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Advice and help for an ex-petshop tiel?

Chiptuner

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Hi everyone, I would love to hear your advice on a tiel we've taken in.

A local petshop had two tiels that were never for sale - they hung out on top of their cage and one, Cookie, would get scritches from everyone.
The petshop is going to change ownership, and they asked if we would be able to take him on (we'd been coming in to pet him weekly for a year).
Of course we agreed, as we adored the guy.
Shoulda realised that all the people who claimed he 'hated' them were women, like me.

He's 5-6 years old according to the guys at the shop. I don't know whether he was hand-raised or not. He was housed with another tiel, although they ignored each other.
He likes scritches, but doesn't know how to step up. He seems to dislike hands too - I'm sure he's had a lot of grabby people.

He was always OK to me in the shop, but since he's been home he seems to dislike me more and more. It's day 4 now. He adores my fiance and will flock call like crazy when he leaves the room. He hisses and lunges at me if I go near the cage, and I don't warrant a contact call ever.

I've been trying to lure him with millet - but he has absolutely no interest in it, even if I leave it in his bowl. I think the seed mix he's used to contains it (we're supplementing with pellets and veggies as well).
He doesn't seem food motivated. If we offer food by hand he lowers his head for scritches and ignores the treat.
He likes to nibble on spinach, but if I offer it now he's more focused on lunging at me. He doesn't lower his head for scritches from me anymore either.
Oh, and he sometimes paces frantically when he's eating, but only then. Has anyone seen that behaviour before?

I'm finding it really hard to get him to see I'm not the enemy. I had a BHC who adored food before, which made training a breeze.
It's very childish of me, but I'm really sad that he seems to hate me now, and won't give me the time of day.

I don't know if we've bitten off more than we can chew here. Does anyone have any advice or tips on how to help him come round to me, if he ever will? On how we can start training? Any similar stories?

Thank you for reading to the end!
 

Shezbug

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Welcome to the Avenue :)

Thank you for giving this bird a home!

@Tiel Feathers may be able to help with some information if she is still online. I'll also have a quick look who else is online at the moment that may be able to help you.....stick around and you will learn a lot and hopefully no longer feel like you may have bitten off more than you can chew ;)
 

JoJo&Loki

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Hello and welcome! Kudos to you for taking the little guy in. :)
I don’t have experience with cockatiels specifically, but birds in general need time to adjust. If it’s only been 4 days and he’s hissing at you, you may want to take it slower with him. I assume the owner of the store-if that’s who “owned” him - was male and that’s why he’s more comfortable with your fiancé.
I’m sure your home is a big change from his life at the pet shop, especially if he was there for years.
Hopefully someone will be by soon with more specific advice.
Congrats and good luck with your new baby!
 

Shezbug

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Not many online at the moment but maybe @Lady Jane or @JLcribber may be able to offer some general advice for a new bird adjusting to a new home/situation :)
 

Chiptuner

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@Shezbug Thank you :)
And thank you for the tags! We're in Australia hence this timing, haha.

@JoJo&Loki Thank you :) You're right! The manager is male, but didn't have much do do with him. I wonder if Cookie's had bad experiences with women too?
It's really early days, but the weirdest thing to me is that he's been growing *more* hostile to me since Monday, when we got him.


Some more info to add:
His cage is in the living room, against a wall. We had it partially covered for the first couple of days. He gets his 12 hours' sleep covered.

I've been offering food through the bars or dropping things in his dish, but we've been trying to leave the inside of his cage alone so he's got a safe space.

We're leery of getting him out in case it's too much for him at the moment.

Should I try sitting next to the cage or is it better to keep some distance for now?
 

JoJo&Loki

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You could try to sit near his cage and read to him. Not paying attention to him directly though, face another direction and read so he gets used to your voice and presence. He’s probably had so many years of people gawking at him at the pet store, he may just need some space. And time, birds are slow to come around...but when they do it’s so worth it!!
 

Fuzzy

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:welcome2: Chiptuner! That's so lovely you took in Cookie. Remember everything is new to him - he's lost his old life, his old flock, maybe even his usual food, so he's going to take time to settle down and get used to his new home and new flock. So it seems he takes a shine to your fiance which is great, but means you'll probably have more chance of forming a relationship with Cookie when your fiance isn't there. Maybe your fiance reminds him of someone he liked. Would he accept a skritch from you if your fiance wasn't there?

Try not to do anything that results in him hissing, lunging or biting you. If he is hissing or lunging, he is obviously not happy with what you are doing, plus you become paired/associated with that aversive experience, which you really don't want. Instead aim to keep his body language as relaxed as possible even if it means you have to be hands off for the moment. You want to be pairing yourself with good experiences not aversives. How close can you get to him with his body language remaining relaxed? That would be where I would start. You could put your chair at that distance from him and read to him from there. Over time (hours/days/weeks - however long it takes) you can gradually move closer and closer, watching and heeding his body language all the time.

I agree about not letting him out yet. Let him get used to his cage, the toys, the food routine and the sight of the room beyond the cage. Then when you think the time is right, try opening his cage door maybe an hour before the food bowl is due to be slotted in. That way he can choose to climb out himself if he wants to, and go back in when he's hungry. You don't have to touch him.
 

Chiptuner

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@JoJo&Loki I'll give that a go! I think I've been unintentionally flooding him a bit, poor little man.

@Fuzzy thank you for the great advice. We've got a pack of his old seed mix at least, but outside of that you're right, everything's new for him! Luckily he's eating properly - which took a couple of days. Still not sure why he paces while eating though.

I was hoping that if I offered him things he might see that I'm not a threat, but I'll take it even slower than that and just 'be' around him.

How close can you get to him with his body language remaining relaxed?
I'd say I can get to about a foot from the wall of the cage he's nearest before he starts getting defensive. Do you think I should wait until he's a little better with me before letting him out? Do cockatiels generally put themselves back in when they feel like it?
Cookie was always on top of his cage at the shop, and I worry that trying to get him back in would stress him out, as he doesn't know how to step up.

Would he accept a skritch from you if your fiance wasn't there?
I will have to see how he is when the fiancé isn't around. I think he's just more used to men, or possibly even had bad experiences with women? As well as all the grabby customers.

Man, gotta say it's quite a different universe from caiques, haha.
 

Fuzzy

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Maybe he's used to eating ouside the cage so wants to come out? Or maybe he can see/hear your fiance and wants to be with him?

Yes, this is a great way to gain trust, but only if a bird is happy taking the morsels from you. You may have to start way slower by just dropping favourite pieces of food into his food bowl when you pass his cage. And if he's not comfortable with that, you might have to start, as you said, by just getting him used to you being around.

So place your chair three foot away from the cage wall and sit reading from there. I might also use negative reinforcement to get closer to him at other times.

Negative reinforcement is also known as escape/avoidance learning. The behaviour is strengthened (reinforced) by escaping an aversive (something the parrot doesn’t like). For example, pushing a hand into the bird’s chest to make it step up. The bird steps up to escape the sensation of being pushed in the chest. The bird has no choice but to step up… or may well learn to bite to make the hand go away. Not the best way of teaching a step up since you are also pairing yourself with an aversive, but we can use negative reinforcement in a more positive way when approaching an "untame" bird.

Note: if you have to use negative reinforcement at any time, it should be immediately followed up with positive reinforcement. However normally, negative reinforcement should be avoided.

Let me tell you how I used it with Ollie. Ollie (Orange-winged Amazon) came to me "untame", "cagebound" and afraid of humans, especially hands. He had very few reinforcers and certainly none where humans were concerned. I had to find a way to get close enough to then be able to offer positive reinforcement. My presence was an aversive. He was frightened of me. I used negative reinforcement:

I would walk towards his cage very slowly beginning from the far side of the room. When he showed slightly uneasy body language that was my starting point. I took a couple of steps back and waited for him to show relaxed body language (RBL) again. When I saw RBL I took a slow step forward (introducing an aversive). His continued RBL then earned half a step back (removing the aversive). I’d wait a few seconds and then took another slow step forward. His RBL earned half a step back, and so on until I could get closer and closer to his cage without him freaking. I did this every time I had to approach his cage. If his body language changed at all, even slightly, then I would go back a couple of steps until I saw his RBL and then break the steps down even smaller.

Do you think I should wait until he's a little better with me before letting him out? Do cockatiels generally put themselves back in when they feel like it?
Cookie was always on top of his cage at the shop, and I worry that trying to get him back in would stress him out, as he doesn't know how to step up. [/USER]
How interested is he in his food bowls? Will he go to them immediately they are slotted in? Does he know/predict when they will arrive? Prediction will come with routine (ie. you slotting them in at roughly the same time or in the same order of things every day). THEN you can try letting him out an hour or so before, so that hopefully when he sees you slot in the bowls, he will choose to take himself back in to eat. That's how I worked it with Ollie - I never (and still don't) have to touch him. He knows the routine so well he now flies in immediately I put the food bowls in - and woe betide me if I am late!

You are right - if he won't go back in himself and you have to chase/towel him it will be another trust destroying aversive. So get that food routine strong before you let him out. When he does go back in to eat, make sure you shut the door when he had some food in his mouth - that way he'll pair the shutting cage door with something good. Then gradually you can increase the time he is out. Ollie is now out all day and it's no problem.

All this is just advice - when it comes to applying it practiacally with Cookie, some bits might apply more than others. It might take some more figuring out since it sounds like Cookie is used to being on top of his cage all day? Would that be a problem for you? If you HAVE to ever towel him to put him back in, I would get your fiance to do it or else the trust you are building so carefully with him will be destroyed. I had to towel Ollie once in the early days - trust levels fell right back to the beginning. Thankfully we were able to build them up again... slowly!

I will have to see how he is when the fiancé isn't around. I think he's just more used to men, or possibly even had bad experiences with women? As well as all the grabby customers.
[/USER]I have Chico who loves men and hated women when he first arrived. It's taken a lot of patience and work to gain his trust. You certainly haven't made a mistake taking in Cookie. It's actually hugely rewarding working with a second hand bird. The tiniest step forward is the best feeling in the world! I suggest you keep a diary or journal so that you can read back and see his progress.
 
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Tiel Feathers

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Excellent advice from @Fuzzy
I don’t have much to add, but make sure you do all the things your new bird loves, and make your fiancé do anything that might cause him stress. Eventually things will change with Cookie and he will relax into his new surroundings and get used to you. I had a cockatiel who didn’t like skin at all and didn’t like to be touched. He would step up onto my covered arm though and was the smartest, cutest little friend. We had a wonderful bond despite all of his little quirks. Your relationship with Cookie will slowly grow into something wonderful, but it might not be the relationship you expected. I can’t wait to hear about all Cookie’s progress. You will have to post pictures of him when you get a chance!
 
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