birdlovekk
Sitting on the front steps
- Joined
- 4/16/18
- Messages
- 19
Hi all! I've been reading posts, but this is my first time posting. I'm really desperate for advice. One of my birds nearly died the day before yesterday, and the other one has been quite sick for three weeks. I hope someone has experience with these medications.
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Short version:
I have two budgies, Pineapple and Biscuit. Pineapple has had an on and off stuffy nose for a couple of months, and the flesh above her nose started swelling up. Vet prescribed Baytril + Doxycycline + Meloxicam + Vitamin A + Vitamin B Complex mixed with sugar water (for taste), 0.1mL twice a day, for three weeks. Does this sound reasonable?
I asked and the vet very unhappily agreed to change to Doxycycline mixed with sugar water (for taste), 0.05mL twice a day, for three weeks. Does this sound reasonable?
Biscuit, meanwhile, has a yeast infection. Vet prescribed Nyastin mixed with sugar water (for taste), 0.05mL twice a day, for ten days. However, I can't give her this medication for reasons described below. I suspect the yeast infection came from Pineapple, who developed it first as a result of the antibiotic and worsened by the sugar water.
Questions:
1. Should I switch to giving Pineapple the mix of three drugs, or continue with only the Doxycycline?
2. Should I ask my doctor for a new medication mix without the sugar water, and if yes, how do I phrase it so that he will agree and not just kick me out entirely?
3. Can Apple Cider Vinegar possibly cure yeast infections? At least, if I try it for a week, can it hurt my birds? How can I convince them to drink it if they don't like it?
4. Anything else you can suggest?
-----
Long version:
I have a 43-gram yellow budgie named Pineapple, and also a 34-gram blue budgie named Biscuit. Pineapple has had an on and off stuffy nose for a couple of months, and I didn't think anything of it because it always went away on its own. Three weeks ago, however, the flesh above her nose suddenly ballooned. It's really hard to find avian vets where I live. I found one (who also see all other types of animals).
The vet looked at her (no tests) and diagnosed it as sinusitis. He prescribed her lysin in a mix of unspecified nutrients, 0.1mL thrice daily. However, he said it probably wouldn't work, and the swelling would never go away. He recommended surgery as the only permanent cure. He then sold me a heat lamp, which I set up. Since it's summer now and about 21-29 degrees C, I only used it occasionally with the cage covers off in the daytime, or at night with the covers on.
My bird was very good and lapped up the lysin on her own from a cup, so I didn't have to use a syringe. I tried the lysin for a week, and the swollen part turned yellow and hard and fell off! I took her back to the vet to ask what was going on, since he had said the swelling would never go away. This time, he was very impatient with me. He told me that this was a normal part of the cycle, and that the swelling would just come back. He berated me for not keeping my bird warm enough, and he told me that surgery was the only option now.
I asked about how effective the surgery was, and he said that about 70-80% of the birds this size make it. Well, I didn't want to risk that, especially since she seemed quite happy and was behaving normally. (I thought that it was better for her to die happy at home later, even if by only a few days, rather than to die now in the hands of a stranger.)
I continued to give Pineapple the lysin, but two days later, the swelling indeed came back. I found a new vet farther away (also sees all types of animals). He looked at her and listened to her with a stethoscope, and he said she probably had chlamydia. He said that a test was available, but it would take a week, and it was only 50% accurate, so he recommended against it. He prescribed Baytril + Doxycycline + Meloxicam + Vitamin A + Vitamin B Complex mixed with sugar water, 0.1mL twice a day, for three weeks.
I tried the cup trick with Pineapple, but she took one lick and ran away. I then fed her the medicine with a syringe. My bird threw up all over the place and was extremely uncomfortable for an hour after. I was worried that it was too many medications at once. When I searched online, I found that both Baytril and Doxycycline can cause vomiting, and that Meloxicam is not well tested for birds. I called the vet. The vet said it was probably the taste of the Doxycycline that made her throw up, and not to worry. However, after I asked, he agreed to give me only Doxycycline, at 0.05mL twice a day, for three weeks.
I picked up the medicine the next day. Pineapple still hated it, would still look really uncomfortable and sometimes vomit anywhere from 10 minutes to 50 minutes after. I figured I was doing her good, though, so I (we) soldiered on, even though it was (is) breaking my heart. She was so happy even while she was sick, and now I was torturing her twice a day. She started eating less, and I had to tempt her with millet and shove carrots and fruit and leaves in front of her, when normally she would be flying over to snatch it from me.
All of a sudden, two weeks later, my other bird, Biscuit, became lethargic one day and started throwing up. She threw up all night. The next day, she refused food and water and sat on the perch all puffed up. She still wanted to come outside, but then she would sit on the floor with her eyes half-closed. I thought she was going to die right in front of me!
I rushed Biscuit to the vet, and the vet did a crop swab and said she had developed a yeast infection. He prescribed Nyastin, 0.05mL twice daily, for 10 days.
By this time, tbh, I was very much regretting taking my birds to the vet at all. It's a 20-30 minute taxi ride there, and the room is cold, and the birds are stressed out. And then, everytime I give Pineapple her medicine, she is stressed out, and Biscuit is also super stressed out. Pineapple is naturally more chill, but Biscuit is very high-strung. I was (and am) absolutely convinced that if I give her medicine twice a day, she will die. I am not exaggerrating at all. I've raised this bird from two or three weeks old, and I know her personality.
(Before you ask, no, the vet does not have other ways to administer the medication to my birds. No shots or water soluble medication. He did suggest a crop needle as an easier feeding mechanism, though if done wrong it can rupture the esophagus. I'm terrified I'll injure my birds, so that is not an option.)
After getting back from the vet, I laid out some food on a towel and talked to Biscuit a lot and played with her. Finally, she did begin eating, and then she seemed to get some energy back. She even pooped a normal-looking poop later, when she'd had broken poop and diahhrea earlier in the day. When I eventually put her back in the cage, she looked much better. I made the decision that I would not give her the medicine. I would just let her live (or die) naturally.
I did read that Apple Cider Vinegar is good for bacteria and fungus, so I bought some Braggs ACV and added three drops to their water cup. I watched as both birds drank some.
The next morning, both birds were a little lethargic, but acting more or less happy. The day after that (today), Biscuit was actually acting like her normal self again! I made them sleep extra long and also take an afternoon nap, but while out, Biscuit was flying all over and eating and singing and everything. I don't know if it was the ACV, or just her immune system recovered, but she seems to be better now.
Pineapple is a different story. She is still quite sleepy, and she was breathing heavily at the vet's so that even he commented on it. Today, while Biscuit was tearing around causing trouble, Pineapple mostly slept, played and ate a little, then slept some more. After her nap, I even found her sleeping on the cage floor instead of a perch. That is a very bad sign. (Once I let her out, however, she flew around a bit and was much perkier. I'm kind of hoping she was on the floor because she was hot and wanted to move away from the heat lamp up top.)
I have been reading things online obsessively, and I read that taking antibiotics often causes a fungal infection, and that a bird with this infection should not eat sugary foods. This is terrible!
I'm now wondering 1) Does Pineapple also have a yeast infection (which she passed to her cagemate) that resulted from the Doxycycline? and 2) Did the sugar water mixed with the Doxycycline make it all the worse?
I want to ask my vet for a sugar-less mix. The vet is already unhappy with me, though. He still thinks I should be giving Pineapple the full mix of medication that he first prescribed. If I go back now and ask him for the changed prescription *and* no sugar because "I read it on the internet", I'm afraid he will altogether refuse to see me anymore. As I said before, finding a vet at all is very difficult. I've already pissed off the first vet by not agreeing to surgery. I don't want to completely sour things with this one, but I also don't want to be slowly killing my bird!
In other news, while Pineapple drank the ACV yesterday, today, she turned up her nose at it, so I switched back to plain water. I'm not sure what to do about the yeast infection, since I don't want to take her back to the vet and give her yet more medication. I read that yeast infections are hard to treat and inevitably come back. My bird's quality of life is already in the dumps. I don't want to force-feed her medicine for the rest of her life. If she's going to die this week, even, I want it to be happy and feeling loved.
Honestly, I think all of this is my fault. I didn't keep Pineapple warm enough, so she got a runny/stuffy nose. I gave her medication that is making her sick, without researching it first, and now she could die while miserable and in pain. My other bird has it too and may die suddenly one day with no warning. Now that I've started the antibiotic, I can't stop, though, so I'm just stuck. And now that they have the yeast infection, I can't reverse time. It's all a big mess and I wish I'd kept them home and happy with me in the first place.
Please, what would you do in my place? I can distract myself in the daytime, but every night I'm just a mess of nerves and worry. I hate this. Even if it winds up being not the best choice, I wish I could settle on a clear path of action. I haven't slept through the night for two weeks, and I'm sure the birds are affected negatively by my mood as well. I could go out more so I'm not affecting them as much, but I'm scared to leave them alone for long, in case this is the last time I will see them.
Okay, I'll stop whining now.
More specifically, can you help answer the following?
1. Should I switch to giving Pineapple the mix of three drugs, or continue with only the Doxycycline?
2. Should I ask my doctor for a new medication mix without the sugar water, and if yes, how do I phrase it so that he will agree and not just kick me out entirely?
3. Can Apple Cider Vinegar possibly cure yeast infections? At least, if I try it for a week, can it hurt my birds? How can I convince them to drink it if they don't like it?
4. Anything else you can suggest?
-----
Short version:
I have two budgies, Pineapple and Biscuit. Pineapple has had an on and off stuffy nose for a couple of months, and the flesh above her nose started swelling up. Vet prescribed Baytril + Doxycycline + Meloxicam + Vitamin A + Vitamin B Complex mixed with sugar water (for taste), 0.1mL twice a day, for three weeks. Does this sound reasonable?
I asked and the vet very unhappily agreed to change to Doxycycline mixed with sugar water (for taste), 0.05mL twice a day, for three weeks. Does this sound reasonable?
Biscuit, meanwhile, has a yeast infection. Vet prescribed Nyastin mixed with sugar water (for taste), 0.05mL twice a day, for ten days. However, I can't give her this medication for reasons described below. I suspect the yeast infection came from Pineapple, who developed it first as a result of the antibiotic and worsened by the sugar water.
Questions:
1. Should I switch to giving Pineapple the mix of three drugs, or continue with only the Doxycycline?
2. Should I ask my doctor for a new medication mix without the sugar water, and if yes, how do I phrase it so that he will agree and not just kick me out entirely?
3. Can Apple Cider Vinegar possibly cure yeast infections? At least, if I try it for a week, can it hurt my birds? How can I convince them to drink it if they don't like it?
4. Anything else you can suggest?
-----
Long version:
I have a 43-gram yellow budgie named Pineapple, and also a 34-gram blue budgie named Biscuit. Pineapple has had an on and off stuffy nose for a couple of months, and I didn't think anything of it because it always went away on its own. Three weeks ago, however, the flesh above her nose suddenly ballooned. It's really hard to find avian vets where I live. I found one (who also see all other types of animals).
The vet looked at her (no tests) and diagnosed it as sinusitis. He prescribed her lysin in a mix of unspecified nutrients, 0.1mL thrice daily. However, he said it probably wouldn't work, and the swelling would never go away. He recommended surgery as the only permanent cure. He then sold me a heat lamp, which I set up. Since it's summer now and about 21-29 degrees C, I only used it occasionally with the cage covers off in the daytime, or at night with the covers on.
My bird was very good and lapped up the lysin on her own from a cup, so I didn't have to use a syringe. I tried the lysin for a week, and the swollen part turned yellow and hard and fell off! I took her back to the vet to ask what was going on, since he had said the swelling would never go away. This time, he was very impatient with me. He told me that this was a normal part of the cycle, and that the swelling would just come back. He berated me for not keeping my bird warm enough, and he told me that surgery was the only option now.
I asked about how effective the surgery was, and he said that about 70-80% of the birds this size make it. Well, I didn't want to risk that, especially since she seemed quite happy and was behaving normally. (I thought that it was better for her to die happy at home later, even if by only a few days, rather than to die now in the hands of a stranger.)
I continued to give Pineapple the lysin, but two days later, the swelling indeed came back. I found a new vet farther away (also sees all types of animals). He looked at her and listened to her with a stethoscope, and he said she probably had chlamydia. He said that a test was available, but it would take a week, and it was only 50% accurate, so he recommended against it. He prescribed Baytril + Doxycycline + Meloxicam + Vitamin A + Vitamin B Complex mixed with sugar water, 0.1mL twice a day, for three weeks.
I tried the cup trick with Pineapple, but she took one lick and ran away. I then fed her the medicine with a syringe. My bird threw up all over the place and was extremely uncomfortable for an hour after. I was worried that it was too many medications at once. When I searched online, I found that both Baytril and Doxycycline can cause vomiting, and that Meloxicam is not well tested for birds. I called the vet. The vet said it was probably the taste of the Doxycycline that made her throw up, and not to worry. However, after I asked, he agreed to give me only Doxycycline, at 0.05mL twice a day, for three weeks.
I picked up the medicine the next day. Pineapple still hated it, would still look really uncomfortable and sometimes vomit anywhere from 10 minutes to 50 minutes after. I figured I was doing her good, though, so I (we) soldiered on, even though it was (is) breaking my heart. She was so happy even while she was sick, and now I was torturing her twice a day. She started eating less, and I had to tempt her with millet and shove carrots and fruit and leaves in front of her, when normally she would be flying over to snatch it from me.
All of a sudden, two weeks later, my other bird, Biscuit, became lethargic one day and started throwing up. She threw up all night. The next day, she refused food and water and sat on the perch all puffed up. She still wanted to come outside, but then she would sit on the floor with her eyes half-closed. I thought she was going to die right in front of me!
I rushed Biscuit to the vet, and the vet did a crop swab and said she had developed a yeast infection. He prescribed Nyastin, 0.05mL twice daily, for 10 days.
By this time, tbh, I was very much regretting taking my birds to the vet at all. It's a 20-30 minute taxi ride there, and the room is cold, and the birds are stressed out. And then, everytime I give Pineapple her medicine, she is stressed out, and Biscuit is also super stressed out. Pineapple is naturally more chill, but Biscuit is very high-strung. I was (and am) absolutely convinced that if I give her medicine twice a day, she will die. I am not exaggerrating at all. I've raised this bird from two or three weeks old, and I know her personality.
(Before you ask, no, the vet does not have other ways to administer the medication to my birds. No shots or water soluble medication. He did suggest a crop needle as an easier feeding mechanism, though if done wrong it can rupture the esophagus. I'm terrified I'll injure my birds, so that is not an option.)
After getting back from the vet, I laid out some food on a towel and talked to Biscuit a lot and played with her. Finally, she did begin eating, and then she seemed to get some energy back. She even pooped a normal-looking poop later, when she'd had broken poop and diahhrea earlier in the day. When I eventually put her back in the cage, she looked much better. I made the decision that I would not give her the medicine. I would just let her live (or die) naturally.
I did read that Apple Cider Vinegar is good for bacteria and fungus, so I bought some Braggs ACV and added three drops to their water cup. I watched as both birds drank some.
The next morning, both birds were a little lethargic, but acting more or less happy. The day after that (today), Biscuit was actually acting like her normal self again! I made them sleep extra long and also take an afternoon nap, but while out, Biscuit was flying all over and eating and singing and everything. I don't know if it was the ACV, or just her immune system recovered, but she seems to be better now.
Pineapple is a different story. She is still quite sleepy, and she was breathing heavily at the vet's so that even he commented on it. Today, while Biscuit was tearing around causing trouble, Pineapple mostly slept, played and ate a little, then slept some more. After her nap, I even found her sleeping on the cage floor instead of a perch. That is a very bad sign. (Once I let her out, however, she flew around a bit and was much perkier. I'm kind of hoping she was on the floor because she was hot and wanted to move away from the heat lamp up top.)
I have been reading things online obsessively, and I read that taking antibiotics often causes a fungal infection, and that a bird with this infection should not eat sugary foods. This is terrible!
I'm now wondering 1) Does Pineapple also have a yeast infection (which she passed to her cagemate) that resulted from the Doxycycline? and 2) Did the sugar water mixed with the Doxycycline make it all the worse?
I want to ask my vet for a sugar-less mix. The vet is already unhappy with me, though. He still thinks I should be giving Pineapple the full mix of medication that he first prescribed. If I go back now and ask him for the changed prescription *and* no sugar because "I read it on the internet", I'm afraid he will altogether refuse to see me anymore. As I said before, finding a vet at all is very difficult. I've already pissed off the first vet by not agreeing to surgery. I don't want to completely sour things with this one, but I also don't want to be slowly killing my bird!
In other news, while Pineapple drank the ACV yesterday, today, she turned up her nose at it, so I switched back to plain water. I'm not sure what to do about the yeast infection, since I don't want to take her back to the vet and give her yet more medication. I read that yeast infections are hard to treat and inevitably come back. My bird's quality of life is already in the dumps. I don't want to force-feed her medicine for the rest of her life. If she's going to die this week, even, I want it to be happy and feeling loved.
Honestly, I think all of this is my fault. I didn't keep Pineapple warm enough, so she got a runny/stuffy nose. I gave her medication that is making her sick, without researching it first, and now she could die while miserable and in pain. My other bird has it too and may die suddenly one day with no warning. Now that I've started the antibiotic, I can't stop, though, so I'm just stuck. And now that they have the yeast infection, I can't reverse time. It's all a big mess and I wish I'd kept them home and happy with me in the first place.
Please, what would you do in my place? I can distract myself in the daytime, but every night I'm just a mess of nerves and worry. I hate this. Even if it winds up being not the best choice, I wish I could settle on a clear path of action. I haven't slept through the night for two weeks, and I'm sure the birds are affected negatively by my mood as well. I could go out more so I'm not affecting them as much, but I'm scared to leave them alone for long, in case this is the last time I will see them.
Okay, I'll stop whining now.
More specifically, can you help answer the following?
1. Should I switch to giving Pineapple the mix of three drugs, or continue with only the Doxycycline?
2. Should I ask my doctor for a new medication mix without the sugar water, and if yes, how do I phrase it so that he will agree and not just kick me out entirely?
3. Can Apple Cider Vinegar possibly cure yeast infections? At least, if I try it for a week, can it hurt my birds? How can I convince them to drink it if they don't like it?
4. Anything else you can suggest?