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Abdominal Swelling?

Discussion in 'Parrotlets Place' started by ParrotletMama, 7/26/19.

  1. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    Hi there! I have a bonded pair of Parrotlets that are a little over a year old. They are parenting their first clutch. My female had a whopping 8 eggs!!! Her 4th hatchling hatched yesterday. So far so good (for their 1st clutch both parents are doing awesome)however, she has plucked a little around her chest/abdomen area (from what I found out that's normal due to the fluctuation in her body temperature not to mention we live in a hot/humid environment to make things worse). But my concern is her abdomen region. She is a bit "round" and swollen looking down there. This has started about 2 days ago. She doesn't seem to be in any pain and she is eating and drinking normally. Her eyes are bright and lively. Mobility wise, she is clearly a tad swollen so I expect a minor change in agility, but she gets around perfectly fine and with ease as usual. I initially thought she was egg bound but that isn't the case since her last egg laid was 11 days ago (I'd think she would be dead by now if that were the case). Through researching, I found that an air sac rupture can happen. That's the condition with the most similar physical symptoms, however I am still a little stumped on what might be going on (primarily because shes acting completely normal). Could it be possible that she is simply swollen from laying all those eggs and the various fluctuations on her hormones during this entire process? I have tried to look up images describing what my bird has going on but have had little luck on that. Any feed back would be helpful. She does have an appt to see her vet on Monday. I am also contacting the breeder we got her from since he has been an abundance of knowledge for us during the entire process of mating till now.
     
  2. sunnysmom

    sunnysmom Joyriding the Neighborhood Celebirdy of the Month Mayor of the Avenue Avenue Spotlight Award Avenue Veteran I Can't Stop Posting!

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  3. Zara

    Zara Biking along the boulevard Celebirdy of the Month Avenue Spotlight Award I Can't Stop Posting! POSTAHOLIC

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    Sorry, I'm not sure about the swelling. The plucking is normal, they call it a brooder patch.

    Could your breeder friend or (preferably) the vet come to your home to have a look?
    It would be better for the hen than taking her away from the chicks.

    I hope all goes well ❤️
     
  4. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    That was my biggest concern was removing her from her babies, especially when almost everyday she has hatched one new baby. My male has been a huge help to her but ultimately its her in the nest box doing most of the work. I was also a bit concerned that removing her may also stress him out. He has been highly protective towards her and their babies. So the topic of taking her away from her babies to go the vet is definitely something me and my husband have been in debate with especially because despite that swollen area she has going on, she's perfectly normal. Initially the vet receptionist wanted us to bring the entire clutch with her. Just thinking about tiny 8 day old and younger babies huddle amongst 4 eggs while in a car makes me cringe. We don't want this to be a case of us thinking we are helping her when instead we are making things worse. I am not familiar with vets who make house calls and who treat birds. We have an abundance of mobile vets but they tend to cats and dogs only.

    I took a few pictures of my females problem area while she was out of her nest box and have sent that to the breeder with a description of what's going on. He tends to travel on the weekends so hopefully I can get a prompt response to my concern. My husband as usual is saying she's drinking, eating and acting just fine. He claims he's seen birds who are a bit swollen from laying eggs but it looks moderately swollen enough to cause me concern. Yet again I am a helicopter mom to my pets and being that I have never had a bonded pair of any bird species go on to having a successful clutch of babies, I am taking the better safe than sorry route.
     
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  5. Zara

    Zara Biking along the boulevard Celebirdy of the Month Avenue Spotlight Award I Can't Stop Posting! POSTAHOLIC

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    Hens can look a bit swollen while laying and brooding, but you say this started just a couple of days ago, so it is definitely worth checking out.

    If your local avian vet is nearby, call them and speak directly with him/her. Explain the situation clearly and ask nicely if they can bob round to visit.
    House visits are really for special circumstances, and if they advertised home visits, then people would request a home visit for the annual check up or some other non emergency.
    (Try not to speak with the receptionist ;) )
     
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  6. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    No such luck with a response from the breeder we got her from and her vet is closed today. :( She is still the same as far as temperament and behavior goes but I do notice a slight increase on her swollen abdomen. It is more pronounce between her legs now and I notice some slight waddling due to it. When I held her in my hand to inspect her, she immediately pooped but thats no surprise as the time of day is usually that time that she comes out of the nestbox to take her "morning poop break". I am assuming no obstruction since she effortlessly poops still. She has her appt tomorrow so until then I plan to keep her water and food as low down on the cage as possible and simply making it as easy as possible to get to things she needs to get to. We are using the vision nestbox and awaiting our amazon order of liners so I can clean her nest box. I've waited and let them be until the oldest baby hits 10-14 days old. So I will soon be busy sanding those liners down and hopefully get a better look at the babies and her. Every time I open that box door both mom and dad goes berserk so I have been trying my hardest to make sure everything is going ok without stressing them out. (that's proven to be an extremely hard thing to do when dealing with extremely protective parents)

    I have so much respect for breeders now as this can be such an ordeal!!! So hard to make the right choices that benefit both mom and babies. So stressful to worry about the babies thriving and most importantly its so hard to deal with the issues associated with my female. We found good homes for 3 of the 4 (there prob is more by now but mom wont let me do my head count) but after all this is said and done, it will be super hard to break their not so little family apart. (My husband would have an absolute fit if I end up keeping them all!! I already did this with my guinea pigs when I adopted a pregnant one from our local shelter. I could not face breaking their little herd apart, so they stayed a happy family of 6 for the rest of their lives.)

    Wish us luck for Mondays appt. I hope to have a positive result. Shes been a trooper and in good spirits throughout all of this.
     
  7. Mockinbirdiva

    Mockinbirdiva Biking along the boulevard Celebirdy of the Month Avenue Spotlight Award Avenue Veteran I Can't Stop Posting!

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    It's unfortunate she has this problem and hopefully it's not serious. Parrotlets can be chronic egg layers and go back to nest again once the babies are gone. Since she has laid soooo many eggs this time ( how old is she?) when the chicks are out of the nest I would suggest housing your male and female separately. Males can be quite forceful about pushing their hens back to the nest box. In some cases when the hen is reluctant and isn't ready the males can be very aggressive towards the hen and some have been known to kill their mates. There are quite a few species of birds that will do this but only in captivity because the hen has no where to escape the male. If she did continue to lay clutch after clutch it will either be extremely detrimental to her health or eventually lead to death.

    What is the current diet you have them on and what size is the cage? Are you planning on allowing the parents to fully raise these chicks or are you planning on hand feeding. I'm guessing this is your first time and you may not have the experience to hand feed if you need to. You might want to find someone who can do that for you before an event happens where it is necessary to do this. I wouldn't be surprised either if too many nest box inspections could lead to either one or both parents killing the chicks... crazy I know, but it's a defense mechanism many species will do.
     
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  8. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    Hi so I had noticed slight reduction of swelling and had rescheduled the vet appt to further assess her situation as she was still acting normal. Today was her rescheduled vet exam and her swelling has gone down drastically (she has slight swelling but nothing like how it once was). So I am cancelling her appt today as she doesn't seem to need any intervention. I was going to take her in for the sake of just getting her looked at but I don't think its in the babies best interest. This whole situation has been a bit challenging as far as making the best decision for both mom and babies is concerned. So basically my husband was right and I was overreacting but in justification her abdomen was so round and balloon like that it was hard to think of it as being normal swelling during this whole egg laying and raising process. Her feathers are also growing back in and the oldest baby has hit about 16 days old so shes been a bit more active outside of her cage but is still attentive to her babies needs.

    Thankfully nature intervened and only allowed her to have 4 thriving babies. It would have been 6 babies but, 2 of them died at less than a day old. Each of those babies didn't make it out of there egg but managed to begin to crack them. Her other 2 eggs I recently disposed of- infertile.

    My pair is 1 year 2 mos old. This is their first clutch. They were quite determined at mating and having their first clutch. I only say this because I didn't have a nest box in their cage; watch the amount of food I give them; and I always rearranged their cage during each cage cleaning. I only bought a nest box when I found an egg on the bottom of the cage.

    Their diet is quite diverse. Besides fresh fruit, veggies and boiled egg with some crushed shell, I give them a mixture of Zupreem Cockatiel pellets, Roudybush Pellets, Mazuri Pellets mixture. I have added a seed mixture temporarily once she started laying eggs. I am not a fan of seed mixes because I have had birds in the past (particularly my ringneck) who would pick only the "junk food" seeds out. I only made an exception this time due to the scenario of baby rearing. They also have millet. They have a cuttlebone and a mineral block that has calcium also in it.

    As for cage size I am unsure of the dimensions and will need to measure it. We were going to go today or tomorrow to the store to buy a whole new cage system that consists of a stand with stackable cages because the cage will not be big enough for the babies when they start to fledge and I will also need a cage to hold the babies in once they are weaned. …...Not to mention.....we are most likely going to keep 1-2 babies and so they need their own cages.

    I have never hand fed and while I know the trend is hand feeding, its much harder to do than it looks and I'd rather avoid that unless absolutely necessary so my parent birds will be fully raising them. I had made it a habit of looking for potential homes once the babies started to hatch via my friends and family first and many have shown interest only if they are hand fed but I personally have a love hate relationship with it. I have bought hand fed birds that weren't getting the necessary attention and they acted similar to my non hand fed bought birds. The end result once we got past the introduction phase was always a great relationship. Just needed some work on my part. However, I would like to learn how to hand feed. Its a handy thing to know in general.

    Yes, and there were a few times where I'd go to lift open the box door to simply do a quick peek and my male gave me "the look" followed by a single poke on one of the chicks head via his beak. Now, I just wait for both to be out of the box so I can quickly yet safely do anything nest box related. My female has more trust in me so she doesn't get as aggressive as my male does. My male......I cant even grab their food dish out so I could replenish their food without him trying to bite my finger off. If I get close to his cage he will give my female verbal warnings. BTW hes the SHY and more affectionate one!!! My female is much more dominant than him, so its amazing of how the roles switch when they are rearing babies.

    My female just came out of the nest box again and I managed to get a hold of her. Slight swelling but her abdomen definitely does not remind me of a ping pong ball anymore. Huge improvement. Got a glimpse of the babies too and their feathers are coming in! I was really hoping for atleast one to look like my female (American White)…..but oh well ...looks like 3 will be definitely blue just like dad. The youngest has faint blue but I am unsure.
     
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  9. Zara

    Zara Biking along the boulevard Celebirdy of the Month Avenue Spotlight Award I Can't Stop Posting! POSTAHOLIC

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    Nice to read an update that the swelling has gone down.
    I would still keep a super close eye on her and as soon as the chicks are away from her, take her to the vet.

    Poor choice of words. I lost a two day old chick the day after Christmas and me and my boyfriend sat on the floor and cried for him.

    I also give a box once laying starts to allow the chick to sit with her (dummy) eggs and relax.
    You did well in trying to reduce clutches laid, but eventually as you have witnessed, the hen will lay. I would strongly invest in some dummy eggs, and next time, take each egg as it is laid and do the switcheroo.

    Be sure that it is ground to a fine powder. Crushed can slice the crop open.
    Also, if you don´t feed pellets, you will need to give your birds some sunshine to receive vitamin d, which is needed to help the hen absorb the calcium.

    That´s nice :) Bear in mind, they may seem bonded at first, then fall out once they hit adulthood. So you may need an extra cage.

    Call around. Search for a breeder who can physically show you how to do it. It is a key skill when you have chicks in the house. A vet or bird shelter may also be able to help.

    From my last point, It is important to expect all possibilities. These parents could abandon the chicks *touching wood* right now. What would you do? This is why it is vital to know how to feed in advance. On the 27th December, I checked on my chicks and the 5 day old one was with no food. I had to step in, no time to waste, if I had not known how to, there would be no time to research and no time to learn.
    I don´t want to scare you, I just want you to be prepared, and have a successful clutch.

    This is mostly a myth. If you can interact with the chicks while they wean, they will be fine. Hand feeding the birds only makes them ¨tame¨ to the person handfeeding them.

    Leave these birds alone as much as you can. Last thing you want is to stress them and trigger an attack. Limit your interactions while they have the chicks in there.


    Maybe some plet owners can give you some more species specific advice. But please, number one is to learn to handfeed right now, should the parents abandon or attack the chicks.


    edit; not sure why the font is all over the place. Hope it´s not to offputting to read
     
    Last edited: 8/7/19
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  10. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    Hey sorry I offended you with my poor choice of wording regarding the 2 birds that never made it. That was not my intent and should have explained in greater detail my perspective. Reality of the matter is I have ZERO CONFIDENCE in hand feeding (something I'd knew I'd have to do had my female had more than 4 babies to tend to). I have spent hours upon hours watching videos and reading up on the various methods of feeding (curved spoon, a dropper, traditional syringe type feeding) and "How Tos". There is so much could go wrong and I'd rather nature took its course versus me accidentally killing the poor little guys/gals because I decided to hand feed them rather then keep them with their parents who have the natural instincts necessary to rear them. Totally understandable that I'd have to pull the older babies to give those 2 younger babies a chance (and I would have done it had they were viable-whether I liked it or not), but I found it scary that these older babies were under my direct care. When I changed out bedding and found them my 5 yr old was sitting beside me. She was crushed. I had to explain the circle of life and I had to explain nature and how sometimes nature is cruel but its within reason. We both sat there staring at the eggs wondering what may have happened. So my apology that it came off as offensive or insensitive. It definitely was not meant to come off that way. It was definitely a bitter sweet scenario for me. On one hand I didn't have to hand feed (and potentially jeopardize the older babies) but on the other, 2 babies didn't get a chance. They didn't get to make it out of their egg shell. In a perfect world, all 8 of my females eggs would make it and thrive but mother nature has her own plans.

    Yes, definitely taking her to the vet. I was going to still take her to her appt for the sake of just doing an exam. I had several choices to … take her and the babies in their nest box to the vet; take her by herself or simply continue observing her and wait till the babies are a tad older so I can get her in for an exam. I was told by her vet that swelling due to egg laying and what not is normal. When I gave her vet a an updated description, she was not very worried about it.

    That is good to know regarding the correct texture of the egg shell. I was always told crushed as fine as possible but not powder texture so thank you for letting me know.

    That's funny you mention "dummy eggs" I tried searching online but only found dummy eggs for chickens. I will do more searching around.

    Yes definitely buying extra cages. As I mentioned, we are investing into a new cage system for my current birds and the babies. Its a stand that stacks the cages vertically. There are different sizes depending on how many cages you want. Its pretty cool and space saving, not to mention they wont be able to see each other due to the vertical feature of the stand. The size of the cages vary as well but the one we are looking at is much larger than the cage they are currently in. This will be a huge much needed upgrade. The babies we choose to keep will be separated rather promptly.

    Don't worry you are very informative and have not scared me with your feedback. I have already scared myself researching hand feeding info. I have all the supplies in the event I need to hand feed, but I want to just avoid it. It is not as easy as it looks but I know in the event that it absolutely needs to happen I will do it. I wont have a choice. Just an intimidating thing to do that I don't take lightly. I will make some calls to a few local bird specific stores that raise and sell birds. I doubt they will let me practice on their birds due to the liability but if I can watch in person that's a start. This reminds me of my pet rat I once had. She had a tooth deformity and I had to literally trim her bottom teeth with a dog nail clipper because they weren't growing in correctly. Rat teeth are ever growing and they grow at an angle so to naturally grind up against each other. Hers wasn't. It was the most horrifying-scary thing I had to do but the vet showed me how to do it and I did it for her sake...reluctantly....so I know I can learn how to hand feed proficiently I am just so darn scared of doing it.
     
  11. Zara

    Zara Biking along the boulevard Celebirdy of the Month Avenue Spotlight Award I Can't Stop Posting! POSTAHOLIC

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    Aww I´m sorry your daughter saw the chicks that passed. I hope she´s OK. My 2yo nephew was with me recently when taking home a sick chick and he asked me the day after about it, the chicken did not make it but he did not know that so I just told him the chick was in my house and I hope he forgets next time he´s on holiday here.

    It´s great that you are in touch with your vet RE your hens health. Maybe ask the vet if they know someone who can teach you handfeeding?

    Dummy eggs; DummyEggs.com, Dummy Eggs Help Stop Egg Laying in Pet Birds! Fake Eggs, Solid Plastic Eggs in all sizes.
    There will be other places to buy them from too, just be sure they are the correct size. I bought mine from an aviary in the UK but hey don´t sell the size you need.

    The cage system sounds cool :)

    Back to handfeeding, hopefully someone at the store can help you. Just really focus on all the movements the chicks make, the angle the syringe goes in, and how to prepare the food (this should be on the leaflet in the product anyway but it´s good to see the consistency).
    You may find it easier, should you need to handfeed, to spoon feed. It is much safer than syringe feeding and your chicks are a little older and so should be ok eating that way. It is as messy as giving a bowl of porridge to a toddler, but it is safer. Just be sure to clean up the chicks right after eating because food sets and sticks like glue.
    Remember never to use a microwave nor reheat food. Unused food should be disposed of.

    Like you said, leaving the chicks with their parents is ideal, but it just doesn´t always work out that way especially with younger parents like yours.

    I´m hoping all goes smoothly for you ❤️
     
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  12. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    Its ok, we have always had a zoo with many of them being rescues and some sort of medical issue. Its always tough to break bad news like this to her but its better to be open about topics such as this. I made the mistake of telling her that our parakeet (an older chronic egg layer rescue) went on vacation instead of passing. She was 3 at the time. Bad choice. She kept asking about her and only 6 mos ago I decided to bend and told her the truth. I have never seen her so distraught and hysterical. I felt horrible. So my only tip to you is to be mindful that your nephew might just retain that bit of info and you may find yourself in a position like me.

    The new cage is going great minus some minor annoying flaws (probably due to it being a breeder cage). It has a removable divider. Its roughly double the size of what they were in. The cage has no large swing door and the nest box made for small birds such as mines has incorrect sized "prongs" to latch to the cage from the outside to so we had to pry the cage open just to place it inside on the cage floor. So now bedding changes is not as easy but the babies are bigger and less frail looking atleast. It came with overly large stick dowel perches that I left out due to size and they wont even click in (even if I wanted to use them) because they rely on the divider due to shortness of length. That was no biggie though because they prefer rope type perches and those mineral perch things ( forgot the name). We had to zip tie the base of the cage to the stand because for some reason there's no way to stop it from sliding unless we zip tie the cage to the stand. In other words theres a flaw in how the cage sits on the stand. After a handful of zip ties it worked like a charm to secure it. We plan to go back to the bird store in a couple of weeks, so I will go talk to someone about these annoying issues to see if maybe our stand is missing a piece, etc etc. Its perfect otherwise.

    Mom parrotlet is looking good. She looks normal still and is acting normal as usual. Once they are closed to being weaned she will go in for her routine exam to confirm everythings still ok. I might just bring the entire family to just get their exams out of the way. Probably be easier to do all of their physicals at once.

    The babies are almost the size of their parents. The oldest is super spunky and thinks I have food for him whenever I change their bedding....he also absolutely gives me the hardest time when it comes down to putting him back in the nestbox. He really tries to stay on my hand. I am not sure if its just a coincidence. Our youngest that my 5 yr old wants to keep is...interesting.....well it has the fallow gene so its eyes is red. Mom is an American White and dad is a Blue. Both have brown/black eyes. So to see 2 of the babies blue and 1 American white (with brown/black eyes) is normal but our 4th is red eyed and I think blue (hes 5 days younger then his siblings so he has growing yet to do) is pretty interesting.

    Yes, I think I will be choosing the spoon feeding route. From what I gathered (correct me if Im wrong), spoon feeding entails on the babies feeding in a rather natural manner. They can also get a good taste of their food vs syringe feeding that is often a quick way of feeding. One of our local bird stores hand feed a ridiculous amount of babies and understandably the syringe would be a quick way of feeding all of them timely. I feel as though spoon feeding is definitely more appealing to me and the mess wont bother me. I deal with 2 human kids already (lol). Wiping faces and food off of the table is the norm. Well wish me luck! Mom parrotlets issue seemed to resolve itself and so I think its a matter of learning how to hand feed and waiting till they wean (long way to go I will probably hold on to them till they turn 10 weeks old and we are just 3.5 weeks in roughly). TY for your feedback. Its been really helpful. I've owned all sorts of birds, some single - some with a mate and have never actually had babies as the outcome. Its been a huge learning experience, that will make it very hard to send 2 of them away to their new homes.
     
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  13. fashionfobie

    fashionfobie Rollerblading along the road

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    Spoon feeding is the best route. I think if a shop has so many birds they feel they need to 'expedite things' with a syringe... they have too many birds. Each bird deserve the patience of feeding at their own pace. Also mess is part of the package with any baby be it bird, puppy or human ;)
     
  14. Birdie Mama

    Birdie Mama Meeting neighbors

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    Hello, you may also want to check out talkparrotlets.com forum. There are a few on there that have had great clutches and they may be able to help you along the way. It is a great forum as well and 95% parrotlet owners..

    So happy to hear that the babies are doing good so far! :super:
     
  15. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    I couldn't agree more. I feel like spoon feeding is better for both me and the babies. I have seen seasoned pet store staff syringe feed babies and some of them practically shove the food down its mouth and go on to the next one. Again, I get that most pet stores have many to feed and all of their lives depend on a timely feeding, but every now and then I cringe when I see a baby being fed rather quick like that. I feel like the spoon feeding process is most natural for the babies and its a plus if its an easier method for someone like myself that still has a lot to learn.
     
  16. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    I will definitely check it out!! I have a few questions regarding genetics that maybe that forum can answer. I am intrigued that we managed to get a fallow baby. I was not expecting a red eyed baby so that has spark more curiosity on the way genetics work. I am very happy as well that they are doing great. I had major anxiety for the first 2 weeks. Worried about my female. Worried about babies. Worried about how the heck I am going to pick each tiny baby to change out their bedding. I think we have kinda hit a plateau and are in a comfortable place. My females issue is gone. The babies are larger. My male has reduced the amount of attempts in a day trying to rip my hand into pieces (lol).
     
  17. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    I also put in my order for parrotlet sized dummy eggs. After this clutch is weaned, they are not having anymore babies for atleast 1-2 yrs. I am still deciding whether to separate or not. Tough call because they are very much bonded to one another. Prior to the babies, they both used to fight over me when I let out of their cage so maybe they will be ok to separate, I just need time to think about it I suppose. The dummy eggs will come in handy though so the 30 something bucks I spent on 7 of them will be worth it.
     
  18. Zara

    Zara Biking along the boulevard Celebirdy of the Month Avenue Spotlight Award I Can't Stop Posting! POSTAHOLIC

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    There is only so fast they can feed the chicks via syringe. If they feed too fast the chick may not be able to keep up and will aspirate.
    The way the syringe puts the food directly in the chicks beak is quite similar to that of when the parents feed the chicks as is the angle to which we can replicate with a syringe.
    It does seem quite fast, but it has to be, any slower can create air in the crop.


    It is definitely a safer option for someone with zero experience. Less problems can occur. It takes time, remember that the chick can´t eat from the spoon if it is below them (under their beak), you will need to lift up the spoon a little. I´m sure there will be videos etc on the net to watch :)


    They really are. And they are a one time investment for your birds health. They save so much time and can then be sterilised ready for the next time.


    If they are bonded, don´t split them up. It´s not fair to them.
    Like, imagine a bonded human couple being forced to split up because they are bickering over who loves their child the most.
    You just need to figure out what you can do to stop the bickering over you.
    I personally just take on referee role and physically split up any fights that occur on my person. I send any bickerers away. If I see two birds on the same arm that I know will bicker, I will take one to my other arm to avoid the bicker before it happens.
    You may also find some training methods to help you reduce bickering. Positive reinforcement being key. When both birds are on you and getting along, they get a treat. When they bicker, Put them down on the table in front of you, the sofa, a T perch, whatever is closest (not the cage or a fun play stand - you don´t want them to think you are giving them something good, namely, a free ride to a fun place).
    I hope thats helpful. You have all this time to have a think of some solutions.
    Just think of it like this; if the only time they bicker/fight is over you, then they don´t get you unless they are getting along. Positive reinforcement will help them understand this.
     
  19. ParrotletMama

    ParrotletMama Moving in

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    Thank you thank you THANK YOU for confirming what I felt in regards to separating them!!! That's why I mentioned I needed time to think about whether to separate or not. They really love each other and compliment each other as they have similarities but opposite personalities. We were initially interested in our American White whom was hand fed but turned shy when her breeder left out of town and boarded her with a few of the other younger Parrotlets. We ended up walking away with our male as well as her. He wasn't being advertised and maybe it was because he got into a scuffle or two with the other bird he was caged with (other bird was the aggressor and managed to bite off a couple nails off our male :( ). He is super sweet and more sociable than our female. He was the one who brought her out of her shell when we first got them home. Now shes overly confident and cocky towards him when fighting over my attention, but they are very much bonded to one another. So thank you for enforcing what I already felt in my heart.

    I will try the positive enforcement via treat route. I have a play gym for them that I typically will place on the floor in front of me and my 5 yr old. I give them the opportunity to play on it or they can come to us. They seem to like the option to hop off their play gym to hop on us and vice versa. I have tried to separate my female when she charges over at my male while they are both on me. She refuses to stay put on "her side" of me. All my male wants to ever do is fit his body in my arm crease (he has a thing for snuggling at the elbow joint when my arms are bent and against my body). I will try the table or sofa idea when they have their arguments. When they have their little squabbles, its always to do with having them both on me. Its even happened when I was in the process of taking them out. If my female sees him coming to the front of the cage towards me she will usually turn around and scare him back to the back of the cage. It doesn't happen every time but it happens enough to where I notice a pattern. Other than that they are constantly loving each other but when I become involved shes super possessive normally. Now with my 5 yr old she could careless, in fact I prefer it to be that way since my female is a little fickle. So my male does fine when he gets attention from my 5 yr old. No fighting over my 5 yr old thankfully.
     
  20. Gribouille

    Gribouille Rollerblading along the road

    Joined:
    7/10/17
    Messages:
    1,191
    Location:
    Norway
    I don't know about spoon or syringe feeding. When I worked at a wildlife hospital and we had babies, we would use a thin, round paintbrush as a "spoon". We just had to dip the brush into the food, which was then semi-liquid/semi-solid, and let the chick chew/suck the brush. Very easy and quite natural angle too. Older chicks who didn't know that system would not open their beak so it took time to get them to understand it, but if you do it home they would know from the start and open their beak as soon as they see the brush.
     

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