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Two more issues: Lory & Budgie

Kenzie

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So I had posted an issue with my Amazon previously but have two more- one with my Budgie, one with my Lorikeet. I have a few, sure, haha but nothing crazy. These are all.. minor? I guess behavioral issues.

So, my Lorikeet. He is over a year old, I've had him since 9 months (bought from pet store I work at). When I type on my keyboard, he gets fired up (fluffed, yelling) and bites the hell out of my fingers really hard, to draw blood. I cannot type around him! It's just when I'm fast typing with both hands. I put him in a little pet carrier to, for example, type this so he does not eat my frickin' fingers! How can I curve this behavior? It is getting very old. As I type this, I've been letting him out after a few minutes of "time out" I guess and the second time I let him out, he did have a second of chilling out while I was typing. After 30 seconds, he went back to the behavior. So maybe this "time out" method is working for this specific issue? If you think I should go about it differently, let me know!

On the other hand, I have a budgie named Noodle. I have zero background information on her except that she is breeding age & loves people. She is a perfect, social, people loving little creature that only has one issue- extreme aggression against.. hands I suppose. Let me know what you think! She gets really pissed off when she comes in contact with my hands. She steps up fine, but when she is on my finger she gets really aggressive and makes mean clicking noises, fans her tail, fluffs up, and rapidly bites my fingers. She is relentless lol and even when I sit and ignore her very painful bites, she continues until she finds spots that hurt bad enough for me to shake my hand a tiny bit. Shes a tiny bird with a big attitude, that's for sure lol. Anyways, I have tried curving this behavior by holding her, a stick of millet, and letting her eat millet from my hand. She would eat millet, bite my hand a few times, go back to eating millet. I have no idea of her previous home, so who knows what kind of bad behavior has been rewarded for so long. But she will come to my hands to be picked up & everything. Now that I think of it, she'll bite at any free skin. Shes crazy! Crazy but cute. I am sure this is why she ended up at my store, through no fault of her own. It's obvious this has been a behavior longly being exhibited and going rewarded in one way or another. I wouldn't doubt she was owned by kids.

Any help is appreciated. Ask if I need to explain anything further or clear up confusing information! Thank you for reading.
 

Lady Jane

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Birds really can be afraid of hands but not agression. Usually there is a reason. Budgies are such that human hands often grab them. This happened to my male Murphy. You have 3 options, time, trust building and millet.
 

Begone

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How can I curve this behavior?
You have to accept it. Perhaps he will calm down when he is older, but if the sound trigger him to aggression their is nothing you can do about it.
Put him in his cage before typing or use a phone or touchscreen to type on. To give him time out will not help, he is not doing anything wrong, this is his normal behavior.
 

Kenzie

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You have to accept it. Perhaps he will calm down when he is older, but if the sound trigger him to aggression their is nothing you can do about it.
Put him in his cage before typing or use a phone or touchscreen to type on. To give him time out will not help, he is not doing anything wrong, this is his normal behavior.

After putting him in a time out a few times, and kissing him while I type and making noises at him, he hasn't done it shortly after I made this post lol. He is being a pretty good boy.... maybe he just thinks the keyboard is taking my attention away. I'll see if this is a temporary solution for the night and if it persists over the next few days without the carrier in sight.

As for my budgie, I guess that is the only thing I can do. But she seems to have gotten worse with hand biting in the past month.
 

Ripshod

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As for my budgie, I guess that is the only thing I can do. But she seems to have gotten worse with hand biting in the past month.
An old male budgie I had used to behave exactly the same, just before he humped my hand. Confused female?
 

Lady Jane

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Kenzie

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Time out for a bird is punishment (as with a human child) and birds have no concept of punishment. Remember to reward good behavior and do not react to what you think is bad behavior.

Discipline/punishment. Just bad advice. | Page 8 | Avian Avenue Parrot Forum
Wasn't exactly a time out, more of a safe guard for my hands lol. Just calmly placed in his cage while I typed... so I can actually type.. hence the "time out" in quotation marks :p. Also, hard to not react to blood-drawing bites when I type :(
 

Monica

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When I type on my keyboard, he gets fired up (fluffed, yelling) and bites the HE double hockey sticks out of my fingers really hard, to draw blood.
A great way to stop this behavior is to train using systematic desensitization. From Barbara Heidenreich

Systematic Desensitization:
A form of desensitization training in which the client repeatedly images anxiety-arousing situations while relaxed. The client progresses systematically through a hierarchy of more and more disturbing situations, typically without ever experiencing great anxiety. Combining relaxation with a hierarchy, of fear-producing stimuli, arranged from the least to the most frightening.
Example of systematic desensitization:
As the conscientious companion parrot owner approaches her Green Cheeked Parrot’s cage with the new toy, she notices her bird quickly moved to the back of the cage away from the approaching toy. Rather than put the toy in the cage, she decides to take a few steps back until her bird shows behavior that indicates comfort. She then gently and slowly places the toy on the floor in her bird’s line of sight. Each day the companion parrot owner gently moves the toy slightly closer to the cage. All the while noticing if her bird responds with any behavior indicative of fear. If she notices fear responses, she moves the toy away from the cage until the bird shows calm behavior. Over time the companion parrot owner has been able to get the toy so close it is right next to the cage. She then gently hangs the toy on the outside of the cage away from food or water bowls. (This is because she does not want her bird to driven away from his resources by fear.)This process is known as systematic desensitization. It is the idea of gradually exposing a subject to fear producing stimuli, arranged from least frightening to most frightening in combination with a relaxed state.​


even when I sit and ignore her very painful bites
I know this is very common advice.... but, you're doing it wrong. By "allowing" a bird to bite, you are reinforcing their need to bite. The only bite that can't be rewarded is the bite that never occurs. If you don't want to teach a bird to bite, then you need avoid and redirect the behavior before it occurs. Birds who "bite out of no-where" are often birds that have learned to bite without showing you they are going to bite because they were ignored before they started biting and they were ignored again when they did bite. They have learned to bite harder without warning because warning does no good.

If you do get bitten, don't ignore! Don't punish, don't scream... simply get the bird off of you (if not near the cage, then a table, a chair, heck even the floor!) and think about how you can avoid that situation in the future.


I have tried curving this behavior by holding her, a stick of millet, and letting her eat millet from my hand. She would eat millet, bite my hand a few times, go back to eating millet.
I bet she's really smart! So you should probably put her smarts to use! Stop handling her and start working on hands off training techniques such as target training, station training, turn around, etc. Reward, reward, reward all desired behavior! Even if she doesn't do the exact thing you want her to do, you reward the step it takes to get there! In time, hands off training can turn into hands on training without biting!
 

Kenzie

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@Monica I was thinking that me allowing her to bite me and attempting to ignore was reinforcing... maybe I should be listening to myself. She is very smart and nearly impossible to keep stationed like my other birds because she has such a busy, busy mind- always exploring and trying new things. My tiniest bird has become my hardest to keep occupied & happy, which is funny imo. How do I know when she is prepared for hands on training without biting? How do I know hands off training will somehow cure her biting?

It will be hard to not let her on my hands.. even stepping her up with a stick, she is crazy fast and just jumps to my shirt or hand. Acrobatic little thing... so she always ends up on my skin. I would like to bring her to our hangout room with the rest of the birds so she can of course play like the others.

As for my lory and the keyboard issue, I read the desensitization paragraphs you posted but do not understand how to put that into action on this specific issue. Could you perhaps enlighten me?
 

Monica

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Hands off training can start with your budgie in her cage. Train through the cage bars. The less opportunity she has to bite, the less she can practice biting. It also helps to learn to read her body language so that you can avoid getting bitten. The more times she has to interact with you without biting in a positive manner the more likely she is to interact with you without biting. Many birds become over-stimulated and bite out of response. Others turn that excess energy into excessive hormones because they don't have a way to get rid of that pent up energy. Through training, and later exercise (i.e. full flight!) you can teach a bird how to direct that energy into something positive which means positive interactions for you and your bird.


So a basic and simple training plan.... leave her caged. Start working on teaching her hands off behaviors through her cage bars. Once she gets good at it, and can do it to any location within the cage, then open up the cage and work through the cage door. Then work on it around the outside of the cage and eventually away from the cage. Training sessions do not need to be any longer than 3-5 minutes, and if she has a short attention span, that's fine! Train more frequently for shorter periods of time! It's honestly better than one long training session where the bird quickly loses interest.


As far as the systematic desensitization, it may help to have a wireless keyboard, or just unplug the one you have and wrap the cord up/tape to the bottom of the keyboard. (if neither is an option re: laptop keyboard, try getting another keyboard!) If your lory wont stay still on a perch, then have him caged. Stand 10' away and "type" on the keyboard. If he has no reaction, walk up to him and and reward him with a small treat. Go back to 10' away and repeat. Do this a few times and slowly get closer and closer. If your lory reacts at 5' but not at 6' then go back to 6' and reward, reward, reward calm behavior. Eventually, you may be able to be right up next to the cage without a reaction at all.

Alternatively, if you can move the cage, then move it a distance away where your lory doesn't react to you typing and reward every few moments (this will be a lot of getting up and down!) for remaining calm. Slowly move the cage closer and closer to the computer and rewarding calm behavior.
 
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