• Welcome to Avian Avenue! To view our forum with less advertisments please register with us.
    Memberships are free and it will just take a moment. Click here

Painful pluckers?

mandymmr

Walking the driveway
Avenue Veteran
Joined
3/23/10
Messages
262
Who here has pluckers that screech in pain when they pluck? My girl has tons of toys, chewing wood jocks to preening toys. She also has foot toys, shredding items. You name it. Yet she still plucks 'painfully. This is obviously not going to stop as it's behavior now unless I sedate her. I hate using the meds cause she just sits comatose like. She isn't her happy, singing, talkative self. It's only 2-4 times a day I hear the pain screech. Should I just be ok with this part & know all her needs are met?
 

ode.to.parrots

Rollerblading along the road
Avenue Veteran
Joined
11/20/16
Messages
1,440
Location
New Jersey
Real Name
Cary
Seeing your beloved bird pluck is so disheartening. :( My cockatiel Indy first started plucking when he was very sick with fatty liver disease. He'd plucked his whole back and chest. A year and another vet visit and his liver has recovered, and most of his feathers have grown back, but maybe two or three times a day he'll pluck, and he usually screeches in pain when he does. :( The vet thinks it may be either hormone related or habit related. I can't help but wonder if it is for attention, since he doesn't ever seem to pluck when we are away from home - just when we are in the room with him. He has a ton of toys that he LOVES to destroy, so it doesn't seem to be boredom. But I am not sure. I've been thinking I need to keep a log or something of every time I see him pluck to see if there is a pattern.

What species is your bird? How long have you had her? Have you visited an avian vet since she started plucking? In many cases, plucking can be a sign of illness. That's how Indy started plucking.

Edit: You also mentioned giving her meds. What kind of meds were these? I've used Avi calm for my birds, and it seems to help at least a little bit while still allowing my birds to act like themselves.
 
Last edited:

JLcribber

@cockatoojohn
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Shutterbugs' Best
Avenue Concierge
Joined
10/16/09
Messages
22,620
Location
Alberta, Canada
Real Name
John
Plucking is a very complicated issue and there is no easy answer. I know you think her needs are getting met but really they aren't. Don't take this the wrong way Mandy. We all do the very best we can but in reality it's pretty lacking to what they really need. Living in captivity is the root cause.

Preening is a natural and hard wired instinct. Plucking is an exaggeration of that behavior and if not dealt with quickly becomes a habit much like chewing your fingernails. As a result of nervousness. The feather picking is a stress coping mechanism. There is an endorphin rush from pulling the feather and relieving the irritation which is a reward. Much like scratching an itch. The pain itself might even be reinforcing. When a feather is pulled, there is about a 2 week cycle before the new feather starts to stick out of the skin. The bird may not pluck for 2 weeks and then start again. This is a bad cycle. Don't make a fuss over plucked feathers. That is also a reinforcer. Once it's habitual it will always be a problem.

What people often describe as a 'parrot behavior problem' is actually the result of a bird's natural behavior taking place in an unnatural environment. Flying miles a day; loud vocalizations, foraging for food, chewing and destroying wood and trees, and defending territories are perfectly normal bird behaviors in the wild, but unwelcome in the average home. So it's actually a 'people problem,' fueled by people's unrealistic expectations of a parrot's basic nature." Their needs can not be met in captivity. The larger and more intelligent the parrot is the more exaggerated the problems seem to be.

One of the absolutely best things anyone can do to really help their large parrot is to make them fly. Fly long. Fly hard. Easier said than done.
 
Last edited:

JLcribber

@cockatoojohn
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Shutterbugs' Best
Avenue Concierge
Joined
10/16/09
Messages
22,620
Location
Alberta, Canada
Real Name
John
For anyone with a plucker.

My mantra is that a solitary bird is a lonely bird no matter what species it is. They are meant at a minimum to live in pairs and ideally in a "flock". To keep a solitary bird is cruel deprivation.

If there is no medical issue. The ultimate cause for plucking is stress from having to live in captivity and more so in a cage. It does not need to be any one specific stress although it can be but rather an accumulation of all the small stresses that the bird must live with. We may not recognize these things as stress but the bird most certainly does. Parrots are designed and programmed to fly hundreds of miles per day. To forage and work for their food. To have free will to decide where to go, when to go and who to go with. Making them spend time in a cage which is only a few steps in any direction even in a large cage is a huge stress factor. When the stress builds to the breaking point, that is when problem behaviors like plucking and screaming begin to show themselves. If our bird is plucking and there is no medical reason for it then it's time to start thinking outside the box, literally and start to provide a more natural way of living so they can move, explore and forage so they get that stimulation. A busy beak does not have time to pluck. Changing the way they live, sacrificing some real space and providing a large secure area where they can be the birds they are as much as possible will go a long ways to stopping the behavior.
 

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,902
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
For anyone with a plucker.


While I'm in 100% agreeance John I PUSH AND PUSH medical issues before labeling behavioral issues. Calling boredom or stress has become a catch all, some vets rarely go through thorough diagnostics in evaluating these birds. Do you know I have four FDB, in some shape or fashion... All four have or had a medical condition that I know or believe lead to the problem. Two of the four I highly doubt the average bird owner would have noticed or checked for. :(

Now I will say one of my FDB birds has turned his barbering into a behavioral problem. I will also own the fact that it IS my fault. Even someone that works with and teaches parrots for a living found it pretty much impossible to ignore the behavior and not reinforce it. I'll spend my life attempting to unteach it. :)
 

JLcribber

@cockatoojohn
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Shutterbugs' Best
Avenue Concierge
Joined
10/16/09
Messages
22,620
Location
Alberta, Canada
Real Name
John
While I'm in 100% agreeance John I PUSH AND PUSH medical issues before labeling behavioral issues
Absolutely. Always the first course of action.

I also agree that many vets are just like human doctors. They are more concerned with the number of clients they can book and the fees they can charge than doing any real investigation or healing.
 

Featheredfuffs

Sprinting down the street
Avenue Veteran
Joined
4/30/17
Messages
373
Real Name
Pearl
For anyone with a plucker.

My mantra is that a solitary bird is a lonely bird no matter what species it is. They are meant at a minimum to live in pairs and ideally in a "flock". To keep a solitary bird is cruel deprivation.

If there is no medical issue. The ultimate cause for plucking is stress from having to live in captivity and more so in a cage. It does not need to be any one specific stress although it can be but rather an accumulation of all the small stresses that the bird must live with. We may not recognize these things as stress but the bird most certainly does. Parrots are designed and programmed to fly hundreds of miles per day. To forage and work for their food. To have free will to decide where to go, when to go and who to go with. Making them spend time in a cage which is only a few steps in any direction even in a large cage is a huge stress factor. When the stress builds to the breaking point, that is when problem behaviors like plucking and screaming begin to show themselves. If our bird is plucking and there is no medical reason for it then it's time to start thinking outside the box, literally and start to provide a more natural way of living so they can move, explore and forage so they get that stimulation. A busy beak does not have time to pluck. Changing the way they live, sacrificing some real space and providing a large secure area where they can be the birds they are as much as possible will go a long ways to stopping the behavior.

I totally agree with this. I'm a wildlife rehabiitator, and there are many cases each year where someone thinks having an exotic pet (ex. a baby squirrel, opossum, or raccoon), is "cool", only to release them in to the wild towards certain doom when they reach their hormonal "teen" stage, when the animal starts destroying their house and being generally wild. It is my personal belief that most exotic animals should not be kept in captivity, and if so you must do a LOT of research. This goes for the more commonly kept species too. Hamsters in the wild have large territories relative to their body size and in the wild spend their days being extremely active. How many people keep them in small tanks with only a running wheel for enrichment?



I recall a particularly heartbreaking case where a crow was "attacking" people and chasing them down the street. A wildlife rehabilitor was called to capture and relocate the animal, and it was soon learned that the crow was an illegal pet, heavily imprinted on humans, and had been released before the before the poor baby was even off hand feedings. The poor crow therefore was starving and was desperate enough to fly to strangers on the street begging for food. It was extremely lucky that a rehabber was called and not local animal control, which usually euthanizes such "problem" animals on arrival:sad1:
 
Last edited:

ode.to.parrots

Rollerblading along the road
Avenue Veteran
Joined
11/20/16
Messages
1,440
Location
New Jersey
Real Name
Cary
I have read a lot of articles about feather plucking, but this one is definitely the most helpful resource I have found yet!!! Thank you so, so much!

Looks like Indy may need another trip to the vet in order to figure this out. I'll be better prepared to inquire about specific tests thanks to this article.
 

Macawnutz

Seriously Nutz!
Super Administrator
Vendor
Avenue Veteran
Celebirdy of the Month
Mayor of the Avenue
Avenue Spotlight Award
Joined
10/21/11
Messages
32,902
Location
Wisconsin
Real Name
Sarah
Absolutely. Always the first course of action.

I also agree that many vets are just like human doctors. They are more concerned with the number of clients they can book and the fees they can charge than doing any real investigation or healing.


More often I feel it's a money issue. Testing for zinc, asper, thyroid tests.... all very expensive and often inconclusive without repeat testing. Even common bacterial and fungal issues are missed without repeat testing. I think the vets shy away from the expensive diagnostics if they are unsure.


I have read a lot of articles about feather plucking, but this one is definitely the most helpful resource I have found yet!!! Thank you so, so much!

Looks like Indy may need another trip to the vet in order to figure this out. I'll be better prepared to inquire about specific tests thanks to this article.


I love the questions it asks the owners. We know our birds better than any vet. I went in armed with all the answers to every question. It was very helpful to my vets.
 

ode.to.parrots

Rollerblading along the road
Avenue Veteran
Joined
11/20/16
Messages
1,440
Location
New Jersey
Real Name
Cary
I love the questions it asks the owners. We know our birds better than any vet. I went in armed with all the answers to every question. It was very helpful to my vets.
I'm thinking I will create a document with all of those questions and type up my own responses. Then I can print them out and bring them with me to the vet.

I think first I'll start journaling Indy's plucking. That will help me and the vet have a better idea of where to start.
 

mandymmr

Walking the driveway
Avenue Veteran
Joined
3/23/10
Messages
262
For the record, I got Saga this way (plucker). I'm just trying to figure out if this is just the new normal. I got her in May. I have no idea of her age or sex. Her vet Apts all come back good.
 
Top