Clipping gets touted as a quick and easy fix-all, but at such cruel cost. Frankly, I'm baffled and dismayed that it is even still considered as a viable option when hard work, patience, accommodations, and dedicated training can fix any problems for which clipping is a mere band aid.
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wing clipping do or dont??
- Thread starter sezii
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sezii
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They are not broken they are bent and she bends them herself I've watched her do it it's when she wants to fly scared she can't and then she starts yanking on all her feathers wings and tail that's part of why I asked about wing clipping because it seems that she's upset she can't fly and pulls pretty hard at her feathers she's even rolled down the top of her cage(she was not hurt) because she was more focused on her tail feathers than hanging on to the bars
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Is she basically running her beak along the whole length of the feathers and making it bend?
That's normal and will not USUALLY cause the type of bending you see there. However, babies are rough on their feathers.
If she is actively tugging on her feathers like she is trying to pull it out, then she may have discomfort at the feather folicle that she is trying to alleviate.
Either way, clipping won't stop that.
That's normal and will not USUALLY cause the type of bending you see there. However, babies are rough on their feathers.
If she is actively tugging on her feathers like she is trying to pull it out, then she may have discomfort at the feather folicle that she is trying to alleviate.
Either way, clipping won't stop that.
sezii
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Yes she is tugging just like that but she's doing it ALOT and will hold them there for a while somerimes
Strong words JLcribber. So glad it was you who said that.
I may of got crucified, but do share your feelings on this.
A lot more tact used here! But does make a valid point.
It has been a pleasure reading some very good comments, and valid thoughts on keeping birds flighted.
And now my bit.
There are a number of reasons birds should have some flight time = unclipped.
One: And one I have dealt with is atrophied muscles. This one can be very hard for them to recover from.
I admit this situation is seen more in older birds.
One time clip after they have fully weaned should not impact and recovery should be complete.
Two: Is lost confidence. Again I have been down this road and it is a long haul working with them to restore.
Three: Clipping introduces new dangers. (Depending on bird and clip). From the research I did, I found that most keel bone accident damage was to clipped birds.
Four, Birds need a full set of flights to come into land well. All too often I read this comment.
Only clip BLAH! BLAH! So they cannot get lift and can glide into land (safely). Do these people not look at videos of how birds fly and land. It is called coming in at speed and feathering the air to cause a stall. (Come to a stand still, while still flying. Try that with clipped wings!
Five, Both flighted and clipped can and do escape. If tame and flighted the chances of recovery are good.
Clipped not so.
Six: Birds need to fly to get a full cardiovascular work out.
Seven: A flying bird is more likely to have a good appetite.
Seven: Flighted birds seem to be more active and healthy.
Eight: A clipped bird is more likely to have behavior issues. I.E. Plucking, barbering, self mutilation.
Yes I know there are other things that could also cause this.
And now my bit.
There are a number of reasons birds should have some flight time = unclipped.
One: And one I have dealt with is atrophied muscles. This one can be very hard for them to recover from.
I admit this situation is seen more in older birds.
One time clip after they have fully weaned should not impact and recovery should be complete.
Two: Is lost confidence. Again I have been down this road and it is a long haul working with them to restore.
Three: Clipping introduces new dangers. (Depending on bird and clip). From the research I did, I found that most keel bone accident damage was to clipped birds.
Four, Birds need a full set of flights to come into land well. All too often I read this comment.
Only clip BLAH! BLAH! So they cannot get lift and can glide into land (safely). Do these people not look at videos of how birds fly and land. It is called coming in at speed and feathering the air to cause a stall. (Come to a stand still, while still flying. Try that with clipped wings!
Five, Both flighted and clipped can and do escape. If tame and flighted the chances of recovery are good.
Clipped not so.
Six: Birds need to fly to get a full cardiovascular work out.
Seven: A flying bird is more likely to have a good appetite.
Seven: Flighted birds seem to be more active and healthy.
Eight: A clipped bird is more likely to have behavior issues. I.E. Plucking, barbering, self mutilation.
Yes I know there are other things that could also cause this.
metalstitcher
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The only thing I wasn't ready for was Gracie using my hair for a break stop as she flies by me on her way to catch up with me.
I stayed away from the reasons given by people mostly.
But two that really do get me.
Clipping to tame.
This is so wrong.
Personal choice.
I find it hard to believe, any bird would choose to be handicapped. That is the one who should have the personal choice. Not the owner.
But two that really do get me.
Clipping to tame.
This is so wrong.
Personal choice.
I find it hard to believe, any bird would choose to be handicapped. That is the one who should have the personal choice. Not the owner.
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Another thing worth mentioning is the false analogy of "clipping feathers is just like clipping nails, they grow back".
I'm not a flight expert, but I got into birds because they're actual dinosaurs (coelurosaurs, group that includes T.rex and Velociraptor, excludes Allosaurus) and I've been passionate about dinosaurs since I was 3 years old. I am 29 now. So dinosaur evolution is an area of interest to me. And when looking at how many of the features evolved in conjunction with the emergence of flight feathers.... I gotta say that there's really no actual analog of flight feathers in mammals. Closest thing I can think of is the membrane of bats in terms of analogy.
Yes, they're dead keratinous integuments that regrow like hair or nails do. But flight feathers -- not down feathers -- have shaped the evolution of pennaraptoran dinosaurs for roughly 170 million years (we haven't found one this old yet, but we know they must have diverged then based on what dinosaurs are closely related, appeared around that time, but don't have flight feathers). Pennaraptora are all dinosaurs with pennaceous feathers (Velociraptor, Microraptor, modern birds, not T.rex). The reduction of their tail, lightening of their heads, increase in cognitive capacity and higher sensory functioning, digestion (frequency of pooping), their flight-or-fight response, wrist flexibility (folding wings -- this was an increasing trend we saw in theropod dinosaurs long before the first birds appeared, but bird took that ability to an extreme), digit reduction, etc. Have all evolved as a consequence of, or in conjunction with, their ability to learn to fly. Granted, flight isn't the reason neornithes (the branch of dinosaurs all modern birds belong to) were the only ones to survive the extinction event 66 million years ago. It may have actually had something to do with reproduction, because no other branch closely related to neornithes survived. But it's still an incredibly central part in terms of selection pressure in birds. Of course, some birds secondarily evolved flightlesness. But these weren't just clipped from one day to the next. This was a consequence of generations of adaption.
Their entire evolution depended so much on their ability to fly. They serve such a primary purpose of locomotion that you can't just expect to remove their ability to fly and think it couldn't massively impact their life in some way. A shaved dog may be disadvantaged too, but it can still move the way its entire body intends it to move. A parrot? No way.
And yeah, I'm trying to avoid making an appeal to nature here. My point isn't "bird flight is natural, therefore good". More, it's so fundamental to their entire functioning, that you can't just expect to deprive them of that without any secondary consequences. I think a much closer analogy to wing-clipping is a lobotomy in humans, in how our brains impact and define our functioning.
I'm not trying to show off what I know about dinosaurs or bird ancestors here. Just providing context to the importance in the emergence of flight and flight-feathers.
I'm not a flight expert, but I got into birds because they're actual dinosaurs (coelurosaurs, group that includes T.rex and Velociraptor, excludes Allosaurus) and I've been passionate about dinosaurs since I was 3 years old. I am 29 now. So dinosaur evolution is an area of interest to me. And when looking at how many of the features evolved in conjunction with the emergence of flight feathers.... I gotta say that there's really no actual analog of flight feathers in mammals. Closest thing I can think of is the membrane of bats in terms of analogy.
Yes, they're dead keratinous integuments that regrow like hair or nails do. But flight feathers -- not down feathers -- have shaped the evolution of pennaraptoran dinosaurs for roughly 170 million years (we haven't found one this old yet, but we know they must have diverged then based on what dinosaurs are closely related, appeared around that time, but don't have flight feathers). Pennaraptora are all dinosaurs with pennaceous feathers (Velociraptor, Microraptor, modern birds, not T.rex). The reduction of their tail, lightening of their heads, increase in cognitive capacity and higher sensory functioning, digestion (frequency of pooping), their flight-or-fight response, wrist flexibility (folding wings -- this was an increasing trend we saw in theropod dinosaurs long before the first birds appeared, but bird took that ability to an extreme), digit reduction, etc. Have all evolved as a consequence of, or in conjunction with, their ability to learn to fly. Granted, flight isn't the reason neornithes (the branch of dinosaurs all modern birds belong to) were the only ones to survive the extinction event 66 million years ago. It may have actually had something to do with reproduction, because no other branch closely related to neornithes survived. But it's still an incredibly central part in terms of selection pressure in birds. Of course, some birds secondarily evolved flightlesness. But these weren't just clipped from one day to the next. This was a consequence of generations of adaption.
Their entire evolution depended so much on their ability to fly. They serve such a primary purpose of locomotion that you can't just expect to remove their ability to fly and think it couldn't massively impact their life in some way. A shaved dog may be disadvantaged too, but it can still move the way its entire body intends it to move. A parrot? No way.
And yeah, I'm trying to avoid making an appeal to nature here. My point isn't "bird flight is natural, therefore good". More, it's so fundamental to their entire functioning, that you can't just expect to deprive them of that without any secondary consequences. I think a much closer analogy to wing-clipping is a lobotomy in humans, in how our brains impact and define our functioning.
I'm not trying to show off what I know about dinosaurs or bird ancestors here. Just providing context to the importance in the emergence of flight and flight-feathers.
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I have to wear a sleep/shower cap half the time because Jenks loves loves loves my hair.
Unfortunately he gets caught in it to, hence the cap.We are against clipping and would only clip if it was medically necessary. We bird proof everything thing we can, our take is birds were made to fly why should we cut his wings to make our life easier. Instead we make the changes to ourselves and our environment to make things better for him not the other way around. This is just what we do and our opinion.
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metalstitcher
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Gracie is having a hard time using me for a break stop because I chopped my hair off. But she is getting use to it.
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If she is having issue trying to fly there are ways to fix this and they are good for her at the same time. Have her step up on a perch and take her above your head and bring her down with enough speed to get her to flap her wings. Keep on doing this for awhile and see how she does going from a short distance and just work up from there. I have a little guy who is a terrible flyer and I do this with him all the time to help him with his wing strength.
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This was how I got Chirp to start, I got him to step on my finger and we'd go up and down. Then once he got good at that, I started sort of "launching" him forwards, maybe about a foot off the ground. So then over time we moved on to bigger and better things and now he's a pro. He can even fly up the stairs in our cape-cod style house! And this is from a bird that (I suspect) was probably clipped as a baby and never learned how to fly.
sezii
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How long does it take for flight feathers to come in her tail feathers are coming in very nice but it doesn't seem like her flight feathers are growing at all and I've had her for 2 months
Mizzely
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2 to 12 months to regain flight
I think when you first get your bird it's ok to trim their wings for training but then I think they should be able to fly it's just natural for them to be able to fly
sezii
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I want her to fly she came clipped and yes its very frustrating for her not to be able to fly right now that's why I'm wanting them to grow in, it just doesn't seem like they are growing out at all. her tail feathers are growing very well in a month (we had an oopsie where our puppy wanted to say hi when she fluttered off her cage to the floor and pulled out 3 tail feathers) but her flight feathers don't appear to be growing at all in 2 months so I was just curious as to how long it will take for them to come in. thank you for the time line and 12 months will be agonizing for me and my baby I'm very anxious to get her flying asap
