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  • This forum is for advice about initial treatment given to your injured/sick bird until a qualified avian veterinarian is available.
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Urgent Help! I am out of options..

midsummermagic

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I apologize for any animosity this discussion may have generated. I am alone dealing with this and my little friend. It is very emotional.

Just got back from my regular vet. I did research board certified avian vets in my area. Other than Dr. Nemetz they are an hour and a half away. Not out of the question.. but I just went to my regular vet because he won't be there again until Friday. There is something comforting about speaking with a vet you have known a while when you are going through this alone. If I get the money together for a barium test and, if needed, laser surgery then I will make the trek out to see Janet Berens. I don't want to deal with Dr. Nemetz rudeness. My only option at the moment is to launch a GoFundMe campaign. I have to save my money for the summer when business is slow or I won't have a roof over my head.

After a lengthy discussion with Dr. Chapman we agreed it's best to keep off all medicine for now. The throat plaques are there but tolerable. He doesn't want to put my bird under anethesia to pull them out until they get larger. We don't know what causes them or what they are. We had them cultured.. but I can't remember the results off hand. We also agreed to keep boosting his body with the Rx for Pets supplements and maybe DMT as well as a balanced array of whole foods. I put him back on pellets and will give him part pellets and part baby food. Of course when I was at the vets explaining all these weird scant liquidy droppings Buddy plopped out a nice big fat normal poo, Lol. (Just chop my head off! ;)

As for additional supplements and herbs he said there is just very limited research on birds because there is no money supporting the research. That's why they can't recommend anything. It's all hearsay, though not saying they don't work or help. We discussed Bee Propolis.. my top choice for trying to keep the (likely) papillomas from growing as fast. He said it probably won't hurt my bird and just to watch him carefully. I only want to choose one. My other contender is Curcumin (an isolated form of Tumeric). And maybe if I see a lot of straining with bowel movements.. pain.. then coat the GI tract with some Slippery Elm tea at a different time.

Other than that he said my bird doesn't act like a sick bird.

So what do you think? Curcumin or Bee Propolis? Any thoughts?
Also, do you think Slippery Elm helps with painful bowel movements and diarrhea/upset digestive system?

Many thanx if you are still here. (((*.*)))
 
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Macawnutz

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Also, do you think Slippery Elm helps with painful bowel movements and diarrhea/upset digestive system?

Many thanx if you are still here. (((*.*)))


That is exactly what it does. :D

mix 1 tsp to 4 tsp warm water, feed about 1 tsp
 

midsummermagic

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Thank you Tyrion. I just joined the group on Facebook

Karen256 & Camelotshadow - I do have probiotics. I did the list off the top of my head. I also have Harrison's enzyme. The probiotics didn't reduce the diarrhea when I was giving it to him, but who knows, it might work now. I think the Exact formula has probiotics, too.
 

Tyrion

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Thank you Tyrion. I just joined the group on Facebook

.
That's great Im sure Jason will help you with diet being that's what he does all around the states ...the group is great and has helped me ...and like I said the teas are wonderful ...best of luck and tons of hugs :hug8:
 

midsummermagic

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Trying to figure out a ballpark range of what surgery for papilloma virus would cost so I can launch a reasonable GoFundMe campaign. Nobody will even give me a range of what to save for. I have no patience left in me. The secretary insisted it is impossible to give a range - not even a large one. Really irritated. Maybe irrational.. but it feels like she is just stubborn. I wouldn't be able to get an accurate price without testing anyways which I can't afford. Does anyone know what the average or range of cost it would be for this type of surgery? It doesn't have to be perfect.. just an idea cuz I have no clue. The surgeries on my dove were only $300-$400. But I doubt this is the case for Buddy.
 

Macawnutz

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painesgrey

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Trying to figure out a ballpark range of what surgery for papilloma virus would cost so I can launch a reasonable GoFundMe campaign. Nobody will even give me a range of what to save for. I have no patience left in me. The secretary insisted it is impossible to give a range - not even a large one. Really irritated. Maybe irrational.. but it feels like she is just stubborn. I wouldn't be able to get an accurate price without testing anyways which I can't afford. Does anyone know what the average or range of cost it would be for this type of surgery? It doesn't have to be perfect.. just an idea cuz I have no clue. The surgeries on my dove were only $300-$400. But I doubt this is the case for Buddy.

Secretaries tend to not give ballpark estimates on complicated cases - those are things vets must decide because there are so many things to take into account. Pre-op bloodwork, anesthetic, and post-op painkillers, medications/fluids, and monitoring are all things that have to be taken into account in addition to the surgery itself, and vary depending on species and complexity of the procedure. If the vet has licensed technicians to help with monitoring anesthesia or vitals, you'll be paying for their time too.

I would not be surprised if it cost several thousand, but I tend to be of the "expect the worst, hope for the best" camp. You could always set your goal far higher and then donate any excess to a local rescue or put it on a "charity tab" at your vet (if they have one). Vets sometimes have these to help pay for pro bono work.
 

midsummermagic

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I didn't really give him Harrison's. It said on the website it was for sick birds.. but didn't feel that comfortable giving it on top of everything else.

I wasn't planning on advertising my GoFundMe on this site. I just mentioned it as a part of my plan since people were wondering why I'm not going to any more vets. I think it is good people know it's out there. These vet bills are large for anyone. I didn't even post a link with it...
 

camelotshadow

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Gosh, $300 $400 for surgery was really cheap.

I have not had any pet surgery's since my German Shepherd got shot by police trespassing because they saw a ladder my father had put up the side of the back of the house. Poor dog was only protecting his home & lucky they missed as I guess he leaped in the air & got his foot or they would have killed him. He had to have his toe removed and it was almost $1000 in the 80's.

I'm sorry you can't get a figure out of a vet. I can understand how that might be hard to determine.

Which vet did you try?

I have been researching vets for myself in LA

Frank Lavac at Wilshire VCA. They have a hospital & do surgeries.
They are considered one of the best but it would take me about 3 hrs to get there by 3 buses plus an appointment & 3 hours home.

Janet Berens & Bruce Levine (both ABVP) is closer at W Valley Pet Clinic in Woodland Hills & 2 buses but about an hour away. This is the closest I can get to a ABVP vet.
They do say they do surgeries & with 2 avian vets you really can't get better expertise.
I think you said you were considering them.

Avian Surgery
A lot of info about surgery's. Says lasers are very expensive so vets have to pay for them some how & that adds to cost of surgery.

Maybe some members have had surgery's on there bird & can comment but all surgery's are different & not all vets charge the same for there services.
 

midsummermagic

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I thought she might have had a stuck egg and at that time had absolutely no give in my finances. Maybe the doctors took heart. Turned out to be a fatty tumor mass full of fluid and I would have it drained every three months. The second surgery she almost died from excessive bleeding that wouldn't stop. The late Dr. Pasco (loved him!) took her home and stayed up all night nursing her back to health. The tumor eventually solidified and couldn't be drained any more. She lived a total of 17 years (8 with the tumor). Miss her!

I reluctantly contacted Dr. Nemetz again. I could at least get prices since I paid for the visit. I'm not sure if I should chance my car to LA. I'm imagining it would be a few trips. I hate supporting people who bully. I may have to give him a second chance. I did mention that I was offended by his behavior.. eventually he sort of apologized.. I guess I shouldn't piss off the vet that might have to do surgery on my bird, but I couldn't help myself. He was really rude during my first visit with him. We'll see next time..
 

Ziggy Stardust

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You are very smart not to burn any bridges- esp. As you say you might need Dr. Nemetz sometime in future. I'm just praying that Buddy can be treated medically . Surgery is not only expensive but it takes a toll on birds even more so than us humans. Sending good thoughts and healing vibes and prayers to you and Buddy. You both deserve a break.
 

midsummermagic

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Raised enough money with my "unmentionable" to get new X-rays from the dreaded Dr. Nemetz. He is being nicer now that I talked to him about his behavior, lol. I will give him a second chance. He does seem to know what he's talking about. God knows I've been given plenty of second chances. Monday at 11am! So excited and thankful!
 

iamwhoiam

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Hope things go well on Mon.
 

camelotshadow

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Good Luck with Dr Nemetz. Looks like he's qualified. Hopefully you just caught him at an off day.
Does say he gives written estimates for surgery & hospitalization.

I see he recommends Dr Molnar in Calbassas. A member here uses them.
They are also on Ventura Blvd & reachable by same bus as Dr Berens more west so now I have 2
ABVP vets I can get to by 2 buses in about an hour! :dance4:
 

Macawnutz

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Good luck.
 

Catarina

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I've read that really hot chillis are used by breeders to keep the papilloma virus in check and keep it from growing. Since birds can't feel the heat and it brings good vitamins I supose it would be a win win situation.
If I remember correctly some parrot species are prone to having the virus and breeders of those species use habaneros as prevention medicine.
Good luck with everything
 

Glacier313

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Sending luck to you and your fid. Stay strong :sadhug2: Surgery can be quite dangerous, I hope that it isn't needed.
 

midsummermagic

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Thank you for your replies. I am grateful and hopefully haven't been too "sensitive" on this site. I apologize again if I have been. It's not my intention. It's another day of overwhelm of information. I am trying to hold hope. We see the doctor tomorrow. I hope he's the right Doctor. Doctors have differing viewpoints, too. Buddy is a champ. He's like, "Mom, don't worry. We'll get through this." He's a very smiley, happy, positive bird.

Took him for a walk to the natural food store and bought up the organic food isle. We will be eating healthy along with Harrison's non-colored food pellets (though someone pointed out the first three ingredients are no good.. So it will have to suffice for now until I find the best pelleted food and/or get better at finding a balanced diet that he/we will eat). He thought it was so funny to make loud beeping noises once I made it to the back of the store. OMG! So embarrassing!!!
 

Tyrion

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best of luck tomorrow :hug8:
 
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