like an actual bird. They are there to breed. They are a product. They are stuck in a confined space with hormones raging. There is absolutely nothing else to do but preen, over preen and soon enough pluck. I'm surprised that not "all" breeders are plucked clean.

 

[Ankou]

I can't speak for the birds you are seeing, but I have also noticed a lot of breeders keep their birds in near empty cages. No toys or enrichment, just perches and a nest box.
I'm told it's so the birds can focus on each other and nesting. We also know hormonal overdrive can cause plucking in companion birds too. Not to mention if the bird seems outwardly healthy and can still breed, vet care might be entirely dependent on the value of the specific bird in the hands of an unethical breeder.
Yes I know not all breeders do this, I do believe there is such a thing as ethical breeders, but many do. Unfortunately breeders trying to provide for their birds like many on AA do seem to be in a small minority.
Kudos to those that do care, I know they are out there and I'm not trying to lump all breeders together, but many are either ignorant or concerned with money. I am told by people who do it "right" there is very little to no profit involved due to the expenses.

On less depressing note I also know in some bird species, some hens will instinctively pluck their own chests or bellies. Soft nesting materials and more heat will reach the eggs so I've been told.

 

[JLcribber]

I just see breeders post in a facebook group again

The supposedly helpful bird groups have on facemob are bad enough. I can just imagine the quality of membership in those groups.

 

[cosmolove]

I can't speak for the birds you are seeing, but I have also noticed a lot of breeders keep their birds in near empty cages. No toys or enrichment, just perches and a nest box.
I'm told it's so the birds can focus on each other and nesting. We also know hormonal overdrive can cause plucking in companion birds too. Not to mention if the bird seems outwardly healthy and can still breed, vet care might be entirely dependent on the value of the specific bird in the hands of an unethical breeder.
Yes I know not all breeders do this, I do believe there is such a thing as ethical breeders, but many do. Unfortunately breeders trying to provide for their birds like many on AA do seem to be in a small minority.
Kudos to those that do care, I know they are out there and I'm not trying to lump all breeders together, but many are either ignorant or concerned with money. I am told by people who do it "right" there is very little to no profit involved due to the expenses.

On less depressing note I also know in some bird species, some hens will instinctively pluck their own chests or bellies. Soft nesting materials and more heat will reach the eggs so I've been told.

I also had noticed this and I had been told that before once in a discussion too. I was told that breeders shouldn't have toys or foraging opportunities so they can focus on breeding and raising the babies. I always wondered how true that is tho. I personally breed dogs and I wouldn't take away my adult dogs enrichment just because we have puppies around. If anything they get spoiled and loved on more then. I've never had a problem with the dogs being too focused on their toys and such rather than taking care of the puppies so I really wondered how this could be true for birds.

I have also heard of hens plucking their feathers for their nests. I know that's super normal with a lot of species of animal and birds. I guess I understand that a little more but usually the plucking I see is on the tops of heads and such and you can clearly tell which one is the plucker versus the pluckee lol.

 

[Laurul Feather Cat]

Do you know most parrots have a ventral cleft, right up the middle of their lower abdomen and chest, and they use muscles the pull the feathers apart before sitting on eggs. Sometimes you can clearly see it when they do a well bird stretch. My Sunshine Senegal trusts me enough for me to gently touch the exposed warm skin.

 

[karen256]

Sometimes birds become breeders because they pluck. It's not a good thing, but you used to hear of people being told their bird's plucking was hormonal and they should be bred. That doesn't seem to be the case anymore, but I'm sure some pairs that have been together for 10-20 years or more may have been set up to breed because they plucked.
Some breeding birds pluck from boredom or stress or health issues, same as pets. Breeders are often not tame so they may be more stressed than pets.
Breeding females will often pluck a small brood patch to help incubate the eggs, and that is perfectly normal, although not all will do it.